After a CCJ what can a Creditor ACTUALLY DO

[jimbo45]

Hi there

Say you aren't a property owner so no Charging Order is possible.

What can a creditor do AFTER a CCJ is issued and you can't pay it.

 

AFAIK all they can do is to make you Bankrupt -- but that will cost THEM money and if you don't have much money anyway what sort of threat / inconvenience is it really.

 

The only possible downside is that your "credit Rating" will be shot to pieces -- but if you've already got as far as CCJ stage you are unlikely to have much if any money available anyway so who cares.

 

If you have no or irregular income then they can't attach any and if you are on benefits they wouldn't get more than 1GBP a month if that - Benefits aren't intended to be used for paying off creditors.

 

So what's the downside after a CCJ of just telling the DCA etc to "Go and Take a Hike" leaving THEM with the bill.

 

It seems to me if you DON'T own property you are already a Winner in this scenario.

 

It seems that the DCA's win out because people are so SCARED of what might be on their Credit file -- Who really gives a toss if you can manage WITHOUT CREDIT and aren't going to buy a house.

 

I get the impression that the whole DCA industry is full of LIES, INTIMIDATIONS, AND EMPTY THREATS.

 

Of course if you OWN property it unfortunately is another ballgame with the DISGUSTING charging order route available these days.

 

Cheers

jimbo

Edited January 31, 2010 by jimbo45

[cerberusalert]

See; Enforcing judgment

 

There are several things they can do including attachment of earnings, removal of goods etc.

[jimbo45]

Hi there

But as I've said if you have irregular or no income - that route won't be any good and they can't remove goods that aren't yours in any case - you've assigned the ownership to someone else --say a collegue - and even if they did it's unlikely EVER to repay more than a small fraction of the outstanding balance.

 

Also in some cases it might even be a cheap way of getting your Flat cleared of rubbish.

 

Freezing a Bank account also won't work as people will presumably have made other types of arrangements BEFORE CCJ. There probably won't be much money in it either if a debtor has got as far as CCJ stage anyway.

 

 

So I can't see any realistic way of enforcement whatever the CCJ says.

 

Cheers

jimbo

Edited January 31, 2010 by jimbo45

[PriorityOne]

My experience of CCJs in a "past life" are.... that companies will probably go down the bailiff route.

 

If you don't own property or you do, but there's heaps of negative equity (as in my case at that time), then a CO is pointless. If you have no income, then an A of E is pointless... which only leaves bailiffs. Having said that, if you don't open the door and ensure that they have no access through open windows, there's not much bailiffs can do either. If you own a car however, then you'd need to make sure that it's parked somewhere else all the time.

 

I had several bailiff scenarios many, many years ago... one was in relation to Poll Tax, but I cannot remember what the others were for or even if they were mine; they could have been the ex's CCJs. Anyhow, the bailiffs couldn't get access to the house and so had no choice but to leave, so the CCJs were eventually left to gather dust somewhere...

 

The only exception to this was Poll Tax which became linked to DWP (DSS in those days).... so when I escaped the ex and claimed Benefits as a lone parent, I had a letter to say DSS would be deducting £2.55 a week towards this until it was cleared. The council did write to demand more, but I wrote back and said they were already getting the highest weekly amount that was permitted as a deduction from Benefits.... and to b*gger off.

 

It took about 6 years to clear...

 

Not a nice way to live I must add, but sometimes our choices in life are worn away. I eventually moved out of the area completely and have not connected myself to that "other life" since that time. That means that the CRAs were none the wiser to it.... and the link between addresses was never established ....

Edited January 31, 2010 by PriorityOne

[jimbo45]

Hi there

That's what I thought.

 

So if you are really stuck NEVER worry and tell them to "other word for urination - OFF".

 

Nice to see THEM lumbered with the costs as well.

 

Sometimes through no fault of your own you CAN get into debt -- and since these DCA's etc are almost NEVER sympathetic and always try and add HUGE charges on to those who can LEAST afford to pay them I would take this option and NOT PAY THEM ANYTHING- and I wouldn't feel in the slightest bit guilty either.

 

Property owners is another issue of course.

 

Note also that YOU CAN'T GO TO PRISON FOR CIVIL DEBT.

 

I've seen posts on the forum by people worried sick about being sent to prison --you CAN'T for civil debt.

