car on bh finance goes wrong under Warranty time

[janb]

Hi all

Im new to this site but have found some of the posts very interesting. I have a mega issue going on at the mo and wondered if anyone has been in a similar situation and if so what was the outcome?

Are you sitting comfortably? Then i shall begin!

My hubby bought me my dream car for my 40th birthday and a couple of days after owning we noticed a clanking noise when selecting gears. We took it back to the dealership who claimed they had adjusted the linkage.

This was back in May last year and then on 1st November we lost gear 5th gear altogether. We took it back to the dealer and they advised they would have to send it away as they could not fault it. At this point i asked would it be covered by warranty and they said it should be. It sat in their compound for 4 days before they even sent it away and then two days later they called and said it was down to wear and tear and that the 5th gear synchro ring was damaged due to the clutch being worn and would not be covered by warranty!!!!!!! We had only done 2000 miles and were gutted by this and the fight began and continues!!!! We tried to tell them if it was down to wear and tear then it had been sold as such but they refused to budge!!

We then got Black horse involved after taking advice from consumer direct and they suggested we get an independant inspection carried out. We did this and the report came back stating that it was infact mech failure as a result of dog teeth breaking on the 5th syncro dog gear. Success!!! or so we thought. We sent this off to Black horse and waited and waited numerous phone calls getting us nowhere! Weeks pass and we get a letter from Black Horse stating the dealer does not accept the findings of our report and is having another carried out! Weeks pass yet again and then we get a copy of their report stating that it was defective operation of the clutch and clutch drag that have caused the problem. The clutch is also blue and mottled in appearance and scorched. Black Horse reject our claim and state thats the final decision. We bite the bullet and borrow money to get the necessary repairs done and return the hire car that has cost well over a grand. Last friday we get a call to say the cars ready. We insisted that we got the parts back that had been replaced. The clutch is perfectly normal (no blue marks) and could have gone back into the car. We have never missed a payment on finance while this saga has been going on and we have now passed this matter over to the financial ombudsman who we are hoping will see our side of things. BLACK HORSE STINK! Any similar stories or experience of dealing with the ombudsman i would love to hear them.

Thanks for reading

janb

[Conniff]

What is the mileage Jan?

[janb]

hi

Thanks for the response the mileage is 51000

Thanks

Jan

[Conniff]

Although the clutch appears to be in good order, which it should be at that mileage depending on how the car is driven, the mileage also says that there is probably not a manufacturing fault with the gearbox (it would have shown a lot earlier), as dog teeth do not just break off unless it is being put into gear with the clutch still partially or fully engaged.

 

If the clutch is still in good order, then it could have been out of adjustment or not being thrown out fully by the driver.

 

You say

who claimed they had adjusted the linkage

Was gear selection still difficult after the adjustment? If so then you should have returned right away and told them that it was still the same.

 

I know that's not what you want to hear, but you will have to prove that it was a mechanical failure (dog teeth missing is not proof), and not a fault with the clutch which will be hard to do now that it has been disturbed.

 

The syncro ring will engage before the dog teeth and that would indicate 'wear' in the syncro ring, again pointing to a problem with the clutch.

Edited January 23, 2009 by Conniff

[janb]

Hi Conn

 

Thanks for the response although you were right its not what i wanted to hear! We didnt have any problems after the dealership adjusted the linkage well not that we noticed. My point is that if this vehicle had any problem then it was sold as such. I am not prepared to spent that sort of money on a car and then have to cough up over 2k when i have only done 2000 miles in it! Its not on these big boys just think its ok to rip people off! Thanks you for your reply.

janb

[Conniff]

You will need a gearbox expert and a metallurgist to examin the damage to be sure, and that wont be cheap. If, of course, it proved in your favour then you would be able to claim the fee back.

 

Just to explain a bit more. There are cones that engage by sliding into one another to syncronise the speed of both parts before the dog teeth engage to lock them together. The cones sound as if they have worn and the speed has obviously not been syncronised and the dog teeth have been spinning when they have come into contact with each other consequently tearing off.

 

Your problem is proving that it was not wear and tear.

[janb]

Hi Conn

 

Thanks again.... how come you know so much about this? It has been explained to me how its works but it still wont go in! but then i am female lol. I have rec'd an email back from the guy that carried out my inspection and he states that there has been a mech failure of the 5th gear dog teeth - further metallurgist tests will be required to confirm this. What really gets me if that initially we offered to pay for the clutch if the dealership paid for the gearbox. Many thanks for you input much appreciated.

