help needed with shop bought goods not being as described

[zoena]

hi all i am having a complete nightmare , i emailed a bridal shop an hour away from me about a wedding dress, she said they had it in the one i wanted in a 12-14, so i said is it a 12 or is it a 14 and she said definately a 12 (have emails) so i drove to shop and paid cash and picked it up got it home and its a 14, emailed her and she said ok send it back and i said it is what i want could you alter it and she said yes. then i worked out travelling costs etc and realized it would be a silly amount of money to pay out for a sale dress, so i sent her a really nice email saying could i possibly send it back and have a refund and thanks for being so nice to me etc etc. well she has emailed me today to say that she has spoken to trading standards and that as it is a sale item i have no rights etc.. so now i am stuck with it what can i do. she said she had someone that wanted it for 400 pounds but she sold it to me for fifty pounds less out of courtesy etc.. emailed back and said she was silly not to sell it for that and that i am really upset and dont know why she is being so vindictive etc do i have any rights??? only had the dress here a week x

[Guest Gertie100]

Someone more experienced will be along in a minute - but as far as I am aware regardless of whether or not it was a sale item - if they told you it was a 12 and it turns out to be a 14, the item was not as described, the therefore not fit for purpose (I think)

 

Does the dress state size 12 or 14? Might sound like a daft question, but the sizes on wedding dresses are ridiculously different to any other garment!

[zoena]

hi yeah the label inside says 14 and the tag attached says 14 too. i wanted the sample 12 as it fitted perfectly and meant no alteration costs, i am really upset and dont know why she has suddenly turned horrible

[zoena]

this is the email i sent her and below is the reply i ahd today

 

Hi again monica

After long deliberation my other half and I have worked out it is going to cost a bit getting to and from walsall for fittings etc so we think it makes more sense to send the dress back to you.

I hope you don’t mind but we think its best all round.

Could you let me know how I will get my money back from you as I will post the dress to you to save petrol etc I will do this through half term next week as I work all week and don’t get chance to do it any other time (although if I do get chance I will do it earlier) For my return payment my address is Miss

thankyou againg you have been very kind throughout so thankyou!

Zoe x

[zoena]

and she sent me this

 

Hi Zoe,

my assistant has just forwarded your email to me. I am away in London and will be back on 16 of Feb.

When you first queried the size I asked you to return Tiffany straight away and I offered to give you a full refund. Initialy you agreed and then a few days after you changed your mind and decided to keep the dress. I had a lady who was prepared to pay the full £400 sale price for it. Remember that I was good to you in bringing the price down further to £300 when you told me about your circumstances.

You agreed for me to alter it.

A week on you have changed your mind again and want to return it. Just to let you know, I have now lost the custom of the lady who wanted it initialy.

I have checked with Trading Standards and I have been fully assured that I am under no obligation to refund you as:

1. It is a sale item.

2. I initialy offered you a refund which you chose to turned down.

You are at liberty to change Tiffany for another dress of the same value in our shop. Or I can send you a credit note.

Just to let you know, I kept all our emails and have forwarded them to Trading Standards as proof.

Regards

[zoena]

also i paid 350 not 300 for it! so thats wrong for a start

[Guest Gertie100]

Mmmmm, ask her who she spoke to at Trading Standards!

Thank her for keeping the emails relating to this as this proves that she sold you the dress incorrectly.

Correct her over the price - and I'm sure someone will be along soon to confirm the issue with the initial refund proposal and the subsequent withdrawal.

 

Hang on - I'll shout for someone!

 

HEEEELLLLLOOOOO - help needed!

[zoena]

i have just sent her an email with the sale of goods act bumph on it and it says that if it does not conform ie wrongly advertized i am entitled to a full refund etc but i would like to check that is right. i am not going to post it back now my other half has agreed to take it back that weekend so i have mailed her that we wil be doing this i aslo corrected her on price and said perhaps she SHOULD ring trading standards after all

[Bookworm]

She's right, you're wrong.

 

When you first contacted her, you were within your rights to get a refund and she complied with SOGA by offering you the refund.

