2ccjs for the same debt?

[fletcherGTO]

not sure this is the right place to post this, but many years ago when i was young and stupid i got a capital one credit card, defaulted on it and didnt have the money to repay it (£200) anyway about 2 years or so ago it was passed on to a debt collection company, again i didnt pay these, charges mounted up and it ended up being around £480.

 

they sent part of the debt to court and i got a CCJ, cant remember how much it was for now, but it was around £220, i paid this off and it became "satisfied" on my file. never heard anything else about it, until i got another court letter to day i was getting another CCJ, they send the remainder of the debt to court, so i now have another CCJ for the 2nd half of the debt.

 

ive heard nothing about this, but when i last looked at my file it was there, the court havent collected it or tried to get payment off me, this was about 16 months ago now...

 

1st of all, can they issue 2 CCJs for the 1 debt?

 

and 2nd, why would they of been no action taken on the 2nd CCJ?

[cerberusalert]

Moved to legal forum.

[DonkeyB]

Sounds like a Bryan Carter trick!

 

But no, you can't receive two CCJs for one debt - they have split the claim, and that's a no-no. Did you not receive any letters/communications before the second CCJ was issued? Sounds like it was entered by default, and you have a perfect case for asking for a set-aside. More details would help.

[fletcherGTO]

Sounds like a Bryan Carter trick!

 

But no, you can't receive two CCJs for one debt - they have split the claim, and that's a no-no. Did you not receive any letters/communications before the second CCJ was issued? Sounds like it was entered by default, and you have a perfect case for asking for a set-aside. More details would help.

 

 

your correct, its was bryan cater

 

no idea about any letters before the 1st CCJ as any letters etc went to my old address. if im totally honest once i paid the 1st ccj off i forgot about the rest of the debt being with bryan carter!

[DonkeyB]

Whey hey, it's serious trouble time for Bryan Carter! You've made my day in a strange way...

 

There are dozens of threads on here about his tricks. He knows full well that you can't do this. It's time to first of all apply for a set-aside on the grounds that the claim was split.

 

Second, you need to complain to the OFT and Trading Standards, and also the Solicitors Regulation Authority.

 

The use of the 'old address' is one of Carter's tricks too.

 

Given he's done this before, I wouldn't be surprised if you couldn't go after him for damage to your credit status. £1,000 a go last time I looked (Woolwich v Karpoor, I think).

[DonkeyB]

I also think - for a bit of fun - that a letter to Carter would be in order, asking in no uncertain terms why, when you had paid the judgment of the claim, he issued a further claim in respect of the same debt. Would love to see the response and watch him squirm. One thing we know it is NOT - an admin error!

 

Looks like Carter has also mysteriously 'found' your new address just as soon as he has got a judgment by default at your old address. Now isn't that amazing?

 

Just have a trawl round the forums, GTO, and you'll find all the answers you need. Sadly, these are all standard tactics for the pile of inhuman sh1te that is Bryan Carter. I think it's time he was forced out of the world of 'soliciting' because he is clearly not fit to hold such office.

[fletcherGTO]

thanks for the info!

 

how do i go about getting it set aside then?

also when its "set asside" does it get removed from my file?

 

thanks again for your help

[fletcherGTO]

also i have no letters or anything left from them with any details, referance numbers or anything.. is there a way i can go about gettin hold of this information?

[DonkeyB]

Have a look here first.

 

http://bankactiongroup.org/resources/templates-library/51-guidance-notes/620-applying-for-a-set-aside

 

You'll need a form N244 which you can download from HMCS web site.

 

Yes, the second CCJ would be removed (but I'd always suggest you chek it is removed!).

 

Read the link above, then we can assess the evidence, though it's pretty clear-cut.

 

You should also send a CCA request to Carter and a subject access request to the original creditor, to find out even if the debt is enforceable - never know what might come out of the woodwork.

