Is this Sainsburys CCA Enforcable

[joanne5865]

I have just received my CCA from Sainburys Bank, can anyone tell me if this CCA is enforcable.

 

Many Thanks

 

 

[andydd]

Hi.

 

Well..what do you think ?

 

I certainly know what my decision is !. I think if you are in all seriousness start the slippery path of challanging Credit Agreements you need to be quite clued up on Credit Agreements and wether or not they are enforceable, there are some great stickys on here explaining it all, its honestly quite simple. I suggest you go read them , get a bit clued up and then come back and you'll get lots of help here

 

That will help you a lot more than a simple yes or no answer to your question.

 

Andy

[cerberusalert]

If that is all they have sent then it is unenforceable as there are non of the prescribed terms within the four corners of the agreement. Send them this;

 

Dear Sir

 

Account Number: XXX

 

Re; your recent reply to my request under section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

I note that you have replied to the above by sending the Application Form & your companies current Terms and conditions I must inform you that this is not sufficient to comply with the request and that your company is still in default under the act.

 

To clarify, just sending the Application Form & Terms and Conditions is a breach of the Act and Regulations as, apart from the information that the Regulations provide that you may exclude, the copy must be a “true copy” of the agreement.

 

This breach of the agreement can be demonstrated as follows;

As you will know section 180(1) (b) authorises, “the omission from a copy of certain material from the original, or the inclusion of certain material in condensed form.” This refers to statutory instruments made under the heading Copies of document regulations and in this care in particular to SI 1983/1557.

 

Before leaving section 180 there are two other sections that should be remembered these are:

 

Section 2(2) (a) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not satisfied unless the copy supplied is in the prescribed form and conforms to the prescribed requirements;

 

And more importantly

 

Section 2(b) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not infringed by the omission of any material, or its inclusion in condensed form, if that is authorised by regulations.

 

You will see that this quite clearly states that whilst certain items may be left out of the copy document the rest of the document must be in the form and contain all items as prescribed by the regulations.

 

Turning to the regulations regarding what may be omitted from these copies these are contained with SI 1983/1557.

 

The regulations state:

(2) There may be omitted from any such copy-

(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor, hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;

(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancelable executed agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of signature by the debtor of an agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

 

It is quite clear what can be omitted from the copy document, this again asserts that all other details of the agreement should presented in form and content as required by the regulations.

 

The requirements of the Agreement regulations 1983/1553 are very explicit in describing the form and content of an agreement and this as I have demonstrated also applies to the copy of any such agreement with the above mentioned proviso.

 

Nowhere within these regulations does it state that part of the agreement can be presented on a separate document headed terms and conditions.

It does state that all terms and conditions should be within the agreement document and is explicit of the form in which it is presented.

 

I hope this explains why your reply was unacceptable I await a True copy of my agreement and would remind you again that whilst the request has not been complied with the dispute continues

 

Yours faithfully

Print name do not sign.

[joanne5865]

Thanks, thought it wasn't right, but as a newbie, wanted a 2nd opinion. Sainsburys also sent me a charming covering letter, saying the agreement is fully enforceable and they will not enter into any further correspondence re this matter. Also enclosed a copy of their current T&Cs.

 

Will send them the 2nd letter tomorrow and keep you updated:)

 

Thanks again

[andydd]

Thanks, thought it wasn't right, but as a newbie, wanted a 2nd opinion. Sainsburys also sent me a charming covering letter, saying the agreement is fully enforceable and they will not enter into any further correspondence re this matter. Also enclosed a copy of their current T&Cs.

 

Will send them the 2nd letter tomorrow and keep you updated:)

 

Thanks again

 

Do they say why they think they are enforceable ?. At least Capital 1 tie themselves in knots trying to explain..its gibberish though.

 

Could you post up the charming letter ?

[Dotty50]

Hi

I have just had a reply to my CCA request from Sainsburys and posted it on my thread.

Not had much experience yet, so not sure how to put a link here to show you, for information purposes.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/getting-out-debt/199840-sainsburys-cca.html

 

Hey, it worked, I think!

Edited May 19, 2009 by Dotty50

[joanne5865]

http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu105/m1bos/SainsburyCCA.jpg

 

This is the letter, a bit over the top considering I only made a simple request for the CCA!!

[IdaInFife]

just a note, I take it you applied online, did they not send you a print out of the online t and c's as well?

 

ida x

[joanne5865]

No, only the current T&Cs.

[Dotty50]

Exactly the same as the one they sent to me!

[andydd]

http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu105/m1bos/SainsburyCCA.jpg

 

This is the letter, a bit over the top considering I only made a simple request for the CCA!!

 

OOhh..Stroppy !

 

You should write back and say you just wanted to check that everyuthing was in order no need to be agressive...