When you then decided to keep the dress after all and told her so, you effectively accepted the goods and lost the right to then change your mind again.

Shops don't have to refund/exchange if you change your mind, and she has proof of your acceptance in the form of your e-mails. In fact, she is being more than accomodating by offering you an exchange or credit note, she could very well just not do anything, she doesn't have to, and I don't think that her e-mail is being horrible at all, far from it.

 

The one thing she has got wrong is about the fact that it was a sale item, that makes no difference whatsoever to your statutory rights, but this is of no help to you in this instance since you have no recourse anyway, so this is purely for information.

[zoena]

i meant i didnt understand her sudden change of character when she initially offered me a refund and i was so nice etc so i couldnt understand why she would suddenly say well tough i dont want the dress back!

[zoena]

so i am out of pocket by 350 quid now with a dress i dont want because i had a think and realized having it altered was going to cost too much , not fair i think!!

[zoena]

thanks anyway feel like i could sit here and cry!

[Bookworm]

Well, if she is a smallish retailer, maybe she could sit there and cry too having lost a sale because you changed your mind twice. You haven't lost the money, she is offering you an exchange or a credit note, which as I said she doesn't have to do, so maybe you should be grateful that she is prepared to do this and start looking for another dress! ;-)

[Mrsmancmonkey]

Know where you are coming from though I had a nightmare with my wedding dress not being ready the month before I was supposed to be wed when it was ordered 18 months before plus very stressing when you are trying to organise it but from her point of view she has accommodated you and then you changed your mind so was no longer obligated to offer the refund and her email is polite to be fair to her.

 

Why dont you try your local bride shop see if they will buy off you (If the travel is an issue)or for them to get it altered? (Just edited as didnt see you could get a credit note/exchange - or do that and get a different dress from her) Or check the local paper to see if there are any seamstresses which could do the alterations, maybe a friend knows someone, hopefully you'll be able to sort something out dont be sad or do what I would do see it as an opportunity to eat lots of chocolate until you reached a size 14

 

Hope you manage to sort something out

x

[gyzmo]

Just reading the email sent back to you, and without prejudice to Bookworms usual excellent advice, all I can say is that what the sales staff is saying does sound odd.

 

If Trading Standards did indeed speak to her, then the person who advised her about the sales bit, frankly, needs sacking. Even people with basic training of consumer law know that sale items are no different to full price. Either she is lying, severely mistaken or Trading Standards ahve gone right down the pan (which they haven't). As for this other customer, sounds to me like a pressure tactic, which is outlawed under the Unfair Commercial Practices Directive. Given what she said about TS, it would not surprise me if this other customer was a figment of the imagination.

 

Unfortunately, it does not change your position. You could argue against her based on what she said to you, but it would probably be a long, fruitless and expensive argument. Do as Bookworm says and take the credit note / exchange.

[zoena]

a exchange or credit note is no good as the dress brand new is a thousand pounds and i cant afford that! i am sure she was upset about possibly loosing a sale but at the end of the day she sold me a 14 saying it was a 12!! i cant afford to pay more for my dress and this is the one i have always wanted i have waited a year to buy it in the sale as this was the only way i could have it sorry if you think i am being melodramatic but i cant help it !!

[zoena]

i have lost the money full stop unless i can get it altered cheaply (highly unlikely bridal alterations are mega expensive) or sell it on as like i said this was the dress i wanted! will let you know if she replies to my email, i just sent sorry to bombard you with emails but we are both in a really awkward situation i understand your situation but i hope you understand mine your initial offer was a refund so i cant understand why now you dont want to, if that really is the case then i cant really do anything about it as a credit note is useless to me as this was my dream dress and i cant afford it new as you know, i will have to try and sell it on maybe. thanks for the offer anyway i appreciate it zoe

[gyzmo]

The only way that I can think is to use s. 35(6)(a) of the Sale of Goods Act which states that the buyer is not deemed to have accepted the goods merely because he asks for a repair. Whether an adjustment can be counted as a repair is debatable - if the dress is the size it purports to be, then adjusting it may not be considered a repair. But on saying that there is a breach of the condition of the description - the size of the dress you wanted. Also, you might be able to argue a breach of warranty, which means that you will be entitled to damages (which would be, for example, the cost of buying a similar dress elsewhere).