Thanks

Jan

[Conniff]

Lets just say I was in the game a long long time

[raydetinu]

But that wear and did not just occur in the 2000 miles you had it! therefore it was sold to you in that condition i.e. faulty, therefore they should have put it right at no cost to you. you werec covered by SOGA and got them to repair it or reject it or get repaired somewhere else if they wouldnt and sue them for the money. Also you could of got the loan company to pay it was there car? Suggest you try that line with them now may not be too late.

[janb]

ty ray

i have already been down that road trying to tell the finance co they are responsible as it is their car but no they wont have it!

i have no had to pay to get the car repaired as i cant afford to carry on hiring a car to get me to work.....so now it is seen as i have accepted the car so i lost the right to reject under the SOGA......my only hope now lies with the FOS!

ty for all you replies

[Conniff]

All isn't finished Jan. You could argue that the requirement to have experts examin and make a determination at expense to you, put an unreasonable barrier to you exercising your rights under the soga (and other) regulations.

[janb]

hi conniff

yes thanks i neva thought of that.....thanks for your help and advice x nice to get advice be it good or bad from someone whos knows what they are talking about and i quickly realised you knew!

ty jan

[scaniaman]

JanB. Hope you can get problem resolved without going to FOS. I recently had a financial problem which Lltsb admitted was their fault, but still said with boring repetitiveness to go to FOS. I thought this rather strange until someone on this web site said that reports to FOS were designed to put people off. On further investigation it appears that they send out reams of questions which are not easy to understand and time consuming to complete. Also, in certain circumstances can take upwards of a year to furnish you with their decision. Sorry, but that is the story i got, best of luck in whatever you decide to do.

[raydetinu]

I think you acn still take the finance company and the dealer to court for the cost of the repair. I f you are prepared to go that far. The FCo. have been found liable in cases in the past despite their protestations otherwise.

[janb]

Thanks Ray and others for the replies and will post and let you know how things progress but i dont imagine things move very quickly

Thanks

Jan

[janb]

Hi all

Just a bit of an update my situation... well the FOS have accepted my case but have advised that it may be some months before it is allocated to an adjudicator. I contacted the SMMT after seeing a post on here and they have been in contact and asked for more information so they can investigate! Not much to tell really but i will win and i wont give up!!!!

[janb]

Hi All

Back again cap in hand hoping for some more advice. To update the FOS have decided that the finance company are not responsible and did make contact with the dealer to see who the warrany underwriters were. Dealer replied its a dealership warranty and therefore is not underwritten. With it not being underwritten the FOS have said its not a regulated activity and can offer no help six months down the line. Dont bother with them a waste of time. Where do i go now? Stuck with 5K outlay after 2000 miles! It stinks how can the dealer get away with it? Could i take the dealer to court? Help please

Thx

Janb

[raydetinu]

yep take the dealer and the finance company to court.

[janb]

thanks raydetinu do you know if i can claim for other costs involved ie car hire and 3 mths of lost finance payments

[raydetinu]

Why not add all costs in to the claim, as long as you have mitigated the costs and not been excessive. Cant see getting far with the finance payments though, you will still have to pay for the car.

good luck.

[janb]

Hi Folks

Its me again

Just to let you know that I have now put a claim in with the court and even managed to get a part remission on the court fee!

Really nervous now as this is my last hope but at least i have tried to do something about it!

Wish me luck

Thanks

Janb

[Conniff]

Have you just named the dealer in the papers or the finance house as welll?

Remember the car is owned by the finance company and they have a joint as well as several liability.

[janb]

Hi Conniff

Thanks for the reply you really are a trusty soldier who comes to the aid of everyone x Not named dealer in papers as i thought i would wait and see what happens in court first. I did however contact Dom Littlewood on The One Show but not heard anything:(

The FOS are rubbish and they said finance co got nothing to do with it!

Will suck and see lol but i dont think dealerships should be allowed to sell warranties that are not underwritten! they may have well charged me £400 for a compliment slip cause thats all its worth!

Keep you posted...good luck to other people on this site

Janb x

[janb]

Hi Guys

Quick update!

Served papers and dealership has put in a defence still sticking with their wear and tear theory. and that the clutch had been overheating!

So this ones going all the way...court here we come but we have the clutch which is in pretty good nick!

Keep ya posted

[geoff1248]

"we have the clutch which is in pretty good nick!"

 

I hope you can prove without any doubt that the clutch you have did actually come out of your car. What if, for example, the garage turn up at court with a different clutch and state that the one they have is the one that came out of your car and they have no idea where you got your clutch from. (Sorry I'm in devils advocate mode...).