 

So when dealing with DCA's its usually by scare tactics that they cajole people into coughing up something.

 

Only a COURT can decide how much -- IMO CCJ's with a Judgement forthwith are in 99% of cases a total waste of time for non property owners because most people certainly CAN'T pay the full amount.

 

If you own property then of course there's the CO route but if you don't then just tell them to **** Off.

 

Will save you no end of grief if you HAVEN'T got the money to pay these vermin.

 

Also that totally DISGUSTING Auto court at Northampton is a TERRIBLE way since stuff can be rushed so fast through it (and online) that as a defendant - especially if you don't have legal training - you really don't get a lot of time to mount a defence -- and that's what these POND LIFE's count on.

 

Cheers

jimbo.

[PriorityOne]

Jimbo... please remember that I moved out of the area and never linked myself to it ever again. If you're in the same place, your way forward may be more complicated. It's not nice to live with one eye over your shoulder all the time... but I did survive the experience, yes.

[loopinlouie]

I found lately whent the dcas say are you making a payment today and I reply no, they start their speal about court, I reply thank you. Which knocks them off their pearch a little and say I would be grateful if you would make me bankrupt at the same time. They then retort we wont pay for that I and reply you wont take me to court either, you told me last time:D

 

Thing is dca working for bank, bank told me not going to court but will pass to dca on their behalf. I ask is dca in ownership of account or on behalf bank, on behalf they reply and I say bank has said no court, knocks their patter a bit.

 

I get very upset over the letters I cant help it and have to remind myself I have nothing of value, my house in council and the bank already asked me those questions and responded we wont take you to court, so have to tell myself to calm down.

 

I do feel they are naughty passing it to dcas who threaten action the bank have no intention of carrying out, thought that was against the rules.

 

Banks said they realise the dcas will threaten but as they hold the account not to worry. conversations taped.

[jimbo45]

Hi there

as I said it's all "WIND and **SS" (Old Yorkshire saying I believe) - from DCA's.

 

They CAN'T DO ANYTHING -- and even if they do go to COURT it's still GAME OVER as they won't get any money.

 

So IF you DON'T own your own house, don't have much money in the Bank and goods of not much value in the property just let them do "Their thing" and forget them.

 

Saves a LOT of worry, distress etc etc.

 

I believe the technical name for this type of solution is now called "Stress Reduction".

 

NEVER EVER get sleepless nights because of DCA's.

 

If you CAN'T pay you CAN'T pay and that's the end of it --no if's, buts or anything else -- until they bring back "The Workhouse" or "The Poor Laws" they can't get money if you don't have any.

 

As the "Meerkats" commercials say on TV "SEEMPLEES"

 

Now owning property makes playing with DCA's a whole other ballgame -- but at least we can kill stone dead 80% of their business.

 

If you DON'T have money -- don't worry either about a Credit rating either. -- if and when you get debt free you really won't want credit again after going through CCJ's and this sort of stuff.

 

SO YOU are in control -- and what else can they do as you know their threatograms aren't even fit for The Loo.

 

Motto for 2010 -- Keep the blood pressure down and Bankrupt the DCA's.

 

For property owners this advice is NOT the best route as they CAN and WILL go for Charging Orders unfortunately -- this is one of those rare cases where it makes sense NOT to be a property owner.

 

Cheers

jimbo

Edited January 31, 2010 by jimbo45

[PriorityOne]

 

For property owners this advice is NOT the best route as they CAN and WILL go for Charging Orders unfortunately -- this is one of those rare cases where it makes sense NOT to be a property owner.

 

Cheers

jimbo

 

They can try....

[themagician]

jimbo!

nice down to earth thread cheers!

they cant put you against a wall and shoot you.

carter would try but he,d end up using rubber bullets " allegedley"

not such a clever man after all.

Edited February 1, 2010 by themagcian

[jimbo45]

Hi there

Perhaps we should start a new option called "Stress Management".

 

Trouble is so many people are scared out of their wits by Courts, DCA's etc etc.

 

The first thing to realize is that lots of people get into debt - and not through their own fault.

 

The next thing is that a CCJ isn't the worst thing ever to happen to you -- as I've pointed out ONLY a COURT can make you pay money and even a COURT can't make you pay any if you don't have any.