 

If it really does mean so much, I would contact Trading Standards for an opinion (Consumer Direct may have to refer you to Trading Standards as it is a bit more complex than they are used to dealing with). If you do so, you must be absolutely honest about what has happened (I am not saying you are lying - its just that some people do miss things - even small things - that can make a huge difference to the situation).

 

In deciding whether to pursue this though, do think of the time and cost involved, as well as the stress. Is an alteration really so bad? I think, morally, that the shop should pay for the alteration.

 

Get Trading Standards to advise and take it from there.

 

Whatever happens, congratulations on getting hitched - I hope it all works out (remember it is the marriage that is the most important thing!)

[zoena]

she did offer to alter it but as the shop was an hour away it wasnt worth it money wise to travel and pay out for petrol eacfh time i have been completely honest in my initial post that is exactly how it is i promise i have re read each email about three times etc i will wait and see if i get a reply from her i guess.

[gyzmo]

I personally would accept the (free) alteration and pay the petrol - a compromise but better than forking out for a new one and forking out for a fight.

[Chesterexpress]

zoena, I think you are being rather foolish in the way you are going on about this. I think therefore that you need to think this through and be a little more sensible about the situation. You have stated that it is the dress you have always wanted and that the full price is a thousand pounds. Now come on you paid £350 for it, therefore a considerable saving! What is it going to cost you in fuel to do perhaps 2 trips back to the shop, 1 taking it and having a fitting and then hopefully just another one to collect and make sure it fits after being altered. You say that you are going to take it back personally, so that is already one trip for which you are already going to pay for, so really you will only have to make one more trip. You then have the dress of your dreams. You either want this dress or you don't?

[Conniff]

There is, of course, the matter of contribulatory error in that you should have looked at the labels (you say it had two on saying size 14), at the time of purchase.

[Filthy Monkey]

I agree. It is certainly not going to cost you £350 in petrol to go and have the dress fitted and altered, but you stand to lose £350 if you have to go and buy a new dress. You're only other viable alternative is to see how much it would cost to have the dress altered locally and weigh that up against the cost of the petrol. You could try approaching the shop and asking if they would consider helping towards the cost of local alteration, rather than doing it themselves, but I think it's unlikely they would be willing to spend the money. Might be worth a try, though...

[gyzmo]

zoena, I think you are being rather foolish in the way you are going on about this.

 

I wouldn't quite say foolish. It is after all the shop that has supplied the wrong dress, and the consumer is now having to do all the legwork due to the mistake. Because of the email sent by Zoena, the condition that gave right to recission is now a waranty and only damages can be claimed for. A good demonstration of how lack of knowledge of consumer law is detrimental to the consumer, but that is obita. I think the fairest and most sensible solution is for the shop to provide free alteration and some compensation for the inconvenience. A claim for breach of condition might just work, but not without the probable considerable time and expense involved.

[Chesterexpress]

I wouldn't quite say foolish. It is after all the shop that has supplied the wrong dress, and the consumer is now having to do all the legwork due to the mistake. Because of the email sent by Zoena, the condition that gave right to recission is now a waranty and only damages can be claimed for. A good demonstration of how lack of knowledge of consumer law is detrimental to the consumer, but that is obita. I think the fairest and most sensible solution is for the shop to provide free alteration and some compensation for the inconvenience. A claim for breach of condition might just work, but not without the probable considerable time and expense involved.

 

Gymo, the OP is in my opinion being foolish in her actions. I have based this on what she has posted. She has wanted this dress for over 12 months but could not afford it, now she has got it at a price she can afford she is willing to throw it away. Therefore I beleive she is acting foolishly or could it be just that she has changed her mind about actually wanting this particular dress? You see some of us look to use common sense and mediation first when necessary, instead of looking to go in all guns blazing and using the threat of legislation.