Cap1 & CCA return

[car2403]

Hi sorry to jump in.

 

CCA'd Barclaycard last week on behalf of my sister (used her name, address etc) today she got a letter from them requesting her signature to authorise release of said documents.

 

I am correct in thinking they are trying it on arent i, they dont need her signature to request a CCA do they, i couldn't find it written anywhere?

 

If so i will write back and tell em to just send it out as it doesn't state anywhere that they need a signature.

 

Sytra

 

You shouldn't need to send them a "signature", as long as you've provided enough information to identify the customer/account in question.

 

Be careful here, as they may be asking for a signature so they can copy it on to a copy of an agreement. Some of these companies are this underhanded.

 

I know that the legal eagles on here, like tomterm8, always advise NEVER to sign anything, (ie, place your written signature on a document) as it's easily manipulated in software, like Photoshop.

 

Of course, they can argue that a signature is required as part of identifying/confirming identity, but I don't think there is legal precedent for this being the case.

[sytra]

I thought that they didnt really need one, they have her Acc number, Address (the one they always use) and name so cant see why they need a sig. i know when i did our NW credit card they didnt need one.

Sytra

[Peterbard]

Hi sorry to jump in.

 

CCA'd Barclaycard last week on behalf of my sister (used her name, address etc) today she got a letter from them requesting her signature to authorise release of said documents.

 

I am correct in thinking they are trying it on arent i, they dont need her signature to request a CCA do they, i couldn't find it written anywhere?

 

If so i will write back and tell em to just send it out as it doesn't state anywhere that they need a signature.

 

Sytra

 

Hi

I think that perhaps they may be right the request does say the debtor is requesting said information and i think if they were to give it to anyone else without consent they would fall foul of the Data Protection Act.

 

Regards

Peter

[sytra]

Thats fair enough but i have written to them in her name (signed digitally her name), using all her details (with her permission), she couldnt get on this site for some reason or she would have done it herself.

 

They shouldnt really have any reason to doubt the authenticity of the request as it was made from her address etc. think i may just get her to put some kind of squiggle on a piece of paper

 

According to barclaycard they said that to authorise release of the requested document they needed her to sign the request.

[hellhasnofury]

You could send a signature similar but markedly different.............wicked I Know:razz:

 

Hello Josie,

 

Yes that is a wicked thought, :o but necessary. I send all signatures now with a line through them, so I know I would recognise it again, should it be presented on a ca..

 

I have also printed off my own credit agreement template to give to my creditors stating that they give me money and I did not have to pay it back. Its that simple, especially with the template ones they have ??? reconstructed and sent to me.

[humbleman]

Hello Josie,

 

I have also printed off my own credit agreement template to give to my creditors stating that they give me money and I did not have to pay it back. Its that simple, especially with the template ones they have ??? reconstructed and sent to me.

 

WAY TO GO

[sytra]

Ok gonna send this off to BC on monday, do you think its alright?

 

Barclaycard

1234 Pavilion Drive

Northampton

NN4 1SG

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re Account Number: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

I Do not acknowledge any debt to your company

With reference to your letter requesting my signature, I have signed this request, please note that the time period for this agreement is running from my original request that being dated 29th October 2007 and delivered on 31st November 2007

 

I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77−79), I am entitled to receive a copy of my credit agreement on request. I have already enclosed a payment of £1.00 (chq no xxxxxx) which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act with my original request.

 

I understand a copy of my credit agreement should be supplied within 12 working days. (12 working days from date of delivery of my original request gives you till the 16th November 2007).

 

I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act, creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreement under these sections of the Act.

 

I look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

xxxxxx xxxxxxxx

I am goin to get her to sign in the grey box (using a subtle spelling mistake in her name), hopefully that way they cant easily scan anything, also she has not signed a new agreement in this name only her maiden name, so should spot it quite easily.

Think that will do?

Sytra

[un1boy]

My thoughts are that they don't need your sig - i've sent letters on behalf of people without siginng and got the response.

 

I would just do a completely different sig - if they question it, u know theyve got the orginal on file. if they dont and they send an agreement with the sig on it then i guess uve got a case of fraud against them!!

[Peterbard]

Hi Uni

 

That is really devious and i like it

 

 

Regards

Peter

[sytra]

We will get em, would love to catch em on fraud

[ian1969uk]

I do the same as Uni, any letter that I send to these companies has a completely different signature to my normal sig, so I'll know if they are ever stupid enough to commit fraud.

[Peterbard]

HI

Re reading my last post on APR I think it was a little confusing to say the least.

 

Interest as required by the act is a figure based on the repayment of the loan over the whole period expressed as a yearly rate.

 

APR is a method of indicating the total cost of the loan so that comparisons can be made on an even basis with other providers.

 

In the caseof interest the figure given is derived from the amount of interest paid on the loan divided by the total period it is paid over in years.

 

In the case of APR the interest is combined with the other charges for credit and included within the calculation. In addition the calculation has a mechanism that recognises the repayment intervals and adjusts the figure depending on the amount of benifit the creditor gets out of the advance made.

 

On a cash loan the benefit you receive from the money reduces as you repay the balance, so if you look at the loan that is repayed by equal installments, the total amount of benefit over the full term is about half of the total amount advanced .

 

To illustrate if you borrowed £100 over 1 year at 1% per month interest the total amount repaid would be about £106.5.

