Beetlejuice vs Egg Card

[Mistermind]

Beetlejuice, the success for every claim depends on what Egg will accept, as Egg claims nowadays simply do not go court.

 

I submitted my charges and Demonstrable Interest reclaim total, then as a separate figure added 8% SI. By return of post Egg offered the former in full and ignored the latter. I could not be bothered to argue the toss and accepted the offer.

 

If you choose to live dangerously and mention "Contractual Interest" by name, Egg may still accept the claim so long as the amount claimed is plausible and within reason. Having presented that figure, there would be no harm in additionally claiming 8% SI per annum on top as a separate figure. The worst they can do to a letter in plain English is to refuse the claim, you can still carry on via the court for the 8% if you wish.

 

3 considerations:

 

(1) The judge may not offer you 8% on top, after you have already claimed interest. In court you cannot claim 8%, only the judge can give it to you without your claiming it.

 

(2) Every time Egg barrister went to court the charge was adjudged to merit a figure around £5, so instead of getting £20, £16 refunded in full you would get £15, £11 from the court. And still you may not get 8%.

 

(3) If court hearing waits for months, the OFT could make a sudden initiative on credit card charges, and ongoing cases could be set aside for months waiting for a decisive verdict from the crunch High Court case. When a verdict comes, there is no guarantee there would be no appeal. Once a decisive lawsuit is under way, for sure, retrospective 100% refund of charges would be a thing of the past.

 

In summary then, no harm in an English letter to Egg claiming as much as you want. If they pare it back slightly, then up to you whether to accept the best available rather than the best imaginable, or go the slow legal route risking the aforementioned hazards. Until your solidified claims reach court, a little bargaining is unlikely to provoke Egg to shut the door on you.

[beetlejuice]

Steven/Mistermind,

 

You are of course both right it is always a question of balance, the banks are so busy with these claims the response is not always predictably consistent as I have found with Natwest (they paid three claims on separate accounts in full but then let one go to court!).

 

I have calculated DI (to date of close of account) and then added their (EGGs') 16.9% on top (to today's date) compounded (mister does your calculation compound the DI?) It doesn't look like it.

 

It matters little as the amounts on this claim are not large. I need to get the argument right as I have larger claims on other cards. These have lots of charges and I don't have all the statements although I do have all the charges (MBNA sent me some lists with dates and charges but no balances or interest rates!).

 

Thanks again for your time, you can see my various claims on the respective cards threads. I'll keep them updated.

 

regards

 

BJ

 

[steven4064]

DI as we have now defined it (and a very useful concept it is) is the interest you actually paid on the charges so it should have all the compounding in it.

[beetlejuice]

Yep, that's what I think 'm not sure MMs' spreadie calculates Compound, can he confirm(this is why I like Mindzai's it does)

 

BJ

 

[steven4064]

I like Mindzai's sheet too (although it seems to have gone from its original plase on the web. However, i have a copy here)

[Mistermind]

Yes my spreadsheet does compute Egg interest compounded monthly exactly as Egg does. Just that itemising newly levied interest month by month to make the process more transparent, checkable, and believable at every stage.

 

This first lot of Demonstrable Interest is straightforward reclaim.

 

Your second lot is brand new claim for compensation. Statutory Interest (Compensation) at 8% per annum is noncompounded simple interest. If you compare your second compounded compensation claim against SI, yours would be noticeably higher.

 

Seeing that even adding simple interest SI on top of (charges + compounded DI) is regarded by many as an optimistic move, adding your second lot of Compound Interest Claim Without a Name (surely not called Contractual Interest? ssssshhhhh, perish the thought) on top of Egg interest already compounded, could raise eyebrows. You could try it with Egg and test the water, and settle for less if they dig in.

 

A new word needs to be found -- to compound what has already been compounded, perhaps comprapounded?

[steven4064]

I think it should be called compensatory interest as it is to compensate you for having had the momey withheld from you - to put things as they would have been if the bank hadn't taken your money

[Mistermind]

Well said, if a card had not levied unlawful charges, who knows how that enforced deprivation of capital might have affected the highways and byways of life?