[fletcherGTO]

from what i remember the creditcard i took out was about 5 years ago if that makes much difference

[diddydicky]

Your best action is to defend the claim AND THEN go find the most expensive lawyer you can find to take this case on (they'll bite your hand off) and let the barsteward have a taste of his own medicine

[cerberusalert]

Whey hey, it's serious trouble time for Bryan Carter! You've made my day in a strange way...

 

There are dozens of threads on here about his tricks. He knows full well that you can't do this. It's time to first of all apply for a set-aside on the grounds that the claim was split.

 

Second, you need to complain to the OFT and Trading Standards, and also the Solicitors Regulation Authority.

 

The use of the 'old address' is one of Carter's tricks too.

 

Given he's done this before, I wouldn't be surprised if you couldn't go after him for damage to your credit status. £1,000 a go last time I looked (Woolwich v Karpoor, I think).

 

A little research wouldn't go amiss, Mrs Carter? Who she is involved with... SRA?... Nepotism????

[palomino]

I guess by now that you have discovered there is considerable interest in this type of case.

 

Going through your scenario -

 

1. The first CCJ was obtained against you for a part of the debt(plus legal and court costs). Were you aware of this claim being lodged with the court before the hearing? How did you find out about the judgment - was it a notice from the court?

 

2. A second CCJ was obtained against you for the balance of the debt (plus legal and court costs). Were you aware of this second claim being lodged with the court before the hearing? How did you find out about the judgment - was it a notice from the court? Had you changed addresses prior to this second claim?

 

It is unlawful to split the claim into parts as BC has apparently done. BC knows it is - I have told him personally. If it comes to another court hearing I will be happy to appear as witness to this.

 

You should apply to have the second judgment set aside on these grounds. It will cost you a little money to do this but you will get this back when costs are awarded. I believe you have to complete a form N244 - I've never done this myself so hopefully others can give you more guidance on this aspect.

 

In theory BC has breached the law. Specifically the County Courts Act 1984 S.35. I'm not sure if you can report this as a crime to the Police or how else this aspect should be handled.

 

You should also report this matter to the Solicitor's Regulatory Authority. Details of how to do this are shown on the website www.sra.org.uk/consumers/consumers.page although I've just noticed the the SRA website redirects you to this page LCS: Legal Complaints Service home

 

Complaints should also be made the OFT and Trading Standards. The OFT will not investigate individual complaints but will accumulate complaints against an organisation with a view to revoking or not renewing their credit licence. You should phrase youur complaint in those terms.

 

There are many people here who have a CCJ initiated by BC for a part of the debt but have not received a subsequent claim for the remainder. We are all very interested in this and will help you as much as possible.

 

As has been mentioned above - and it certainly applies in my case - you can take the hit on the first CCJ knowing that the balance can never be collected. You are 'let off' the remainder.

 

One small point : in your first post you refer to the court having never collected the debt. Courts don't collect debts, they make judgments. It is up to the claimant to enforce collection.

 

Please, please keep us posted on how this progresses.

Edited November 25, 2009 by palomino
spelling

[palomino]

Your best action is to defend the claim AND THEN go find the most expensive lawyer you can find to take this case on (they'll bite your hand off) and let the barsteward have a taste of his own medicine

 

Unfortunately BC will not take the hit on this. He will pass it back to the creditor (Capital One).

[DonkeyB]

Unfortunately BC will not take the hit on this. He will pass it back to the creditor (Capital One).

 

Morning palomino.

 

Doesn't this depend on how the debt was assigned and who actually owns it? I imagine it was sold to someone like Phoenix and then BC was simply the solicitor acting on the case. The judgment may well not even be in BC's name - we need the details from CCA/SAR to establish who/what/where/when first, so hopefully he can't just 'pass it back'.

 

It would be nice to think some egg will stick on 'Teflon' Carter.

[palomino]

Yes BC is the solicitor in this matter. The DCA could in fact be BC's subsidiary company Fredricksons - in which case the 'hit' would stay in house.

