welcome finance ppi - ive issued a court claim!

[andie_303]

My story is sounding the same as many I have heard on this site - I took out a £1000 loan in September 2006 which was to be repaid over 12 months with no insurances then in January 2007 I asked to take another £1000 on the same terms. I was told this wouldn't be a problem but whilst the initail loan was done over the phone this time I was told I would have to go to a branch. After sitting in the branch for 3 hours in a tiny room whilst the salesman seemingly sat at his desk drinking coffee I was presented with 3 A4 pieces of paper that he asked me to sign to verify all my details were correct - I stupidly see now did not think this was a loan agreement I thought I was signing to say my personal details were true and so signed without reading it properly.

 

The next thing I know he swans off again an an hour later he comes back in with a cheque for the extra £1000 in an envelope and says all the paperwork will follow - after 4 hours I was dying to get out of the cramped office he had shut me in so I just said 'it is on the same terms as the other one isn't it?' he said yes so I left thinking the paperwork would follow.

 

The paperwork never followed but as I was paying £200 every month I calculated this seemed about right for £2000 over 12 months. Then in January 2007 I called Welcome to find out if my last payment would be that January or February as I couldn't remember when my DD had started - to my horror I was told that infact I was to pay £200 for another 2 years - so to broow £2000 i would be repaying £7200.

It was only then that I was told I was paying £2100 for PPI, Accident, Life Insurance etc the whole works - my insurance policies cost more than the loan for Gods Sake!

I complained on numerous occasions writing letters talking to sales people that really couldn't be bothered and found a typical response when I asked how they could charge something so extortionate was 'we lend to people with adverse credit' - oh well thats ok then!

 

I was fobbed off and never received any responses to my complaint - I have explained on a number of occasions the reason I don't take PPI on anything is that I have an existing medical condition that excludes me from almost all these policies ever paying out. In the end I had enough I have still to this day not received a copy of my agreement, a PPI policy bookklet, details of who provides this insurance or any acknowledgement to numerous complaints.

 

So in October this year I called my branch and told them I had just filed a claim in small claims court for the PPI insurance money I had paid and interest - the employee I spoke to who will remain nameless (until court tomorrow) has confirmed that he sent an electronic complaint form to head office informing them I was taking them to court. Welcome Finance did not acknowledge court action (well they don't acknowledge customers letters so why anything else!) so I was given a default judgement i then warrented it and prepared to send the bailiffs in (just for the crack really) I then received a call from Welcomes 'compliance' department. They informed me they had only just found out I had taken them to court and were applying to have the judgement put aside on grounds they didn't receive the paperwork from the court - funny that I received mine though! - I told them at this point I had already warrented it to bailiffs and they were due to attend the local branch - at this point the man started to raise his voice and called me a stupid girl that didn't know what she was doing and if that bailiff tries to take their property I will be liable for the costs if welcome had their goods taken that could run in to hundreds of pounds which welcome would pursue with 'great vigour'.

 

I had the feeling he was B/Sing me and the people at the courts service confirmed I had already paid for the bailiff when I warrented it and I would not be liable for anything.

 

But welcome filled a motion to get the judgement put aside and asked for it to be without a hearing and tried to use a statement saying that they had not received notification of the court action nor were they aware of any complaint I had - thankfully I have faxed letters along with transmission receipts, emails with read receipts and letters that have been signed for to dispute this alongside a statement from their own employee saying he told them court action had been filed.

 

So here I go, hopefully the judge will dismiss their motion - otherwise round 2 is scheduled for March 2009. I will keep you updated!

 

30.01.09

I have just come back from court and they got the judgement put side on grounds that they hadn't been served the court papers initially. The judge didn't seem to belive them but said with the complexity of the case he thought it was best if we came back to court to settle the matter and then Welcome could not appeal on this.

 

So now I'm asking anyone out there for help on what I should do next - i have zero legal experience and have done nothing like this before so if anyone can offer me advice or help of how to battle these in court it would all be very much appreciated.

[postggj]

hi andie

glad you have started your thread now

 

i am well versed in dealing with these muppetts

ill post the address to send every thing, and all paper work needed over the week end to get the ball rolling.