 

Without that £16 unlawful charge 16 lottery tickets could have been bought, with one of them hitting the jackpot .........We shall never know.

[beetlejuice]

Boy you chaps were up late, I was still painting(the trials of life!).

 

I have to say I'm a firm believer in this Si only being charged when you go to court, as previously stated it's for the judge to award and not a given.

I am happy if it goes to court I could demonstrate the DI (many thanks MM) and at a push make a reasonable argument for Compensatory interest(good name Steve).

 

So the Prelims. gone off lets see what they say. In the end I dabbled with Mindzai's CC v1.1 spreadie to give the compounded

interets Egg have charged me and NCI (New Compensatory Interest!!) on top, if they want to dispute this - and it's walnuts rather than peanuts but still not a huge amount - they can work the figure out for me.

 

I'll keep you posted.

 

If I win I'm going straight out to but £16 in lottery tickets.

 

 

BJ

 

8)

[beetlejuice]

Well as I see Egg owe me about £300.00,

 

They sent a reply saying a customer Services rep would ring me and would I log onto my account to check my details were up to date, so I rang and gave them my mobile no. Lets see how long it takes them to ring. LBA to be drafted this afternoon.!!!

 

BJ

 

[xpuser]

A very thought provoking take on the interest debate. I have claimed against one bank, and am in the process of claiming against MBNA, am claiming contractual interest...but having second thoughts. This will be my third claim.

 

Is it possible for me to pm you, mistermind, for a copy of your spreadsheet?

[beetlejuice]

X,

 

Sorry do you want his (MM) or mine which is an amended Mindzai one following MM's Process.

 

Let me know,

 

regards

BJ

 

[xpuser]

X,

 

Sorry do you want his (MM) or mine which is an amended Mindzai one following MM's Process.

 

Let me know,

 

regards

BJ

 

 

 

I have Mindzai's spreadsheet, however on this you can not enter an interest rate per month. It only allows one rate, that is applied to all charges.

 

I am looking for a spreadsheet where you can enter a rate per month. This can either be an amended Mindzai or MMs either will be fine.

[beetlejuice]

X,

 

Fine PM me and I'll send just delete my amounts.

 

regards

 

 

BJ

[xpuser]

PM sent...thanks

[beetlejuice]

PM replied to good luck

 

BJ

[beetlejuice]

Well, Egg have offered me £140 in charges and £40 in S69 interest. this is some £180 short of my total including DI and CI. I'm now in a quandry whether to pursue the latter, my account is closed so they will have to send me a cheque. I had said previously that I wouldn't settle a claim unless it was for the full amount, the figures they're talking about do cover the charges and interest at 8% but not the interest they have charged me on the charges! IYKWIM! However Egg apparently don't go to Court and the first Solicitors letter would cost them more than my total Claim!.

 

I'll ponder this evening and report back tomorrow.

 

BJ

 

[Mistermind]

One recent claimant told Egg she would go to the FOS, which would cost Egg £360 win lose or draw. Egg had a think then paid up.

[beetlejuice]

that's just about my figure, might be worth a go, although I'm quite happy to take the B****s to court. more to ponder, thanks

 

BJ......

[beetlejuice]

Egg still sticking to guns at £180.00 inc 8% interest.

 

I now discover i was paying PPI (thank heavens the account is closed). I'm going to research this a little more, they still haven't send me my CCA. Time for a more formal request, as it was possibly miss sold as I was working for myself from 2004 onwards.

 

Comments anyone.

 

BJ

 

[steven4064]

Hi BJ

 

If the account is closed (ie no money is owing on it), they don't have to reply to a CCA request:

77(3) Subsection (1) does not apply to--

(a) an agreement under which no sum is, or will or may become, payable by the debtor

However, you should certainly persue the PPI angle. I think they should supply (should have supplied) a copy of the credit agreement under SAR.