Help no response for copy of credit agrement

[Number6]

Don't call customer (non) service, write back recorded delivery and reiterate your legitimate demand for a true copy of the original agreement. Put everything in writing, remind them that the clock is ticking and counting down the 42 days from your original request. After the 42 days are up they will have committed a criminal offence and you can take them to court for non-compliance.

 

Reiterate that as the debt is in dispute it should not have been sent to a debt collector.

 

Pete

[pford]

They have already had more than 42 days sent them a request for the agreement on the 11 July so they have already committed a criminal offence.

[Number6]

County Court it is then!!

 

Pete

[lickthewallfatboy]

Apologies for my previous thread. i was very wrong.

 

Did a little googling and found a copy of the cca 1974.

 

It states that they are in default after 12 working days then after a further month they have committed a criminal offence.

so its NOT 30 days in total.

Martin

not trying to be a smartar$e or anything,but you are the only person I've seen saying that it's 12 plus 30 days.Everybody seems to be of the opinion that it's 30 days for an offence to have been committed after receipt of request....

 

what did you come across that made you think that it is 42 days and not 30?

 

have a read at this- A couple of debt help tips - Page 3 - MoneySavingExpert.com Forums

[ecobabe]

now i know i'm not martin but here it is directly from the Act,

 

"If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) if the default continues for one month he commits an offence. "

so they default after 12 working days, then if that default contiues for one month, an offence is committed

[pford]

How does this look in reply to the Halifax letter

 

Dear Sir

 

As I must remind you again I wrote to the Halifax on the 11th July 2006 requesting a true copy of the signed agreement under the terms of Sections 77(1) and 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, enclosing the statutory maximum fee of £1 in the form of a cheque (cheque number 000659) which was credited to the above account on the 19th July 2006.

 

I have not been provided with a signed agreement under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, despite my properly formatted and paid for request.

 

For convenience I have reproduced the relevant sections of the Consumer Credit Act for you:-

 

1) The creditor under a regulated agreement for running-account credit, within the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of £1, shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, together with a statement signed by or on behalf of the creditor showing, according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer,—

 

(a) the state of the account, and

 

(b) the amount, if any, currently payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor, and

 

© the amounts and due dates of any payments which, if the debtor does not draw further on the account, will later become payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor.

 

(6) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

 

(a) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

 

(b) if the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

I note from your letter that you have now passed this debt to Blair, Oliver and Scott. Please note that under the terms of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 it clearly states:- he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement, and any contact from Blair, Oliver and Scott will be seen as further HARASSMENT and in breach of the Administration of Justice Act 1970.

 

[lickthewallfatboy]

now i know i'm not martin but here it is directly from the Act,

 

"If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

 

(a) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

 

(b) if the default continues for one month he commits an offence. "

 

so they default after 12 working days, then if that default contiues for one month, an offence is committed

 

from what I understand from that,the default begins 12 days after they receive your request,and if it continues for a month from that receipt,they have committed an offence.....there are a couple of threads on the subject,and one guy got citi to bury a debt after the 30 days-so that's the way the institutions are reading it.

[un1boy]

Pford- any updates on this?

[pford]

only the Haressment thinking about sending above letter to halifax in response to their letter post 25 if its suitable

[zootscoot]

Hi Pford

 

A couple of points:

 

1. The Protection from Harrassment Act is not really applicable as this only applies where the victim fears violence on two or more occassions. So best just to sick with the Administration of Justice Act.

 

2. Am I right in thinking Blair Olvier Scott are their debt recovery department rather than a DCA which has purchased the debt? If so it seems that they have not defaulted you. It seems from the letter they are not demanding the full debt becomes immediately repayable or have they done this in previous correspondence? If they have not defaulted you their is nothing to stop them from passing to another department for collecting without issuing a default notice.

 

You might want to have a look at the OFTs guidelines on Debt Collection

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/50F06527-9FC5-4610-B385-999D6E2A8950/0/oft664.pdf

 

The thread I think people were earlier referring to can be found here

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/28830-need-expert-one-dont.html

 

Hope this helps

 

Zoot

[pford]

thanks Zoot will modify letter to halifax. Not sure if they have defaulted me will take that bit out as well

[pford]

well had a reply to my last letter to them

 

Further to your email/letter dated 11th September 2006 regarding the status of your account.

 

Your request for a copy of your signed agreement is noted. I must assume that you have not contacted the necessary department as advised previously. Your request has therefore been forwarded today and a copy of your signed agreement will be sent to you as soon as we receive it. We have complied with your request and currently await the information.