 

welcome will take this right up to the court gates as routine but the questions i have for them, they dont want to answer in court.

its to incrimanating.

 

ive had two victories over welcome this week so its looking good,

lets make your another.

 

like i said, ill give all the info needed over the week end

 

good hunting and good luck

[Dipply75]

Hi Andie, joining to lend support and any help I can. I've been digging into their practices from being scammed myself.

 

Trust in postggj, has been there and won the t-shirt!

 

I read that you contacted Direct Group, can you give as much info about what you asked and their response?

 

They basically told me all they had were my basics (name, address etc), policy no and details and dealt with claims. I am trying to find out if they deal with the actual insurer at any point and pay them their money. all this will help no end with your case

[andie_303]

Dipply 75

 

My conversation with Direct Group was basically - "you'll have to contact Welcome I can give you their phone number" - In the end I got through to a manager who told me they are an insurance administrator, when I asked what this means she clarified that they are basically a 'call centre' who process claims for a number of different insurers and companies - they do not hold, sell nor underate any insurance policies. I have also been told that Norwich Union 'underwrite' these policies - I have recieved written confirmation from Norwich Union today that they have no policy for me - they could tell me that I used to have a car insurance policy through Asda that was underwritten by them - but they are not currently underwriting any policies for me. I have spoken with Norwich Union as well and have been told the lady had never heard of any policies underwritten by them for Welcome Finance.....makes you wonder huh??

 

Welcome have now had almost 5 months since I sent my SAR and have still not responded and won't actually tell me who provides my poilicy they keep saying Direct Group and Norwich Union and so far I have proved this to the contrary - perhaps the judge will get it out of them????

[andie_303]

hi - help needed

 

I have to file an answer with the court to defence points welcome have filed - does anyone know how i do this and how much information I should put in there? Obviously I don't want to give all my arguements to welcome so they can bulls**t their way out of it.

Should i put in this answer that despite my request for a SAR welcome have not provided this? Also do I have to put information in the answer in order to be able to raise it in court???

 

Thanks

[andie_303]

bump

[andie_303]

Hi,

 

To cut a long story very short I believe I was mis-sold PPI, Life Insurance and accident care from Welcome Finance that without interest was sold at £1390 on a £2000 loan.

 

Despite repeated correspondance sent recorded to Welcome they have so far ignored all correspondance even a request for Special Access has been ignored for 5 months well over the 40 days they are allowed.

 

In the end I filed the motion in small claims as I believed that without a final correspondance on the matter from WF i couldn't go to FSA.

 

Welcome have filed a defence with the court and I have been asked to respond so really my question is how much information do I have to put in the answer - do I have to put everything in there I wish to bring up in court? Also when I filed my claim I asked for £1390 + £75 court costs and 8% intrest totaling £1584 however what I didn't realise is that i have been charged interest of 51% on this ppi - I did not know about this until I have read copies of the paperwork that came with the defence as I was not given an agreement when I signed I was told they would post it to me (stupid of me yes i know!) so am I able to adjust the amount I am claiming or do I now just have to live with the error?

 

Lastly if I were to lose (please god I hope not) will i be liable for any of welcomes 'costs'?

 

Thank you

[andie_303]

Hi,

 

To cut a long story very short I believe I was mis-sold PPI, Life Insurance and accident care from Welcome Finance that without interest was sold at £1390 on a £2000 loan.

 

Despite repeated correspondance sent recorded to Welcome they have so far ignored all correspondance even a request for Special Access has been ignored for 5 months well over the 40 days they are allowed.

 

In the end I filed the motion in small claims as I believed that without a final correspondance on the matter from WF i couldn't go to FSA.

 

Welcome have filed a defence with the court and I have been asked to respond so really my question is how much information do I have to put in the answer - do I have to put everything in there I wish to bring up in court? Also when I filed my claim I asked for £1390 + £75 court costs and 8% intrest totaling £1584 however what I didn't realise is that i have been charged interest of 51% on this ppi - I did not know about this until I have read copies of the paperwork that came with the defence as I was not given an agreement when I signed I was told they would post it to me (stupid of me yes i know!) so am I able to adjust the amount I am claiming or do I now just have to live with the error?