 

The OP doesn't say who the DCA is unfortunately.

[fletcherGTO]

I guess by now that you have discovered there is considerable interest in this type of case.

 

Going through your scenario -

 

1. The first CCJ was obtained against you for a part of the debt(plus legal and court costs). Were you aware of this claim being lodged with the court before the hearing? How did you find out about the judgment - was it a notice from the court?

 

2. A second CCJ was obtained against you for the balance of the debt (plus legal and court costs). Were you aware of this second claim being lodged with the court before the hearing? How did you find out about the judgment - was it a notice from the court? Had you changed addresses prior to this second claim?

 

It is unlawful to split the claim into parts as BC has apparently done. BC knows it is - I have told him personally. If it comes to another court hearing I will be happy to appear as witness to this.

 

You should apply to have the second judgment set aside on these grounds. It will cost you a little money to do this but you will get this back when costs are awarded. I believe you have to complete a form N244 - I've never done this myself so hopefully others can give you more guidance on this aspect.

 

In theory BC has breached the law. Specifically the County Courts Act 1984 S.35. I'm not sure if you can report this as a crime to the Police or how else this aspect should be handled.

 

You should also report this matter to the Solicitor's Regulatory Authority. Details of how to do this are shown on the website www.sra.org.uk/consumers/consumers.page although I've just noticed the the SRA website redirects you to this page LCS: Legal Complaints Service home

 

Complaints should also be made the OFT and Trading Standards. The OFT will not investigate individual complaints but will accumulate complaints against an organisation with a view to revoking or not renewing their credit licence. You should phrase youur complaint in those terms.

 

There are many people here who have a CCJ initiated by BC for a part of the debt but have not received a subsequent claim for the remainder. We are all very interested in this and will help you as much as possible.

 

As has been mentioned above - and it certainly applies in my case - you can take the hit on the first CCJ knowing that the balance can never be collected. You are 'let off' the remainder.

 

One small point : in your first post you refer to the court having never collected the debt. Courts don't collect debts, they make judgments. It is up to the claimant to enforce collection.

 

Please, please keep us posted on how this progresses.

 

the 1st CCJ i recieved the official court papers saying i was gettin the CCJ etc so i knew i was getting that. the 2nd one, i knew nothing about until logging on to experian to look at my file!

 

im readin through this thread now to find out exactly what i need to do and will be doin it!

 

cheers for help so far

[fletcherGTO]

right today ive spoke to the court to find out wha these CCJS are

 

they are both for capital one - credit card

 

i said well surely they cant issue 2 ccjs for the same debt?

 

she said they can if they state on 1 of the judgments that they are claiming part of the debt???

 

 

now i really am confused, and pretty pi**ed off that i have 2 CCJS for 1 bloddy debt, it seems rediculous!

[DonkeyB]

They are wrong! Refer again to palomino's post above.

 

You need to apply for a set aside.

[fletcherGTO]

am i correct in thinking its £70 for a set aside?

do i get this back? since really its not my fault that im having to apply for a set aside in the 1st place?

[sillygirl1]

Yes, you can also put in a claim for wasted costs to be taken into consideration if Carter 'decides to discontinue' or whatever. Stick this on the claim at the same time under COSTS - and claim Litigant in Person costs of £9.95 per hour (I think that is the rate) x 10...

[fletcherGTO]

looking at the n244 form...

 

it says

 

what order are you askin the court to make and why

 

and what information am i replying on in support of my claim

 

what do i need to put for these 2 questions??

never done anything like this before so i have no idea what im doing..

 

 

also how do i want it to be delt with? a hearing, without a hearing and telephone hearin, how long will it take?

[hungrybear]

Just to elaborate on the county courts act for the benefit of GTO

 

35 Division of causes of action

It shall not be lawful for any plaintiff to divide any cause of action for the purpose of bringing two or more actions in one or more of the county courts.

 

I think it's £75 for the set aside