 

So if you are in a position where you really can't pay anything - just ignore the whole kybosh of DCA'S, threatograms and even Court summonses.

 

(Again NOT FOR PROPERTY OWNERS).

 

Even a Bailiff doesn't have to be let in and for the sort of debts we see on these Forums - typically 5,000 GBP'ish no Bailiff is going to collect items that will be worth ANYTHING near that amount at public auction

 

So I'd just say to DCA's etc -- I DON'T HAVE ANY MONEY - SO DO YOUR COURT THING IF YOU HAVE TO AND NOW GO AND TAKE A HIKE.

 

There's SIMPLY NOTHING MORE THEY CAN DO.

 

Debt will have to be one of those "Uncollectable" one's that presumably the Banks still have mountains of.

 

I know Sols etc will probably say Not good advice here -- it will effect Credit rating etc -- but who really cares about a Credit rating if you are already in mountains of debt.

 

 

So go and have a stiff drink and forget about any more "threatograms" etc.

 

Life is too important to get sleepless nights worrying about scuzzy slimebag DCA'S.

 

Cheers

jimbo.

Edited February 1, 2010 by jimbo45

[hatesdebt]

Go for it Jimbo....

 

You always cheer me up.....

 

Give hell to the ****....

[discod]

So if a bailiff turns up he cannot take any thing within the house unless he has official court papers saying he can is that right?

Having problems with Bryan Carter for a debt that isnt even mine,is in anothers name (someone who stays here when hes off work 300 miles away)hes not on my rent book,not on electoral role but because he owes MoneyShop 280 (plus their costs)and wasnt here to fill out what i presume was a CCJ (blue forms?)they are sending letters with warrant numbers and a ''we are sending the bailiffs round''.Im realy stressing over this

[hatesdebt]

They can only make a "peaceful entry". DONT let them in.

Keep doors and windows shut / locked. They ARE allowed to walk in through an unlocked door/ window.

 

They can only force entry if they have a signed court warrant and generally courts don't like signing these.....

[jimbo45]

They can only make a "peaceful entry". DONT let them in.

Keep doors and windows shut / locked. They ARE allowed to walk in through an unlocked door/ window.

 

They can only force entry if they have a signed court warrant and generally courts don't like signing these.....

 

Hi there

even if it DID get to that stage - just "give away" anything remotely valuable to a collegaue etc for a few days until it's blown over -- a Bailiff CAN'T TAKE WHAT DOESN'T BELONG TO YOU - OTHER PEOPLE AREN'T FORCED TO PAY YOUR DEBTS.

 

I'd get a "parachute" Bank account as well preferably "Off shore".

 

I'd imagine - apart from easily hidden jewellery and smallish Electronics a typical "Bailiff's Haul" might only fetch at most 500 GBP at a public auction.

 

If you get off paying say 6,000 GBP or so in my book this would be a BARGAIN.

 

In any case the **** can't seize necessary furniture (beds, chairs etc) or equipment you need for work such as a computer.

 

I'm not really sure why Bailiff's are EVER used to seize domestic property for CCJ defaults as most of the people who can't pay a CCJ are unlikely to have a lot of stuff of significant value that would be "seizable".

 

Baliff's can be used to seize BUSINESS assets or threaten people into paying Council Tax arrears or for evictions after house re-posessions but it's probably more trouble than its worth for a bailiff to collect a few hundred quids worth of second hand furniture etc in settlement of a large CCJ.

 

The whole system is totally CACKHANDED.

 

If a DCA said upfront now look I've bought your 6,000 GBP debt for 60 GBP (they probably got it for a lot less than that) then I'd let them have their percentage and give them 100 GBP -- in fact I could even be a bit generous -- I'm in a good mood -- Manchester Utd won yesterday-- and offer them 120 GBP.

 

However with their LYING, CHEATING, THREATENING tactics my policy would be FOR NON PROPERTY OWNERS to NEVER EVER PAY A DCA anything even if they actually do get a CCJ.

 

 

Cheers

jimbo

[hatesdebt]

Nice one Jimbo and I totally agree.

 

I'm working away for a couple of days now, so please keep up the good work with advice against these **** dca's and bailiff's.....

[Jaws75]

good thread, i'll drink to the downfall of these scumbags!

[fuzzybobble]

Been trying to explain all this to a friend of mine.

 

Here is her current suituation.....