 

Lastly if I were to lose (please god I hope not) will i be liable for any of welcomes 'costs'?

 

Thank you

[e28bigalbexley]

Hi Andie

It would be helpful i think if you posted your POC,s up so PPL can see exactly what they are trying to defend.

 

Also i believe that the court should send you a copy of their (Welcome) defense ring them and ask for it (the court that is).

 

I think but not 100% that you can change you claim but it will cost you £75. As i say i am not sure about this but someone should be along soon to clarify this.

 

 

AL

[andie_303]

hi - sorry i'm a bit thick so guessing is poc - particulars of claim?

 

This is basically it:-

 

I took an inital loan from Welcome in October 2006 for £1000 with no insurances etc over 12 months - In January 2007 my partner had left me in quite a bad financial situation so I rang welcome and asked to borrow another £1000 over the same terms. Whilst the first agreement was done via post I was told I had to come to the office to do this one.

I went down there and was basically kept in a little office for 3 hours and was told that not taking the PPI etc 'could' effect whether I got the loan - I was naive and truthfully at the time really needed the money and did not read everything properly all the agreements were filled in and I just signed in all the places they asked me to. They then said they would send me a copy of all my paperwork. This never happened but as I was paying £190 each month and never missed a payment I thought all was ok. Then after 12 months I rang to find out why my DD was still going when my agreement should have finished - at this point I was told that my agreement was in fact 3 years - 36 months at £190 by my calculation means I pay them back £7,200 on a £2,000 loan. At this point I put a complaint in writing stating I felt I had been mis-sold my agreement - I got zero response.

I left this until July 2008 as I have a disabled baby and really did not have the time to fight it. In July I wrote again asking for my PPI to be refunded as it had been missold and gave them 8 weeks to comply. After this time I rang to find out what was going on and was told they had never recieved my letter in July (a lie as I have proof of reciept) so I told them to stand by the fax machine whilst I faxed a copy - I even stayed on the line to hear the fax ringing and the lady said she had it and would pass it to her manager I gave them 2 weeks. Again no response and another phone call where I was told they had never received the fax - it was absolutely ludricrous, I even have the fax transmission showing it received by their fax machine.

 

After numerous conversations with the branch I told them I was filing the case in small claims court he said someone from the compliance department would call me about this - surprise surprise nothing.

In September to try an bolster my case I did a SAR retaining proof of postage and printed the receipt off royal mail website - I have not had a response to this either.

 

I filed via MCOL in October and Welcome did not acknowledge the claim so I was given a judgement in default - when I warrenteed this to bailiffs Welcome then applied to have the judgement put aside on grounds they did not recieve the paperwork. We went to court about this on 30th Jan and the judge has put it aside and asked Welcome to file a defence.

 

On another note I have a prior medical condition Narcolepsy and I have also suffered from depression and I believe because of these conditions I would be excluded from being able to claim on this insurance (further investigation is needed but I am starting to question whether this even exists) - I have checked with other financial institutions like my bank and they say it would exclude me from claiming on their insurances. I'm positive I was never asked if I had any medical conditions nor did any sort of questionaire - surely you should have to do this as a matter of course if you're selling insurance that results in PPI or personal injury care??

[Dipply75]

Hi Andie

 

I read your post on Animal lovers thread and you are more prepared than you think ref the PPI/Direct Group/NU. Will try to help as much as possible

 

Will try and get postjjg's attention for you as that is the one person that has beat them in court and helped others to do so.

 

When you SAR'd Welcome did you receive anything called a statement of price? It would have their apparent breakdown of figures etc. That should prove their figures do not add up ( I will show you how).

 

You now have enough ammo to ask very pointed quations about your insurance.....do you have a copy of your agreement, in particular the t&c's on the back?

[andie_303]

Dipply,

 

hi thanks for the response - My SAR has been ignored so I have not got anything - and I was not given an original copy of my agreement etc all I have is the photocopy they have provided to the court which the court kindly photocopied for me so unfortunatley I do not have and T & C's - I'm at work at the minute but can upload the copies of the documents the court have if it will help anyone.