 

This is flat rate interest of 6.5%,however the APR reflects the amount of benefit that you receive from your money over the term and must be higher in order to show that this is only about half of what you borrowed so the APR for this would be 12.7% roughly twice the flat rate, in order to show this.

 

Now consider the same loan but repayable in one instalment at the end of the loan ( ie 106.5 at month 12). The flat rate interest would still be the same at 6.5% but this would be a much better deal for the debtor as he would have the full benefit of the loan over a longer period before he had to pay it back. The APR would reflect this and be the same as the flat rate at 6.5%.

 

 

Best regards

Peter

[un1boy]

Hi Uni

 

That is really devious and i like it

 

 

Regards

Peter

Hehe, I think it's the best and easiest way!!

[un1boy]

We will get em, would love to catch em on fraud

 

Well Sytra, all sorts of things are fraud, even robbery comes under the Fraud Act.

 

I am putting a fraud case together against a catalogue company who have catergorically told me that the have a legally enforcable agreement, once the sec 78 request came through, they sent an unsigned agreement.

 

This is fraud.

 

I have now replied, asking them to clarify the date the alleged areement was arhcived on their systems - if it is after my CCA request then I will call the Police straight away, because that is defo fraud.

 

If they say before, then I will do a ful DPA request to get the computerised time and date stamps. If the above turns out to be true, I'll call the Police.

 

If this was archived before tha account started then they don'thave a legally enforcable agreement and they have still committed fraud!

[un1boy]

I do do something completely different though - even if it's just my initials with a circle around them, haha!

[paulwlton]

Well Sytra, all sorts of things are fraud, even robbery comes under the Fraud Act.

 

I am putting a fraud case together against a catalogue company who have catergorically told me that the have a legally enforcable agreement, once the sec 78 request came through, they sent an unsigned agreement.

 

This is fraud.

 

I have now replied, asking them to clarify the date the alleged areement was arhcived on their systems - if it is after my CCA request then I will call the Police straight away, because that is defo fraud.

 

If they say before, then I will do a ful Data Protection Act request to get the computerised time and date stamps. If the above turns out to be true, I'll call the Police.

 

If this was archived before tha account started then they don'thave a legally enforcable agreement and they have still committed fraud!

 

I'm afraid trying to get the police on board is extremely difficult. I am talking form experience, they have the same attitude has TS.

 

Paul

[conar686]

I do do something completely different though - even if it's just my initials with a circle around them, haha!

 

Or make one up its easier and a lot of fun

 

Online Personal Signature Maker - MyLiveSignature - Free Perosnal Signature Generator

 

Rgds

 

MAC

[ncf355]

Hi Paul,

 

interesting one that

 

I'm toying with going for GE Money regards PPI charges (credit agreement shows clearly I turned down PPI, the entire box with the checkbox has been crossed out) and I know full well I did not agree by phone

 

So if they have taken monies without my express consent I'd say that fraud?

[paulwlton]

Hi Paul,

 

interesting one that

 

I'm toying with going for GE Money regards PPI charges (credit agreement shows clearly I turned down PPI, the entire box with the checkbox has been crossed out) and I know full well I did not agree by phone

 

So if they have taken monies without my express consent I'd say that fraud?

 

I think we all know that what the banks/finance company's are doing is bordering on Fraud, the problem is the police will not get involved as they see it has a civil matter. The Detective Inspector of my local economic crime unit (Fraud squad) came out to view my damning documents but concluded it wasn't in their remit to fully investigate the matter and suggested i take my dispute to the civil courts.

 

Paul

[Peterbard]

Hi Paul,

 

interesting one that

 

I'm toying with going for GE Money regards PPI charges (credit agreement shows clearly I turned down PPI, the entire box with the checkbox has been crossed out) and I know full well I did not agree by phone

 

So if they have taken monies without my express consent I'd say that fraud?

hI

Have the include your PPI payments within your total credit or is it in your total charge for credit.

 

Peter

[shane5408]

Hi Guys,

 

With regards to Fraud or misrepresentation, etc have a look at this thread

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/118065-application-form-fraud.html?highlight=fraud

 

Would appreciate your input as I will be researching it fully soon with some legal bods.

 

regards,

shane

[Having_A_Knightmare]

Hi all

 

Has anybody got any info regarding the T&C supplied on a Section 78(1) request.

 

I am sick of them replying saying under the copy docs regs 1983 section 7 they only have to supply the most varied T&C.

 

Has Anybody got the proof so I can write to them, or are they correct telling me this.

 

HAK

[un1boy]

I think we all know that what the banks/finance company's are doing is bordering on Fraud, the problem is the police will not get involved as they see it has a civil matter. The Detective Inspector of my local economic crime unit (Fraud squad) came out to view my damning documents but concluded it wasn't in their remit to fully investigate the matter and suggested i take my dispute to the civil courts.

 

Paul

 

The thing is Paul, any offence under the Fraud Act is a criminal offence and the Police are legally bound to investigate any and all criminal offences.

 

The difference with the CCA is that offences under it are dealt with by TS.

 

A memeber of my family is a serving police officer and told me that. He also said that the CPS would not want to take a case against any bank to court because the banks have too much money.

[pt2537]

HAK, i have a copy of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents)Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1557)

if you want i can email them to you

regards

paul

[HeatherMc]

Can anyone tell me if my ccas are ok please?

 

 

Thanks, Heather