 

She works in a min wage full time job, has a car worth around £700 and can't travel to work without it, as public transport doesn't run when she needs to get to work on the early shifts, and when on late shifts, no buses run when she needs to get home.

 

She lives with her parents, and her only assets are clothes, a 2 year old laptop and a tv. She has a savings account with about £900 in it, with a different bank the one her wages are paid into.

 

So far she's not paid any DCA anything for almost 3 year now. Most are unenforceable for one reason or another. Only one I can see is enforceable, but she has no knowledge of a default notice when they terminated the agreement.

 

What happens if she ends up with a CCJ due to not knowing about it, or ignoring the court papers? Is the 3 years of not aknowedging the debt reset, or can she still claim Statute Barred in 3 years time? Also how stuffed would they be regarding enforcing the CCJ with someone in her situation?

[PriorityOne]

 

What happens if she ends up with a CCJ due to not knowing about it, or ignoring the court papers? Is the 3 years of not aknowedging the debt reset, or can she still claim Statute Barred in 3 years time? Also how stuffed would they be regarding enforcing the CCJ with someone in her situation?

 

If she gets a CCJ without knowing about it, she can have it set aside. If she ignores the court papers, she'll get a CCJ by default (undefended by her).

 

In theory a CCJ will stand until it's paid, so being stat-barred won't apply.... however, a DCA would have to explain the time lapse between getting a CCJ... and re-enforcing it. They'd also need to have the paperwork that said there was even a CCJ in the first place.... which they may not bother trying to get hold of if she has no assets to secure the debt on (CO), or to remove (bailiffs).

 

[somad]

once a CCJ jas been issued , can the DCA go for a charging order.... what happens after that ..can they send baliff in ask for attachement of earning etc as well as the CO?

 

I wish i didint own my own home its been so stressful with LINK!

[PriorityOne]

once a CCJ jas been issued , can the DCA go for a charging order.... what happens after that ..can they send baliff in ask for attachement of earning etc as well as the CO?

 

I wish i didint own my own home its been so stressful with LINK!

 

Once a CCJ has been issued, a creditor/DCA can go for a CO, yes.... but providing payments have been maintained under the CCJ, a CO is unlikely to be granted. In this situation, all a CO would be doing is securing the payments that are already being maintained on a CCJ anyway... so there's no point.

 

Similarly with bailiffs/attachment of earnings, etc... providing payments are being maintained on a CCJ... then there's no grounds for bailiff/court action either.

 

This doesn't always stop creditors having a go because they want to secure their repayments as tightly as possible.... and it certainly doesn't stop them from threatening to do all sorts, but there are grounds to fight back if that happens.

 

If you start a thread on your own personal situation, it might be best.... as it sounds like Link are being difficult....

 

[miziwizzi]

Once a CCJ has been issued, a creditor/DCA can go for a CO, yes.... but providing payments have been maintained under the CCJ, a CO is unlikely to be granted. In this situation, all a CO would be doing is securing the payments that are already being maintained on a CCJ anyway... so there's no point.

 

Similarly with bailiffs/attachment of earnings, etc... providing payments are being maintained on a CCJ... then there's no grounds for bailiff/court action either.

 

This doesn't always stop creditors having a go because they want to secure their repayments as tightly as possible.... and it certainly doesn't stop them from threatening to do all sorts, but there are grounds to fight back if that happens.

 

If you start a thread on your own personal situation, it might be best.... as it sounds like Link are being difficult....

 

 

 

Link obtained a charging order on my home 6 weeks after the CCJ!

[PriorityOne]

Link obtained a charging order on my home 6 weeks after the CCJ!

 

Yes, that doesn't surprise me... they rely on consumer ignorance.

 

Did you defend it?

[miziwizzi]

Yes, that doesn't surprise me... they rely on consumer ignorance.

 

Did you defend it?

 

 

 

No we did not, like you said consumer ignorance with the addition of being out of country for most of the time scale it wasall going on.

 

For us it is all paid, CO removed and original debt off next year, have got them by the curlies on some fancy accounting though

[debbbbsy]

They'd also need to have the paperwork that said there was even a CCJ in the first place.... which they may not bother trying to get hold of if she has no assets to secure the debt on (CO), or to remove (bailiffs).

 

hi, can you refer me to court procedures which actually refer to this.