 

Please do not use your request as a reason for non-payment as that is not acceptable. We have applied reduced payment arrangements in order to assist you since 2000 and it is clear that a long-term repayment solution is required which is why the account has been passed to Blair, Oliver and Scott. It is important that you call Blair Oliver & Scott on 08702 405 138 upon receipt of this letter in order to agree a way forward.

 

For the Avoidance of doubt Section 40 (3) of the Administration of Justice Act allows and does not prohibit anything done which is permissible by law to secure the payment of a due, or to enforce liability by legal process. In this regard we are mindful of the rights of individuals and would not attempt to harass any customer.

 

Should any of your concerns remain unresolved please let me know what you’d like me to do to put matters right. We are keen to resolve your concerns, if we are unable to do so we’ll provide you with details of how you can contact the Financial Ombudsman Service for assistance. If I do not here from you within eight weeks I will assume you are satisfied with our response to your letter.

 

Yours sincerely

 

 

David Carey

Customer Care Manager

Retail Bank Collections

 

We have applied reduced payment arrangements in order to assist you since 2000

Ye right that’s why they cancelled the payment plan, started phoning up and asking me to pay more than I could afford. Sure they even broken the Data Protection Act as well even discussed the account with my wife asking her to pay it.

[gargoil]

I think your going about this the wrong way. I think you should now be going to the relevant authorities (Trading Standards?etc) if the 42 days are up and cc'ing any communication with them to the person you are dealing with at the bank!

[pford]

well thats done reported them to trading standards now lets c what happens

[pford]

Just had a phone call of Trading Standards so much for that, they are going to write to them and remind them of their obligation under the Consumer Credit Act to supply the information to me. Even told me to carry on paying as it would look good if it went to court.

[pford]

Update on this just had a letter of the Halifax think they are a pit ****ed at me

Dear Sir/Madam

Following a recent assessment of your overall relationship with the Halifax, a decision has been taken to withdraw your Current Account overdraft facility. this will occur within 2 weeks from the date of this letter.

Subject to outstanding transactions this may result in your account falling into an unauthorised debit balance. if this happens, you will liable for unauthorised overdraft charges, and any debit balance will be charged interest at the unauthorised rate. In accordance with condition 18.1 of your terms and conditions, you are then required to ensure your account does not go over the arranged overdraft limit.

It is in your interest to contact us to discuss this on 0870 850 1298

Yours faithfully

Senior Collections Manager

[gargoil]

What a bunch of bastards! Excuse the language!

[Tobes]

That seems like a rather short time - have a look at the banking code - I thought it should be 30 days, though that might be for account closure

[pford]

Don't use it anymore anyway but that’s not the point still not provide the credit agreement for the visa they can now argue that with trading standards

[Tobes]

ah that#s ok then

[pford]

going to reply to their letter to try and find out why. how does this look

 

 

Dear Sir

In reply to your letter dated 20th September 2006, can you explain what you mean by “overall relationship with the Halifax” and what grounds you have come to this decision with regards to the withdrawal of the overdraft facility on the above account, why has the account been passed to your department and why is it in my best interest to contact you? My husband and I are not aware of any problems on this account.

I shall expect a written confirmation from you acknowledging the contents of this email within 5 working days, as per the requirements of section 15.3 of the Banking Code.

.

[pford]

Letter sent to them lets see what they say, letter is from wife so lets see if they bring my credit card into it or any details about it.

[pford]

Right had another phone call today this time of Blair, Oliver & Scott. Well you owe this money are you going to pay. Well Halifax are in default of the CCA, ye but you still owe the money. Well maybe if they can supply what I have asked for but as a jester of goodwill are you prepared to accept my offer of £20 per month what I have been trying to offer the Halifax for the last 10 months.

[gargoil]

At this point surely you can invite them to take legal action against you but remind them that they have been unable to supply you with the original CCA agreement and have commited a CRIMINAL offence.

 

I'm going the more agressive (and probably silly) route of refusing to pay and threatening to sue them if they don't remove the default on my credit file as I acknowledge no debt to them.

[zootscoot]

Failure to supply the original document renders the agreement unenforceable not the debt. You have requested the agreement to be unenforceable and it seems it now is. If the agreement is unenforceable this renders the whole debt immediately payable and you therefore need to try to negotiate to arrange a payment settlement. There are some templates in the library to do this.