 

Thanks for your post again

 

Andrea

[e28bigalbexley]

Hi Andie

Well done on keeping the fax printout and the royal receipts.

If you did a SAR and have not had a reply after 40 days you should inform the Information Commissioners Office for their breach of the act (did you include a £10 postal order)?

 

Also go to your doctors and get them to give you a copy of you medical history (another fee involved sorry) I think you are entitled to it under the freedom of information act (i will check for you and get back later with a link) You may have to issue them with a SAR. Keep it safe for the judge to see.

 

What you need from them is the terms and conditions of the policy.

 

Sign up to photobucket.com its free, and post their defense on here (providing you have a scanner). Just remember to remove any personal details.

 

AL

[andie_303]

hi,

 

yes i did enclose a postal order - and it has been signed for. I already have a docots letter stating my conditions and when I was diagnosed (both prior to this agreement starting) I also have my current medication prescription for narcolepsy and a copy of the BNF guide (medical dictionary) confirming what my drug is used to treat.

 

They have told me anything in relation to the policy I need to get from the insurers who the keep naming as Direct Group and Norwich Union - however Direct Group tell me thay are an insurance administrator and do not sell, hold or underwrite any policies they are basically a call centre who process claims for a number of different companies. I have also enquired with Norwich Union and they have confirmed in writing that whilst I have head policies with them or underwritten by them in the past (1 car insurance direct with NU and 1 car insurance underwritten by them sold through ASDA) they have absolutley no policy and no knowledge of WF in relation to me - all leads me to wonder who the hell insurers this - if anyone??

[Dipply75]

Hi andie, yes, can you post as much as poss - their defence etc.

 

Can you give the all figures quoted on that agreement also. The reason I asked about the T&C's is that there is a section for the PPI etc that states "we will open a policy in your name with a reputable insurer" (not word for word but will dig one out if you need that).

 

"Your name", and you already have it in writing that NU have no such thing. Follow that with them taking payment from you for this policy and doing what with it? They advised another Cagger they pass the money to direct group.....not according to direct group. There is also a tax payable on your policy, does Direct Group account for and pay this also, and to who?

 

You have paid for a policy that you can find no existence of, they refuse to provide proof of (and has anyone been paid for?)

 

I suggest urgent complaints to:

The Finance and Leasing Association of whom welcome are members (link below) about them breaking their entire code of practice.

Chief Executive of Norwich Union about the behaviour and advice given by Welcome on behalf of NU, as their authorised representative.

Direct Group - demanding a breakdown of the insurance - actual cost, comission, Insurance Premium Tax incurred, who paid HMRC this tax, the amount actually paid to Insurer, when and under what details as NU cannot trace it to deal with your complaint to them.

 

That should get you more very useful info and just maybe put the wind up them

 

http://www.fla.org.uk/fla/consumerfinance/Consumerfinanceoverview.riv

Edited February 10, 2009 by Dipply75

[Dipply75]

Hi Andie, got some interesting reading for you. Check out the Direct Group website - especially the "services" section and "premium collection". They claim to be the middle man, including taking the payments, accounting for them, dishing out to the insurer and keeping all the records for this to FSA standards...wonder why they are not replying to your SAR? Cause it will give you all the ammo you need perhaps?

 

Direct Group - Where Insurance and Innovation Combine - Home Page

 

You could start by e-mailing the guy listed on the FSA register as their complaints/insurance contact:

 

FSA Register

 

I will pass this on to the others fighting for policy info too and see what turns up

[andie_303]

Thanks Dipply - paperwork will be up tomorrow - working on an email now will post shortly to see what you think

 

Andrea

[andie_303]

How's this....

 

Dear Mr Hough,

 

Ref Welcome Finance Agreement Number XXXXXXXXXXX

 

I am writing to you with regard to a problem I seem to be having with both yourselves and Welcome Finance with reference to personal protection insurance, lifecare insurance and accident issurance.

 

I am currently pursuing court action against Welcome Finance wth reference to how these policies were sold to me and so far I have found your company obstructive in my quest to obtain further information.

 

Welcome Finance have provided me with your details as the contact for these policies and you are also listed on the government competition commision as administering these policies. However despite me sending a special access request with the relevant fee to try and ascertain details of these policies - this request has so far been ignored.

 

On January 28th I rang your organisation and spoke with XXXX XXXXXXX who I believe to be a customer services supervisor who informed me that you did not hold, sell nor underwrite any of these policies and your company is basically a call centre to deal with claims for a number of different insurers and companies. This however, seems to contrast with your website which states:-

 

Through our technologically advanced systems we are able to collect customers monies in a variety of different ways from standard single premium payments to payment cards to Direct Debits.

 

 

Services include:

• Premium collection
  
• Premium invoicing and reporting
  
• Premium earnings, reserving and expenses calculations
  
• Commissions management
  

Therefore I am now asking that you provide me with any information you have with regard to myself and policies sold via Welcome Finance. I am also asking you comply with my special access request otherwise I will have no further option but to complain to the information commisioner about your obstructive behaviour.

 

Should you need to further verify my identity please contact me on XXXXX XXXXXX

 

I trust you will produce a response swiftly

 

Yours Sincerley

[e28bigalbexley]

Did you send SAR to their registered office addressed to the data controller, just that dropping it in at a branch their liable to just bin the letter and credit your account with a tenner. Your must remember most ppl that work for these money grabbers go though a lengthy training course in how to ignore customers requests and generally be a pain in the ar$e.

 

Sorry if you have done all this ,the only way for a sure response is to complain to the Information Commissioner who should kick their butt.

 

Al

[andie_303]

I sent it to the head office in nottingham to the compliance department am looking for a letter to the information commisioner about it now

[Dipply75]

That looks great - could add to "Therefore I am now asking that you provide me with any information you have with regard to myself and policies sold via Welcome Finance, including insurer, premium paid and commission etc.

 

you could also include that - Welcome have advised that Direct Group can answer any questions regarding the Insurance Premium Tax levied on my premium, therefore please ensure full details of premiums and taxes paid to my insurer are included in your response to my SAR

 

Welcome have put this in writing to animal lover, so not to you directly but they have stated it. That way it is crystal clear what info is to be included, time being an issue here. Love to see how they reply

 

What is the government competition commission? Have not heard of it and am very interested!

Edited February 12, 2009 by Dipply75
forgot bits

[e28bigalbexley]

hi andie

hope your keeping your chin up:D

heres ICO website with info about complaints.

 

Public information - Privacy rights, Freedom of Information Act - ICO

 

That didnt work

 

Try this

 

http://www.ICO.gov.uk

 

AL

Edited February 12, 2009 by e28bigalbexley

[andie_303]

WF pictures by andie_303 - Photobucket

 

I hope I have uploaded this right but this should be a copy of WF defence points that I need help to counter and also if I have to put any extra in there if I want to bring it up in court.

 

I will upload what I have written so far in a little while and see what everyone thinks

[andie_303]

WF pictures by andie_303 - Photobucket

 

hopefully I have done this right and you can now see WF agreements and defence points that I need to counter - I have started to draft my counter and will post that shortly so any comments or additions would be gratefully recieved.

 

Dipply - the competition commision is basically a governmental advisorary body that looks into whether compeition in an industry is fair or if the public etc are being given a raw deal by there only being a few people that offer a product or service and if they think so they can break up companies if they think it's in the public interest - they've tried to do it to companies like Sky and Microsoft in the past. I believe in this instance they made all financial institutions declare who provided their insurance policies to make sure they were evenly distributed and not held by 1 or 2 big names.

It was from this report I got who WF claim issues theirs.

[andie_303]

Quick question,

 

I have recently filed court action for misselling PPI but didn't have a copy of any paperwork I just knew the figures the company had provided me _ £1390 so in filing in court I did £1390 + 8% daily interest up top the day I filed. What i didn't realise is that I was getting charged 51.1% interest monthly on this amount so I have vastly underestimated my clim - can I ammend this before it is heard in court and how can I go about it if I can?

 

Thanks