Current FSA position; New Tactic from A and L, advice sought ??

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

Hi,

 

Can someone help ?? I'm new to the CAG and the forum and could do with some advice re completing the N1 (Thanks to the CAG I am a good way towards seeking to reclaim charges from the A and L, which in total with interest amount to over £7,000)

 

My query relates to court costs, and the specific part of the form that states:-

 

b) Court costs;

 

c) The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year, from [date when the money became owed to you] to [the date you are issuing the claim] of £ [amount] and also interest at the same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of [enter the daily rate of interest]

WHAT INFORMATION do I enter above. I have a no. of charges I am seeking to reclaim from 2002 to April of this year. What date to I therefore enter as the date the money became owed to me ? Is it the date the first charge was applied or some other date ?? Further, therefore, is the amount of interest the sum of the statutory interest I have applied to all of the charges ?? Equally, how do I work out the daily rate of interest ??

 

Any offers of help or advice would be greatly appreciated as I have found myself stuck.

 

Thanks, Eddie (otherwise known as Annoyed from Caerphilly - not quite as good as the names given in the take offs of Points of View, but I thought it would do ! )

[mochamoo]

N/a:d

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

Hi,

 

Not sure where to go on this one, so hope someone can point me in the right direction.

 

Currently pursuing 3 claims against Alliance and Leicester, currently:-

 

1st letter sent

letter before action sent

3 MCO claims lodged on 15th May, bank has until 3rd June to indicate it's position.

 

Query relates to appropriateness of myself closing my accounts whilst action is still pending.

 

I have a parachute account already up and running (found First Direct to be first rate so far) so am not concerned re lack of a bank account; I am however not sure how appropriate it would be to close my accounts with the A and L.

 

Basically, am still being hit by bank charges, on a revolving basis and cannot afford to pay in sufficient amount to clear small overdraft which is leading to charges being applied each month.

 

Would closing the accounts in any way prejudice my current action ? Do the accounts need to remain open for action to proceed.

 

Have my own thoughts on matter (that it would be OK to close as action relates to breach of contract when contract was in force) but I am in no way clear re this and thought I had better check.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks

 

Eddie

[MARTIN3030]

As far as I am aware closing your account yourself should not affect any legal action,especially as you have very good reason and can show this.

Under Codes of practice though banks are required to serve a period of notice before they close it themselves.

And of course Compensation can be awarded against them by the FOS if it can be shown that they have closed an account or taken adverse action on it as a result of the customer claiming back their unlawful penalty charges.

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

(Excuse the length of this one but there is much to discuss !!)

 

Hi,

 

Am some way down the road with A and L

 

In total (with interest) am seeking to claim £7,440.03 plus court costs, the accumulation of charges across 3 accounts.

 

First letters sent: 4th April

L'sBA: 24th April

MCO submission: 15th May

 

Have today received two letters from Wragge & Co (allegedly Solicitors for A and L; I prefer to call them soul sellers !) who have stated that A and L intend to defend my actions.

 

However I have also received the following letter from A and L:

 

In respect of your claim for a refund of fees on your current account, as you may be aware the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) is currently reviewing the issue of current account charges. It is our understanding that they have suggested that there may be some similarities between the default charges on credit cards and similar charges applied to current accounts, however, it recognises that the application of the general principles set out in 2006 to the banking industry is not straight forward and that a more detailed examination is needed in relation to bank charges.

Default charges may apply to current accounts when items are presented for payment whilst the account is in excess of its overdraft limit and are returned unpaid (bounced) and a fee is charged. We do not believe that the term applies to other types of fee.

We believe that our charges have been made in accordance with the Terms and Conditions of your account, of which you have been given a copy. However, having considered the particular circumstances of your case and taking into account the OFT review, in order to resolve this matter, we are prepared to refund the sum of £***, which includes the court fee of £120.

This reflects the difference between the amount of charges for unpaid items actually applied to your account and the amount of charges that would have been applied to your account if the charge had been £12. On the basis that this offer is acceptable to you, we enclose a cheque for £*** (being the amount that the OFT indicated was not unreasonable in relation to credit card default charges) in full and final settlement. If you do not wish to accept this offer please return the cheque to us cancelled or confirm in writing that it has been destroyed.

 

You may have seen media reports that some banks have considered closing certain customers' accounts where the customer has complained about bank charges. We would like to re-assure you that if you do accept our offer of settlement we will continue to operate your account. We would only do so on the basis that you accept the Terms and Conditions of your account previously notified to you and that charges will be applied in accordance with our current charging policy.

 

We would stress that as the OFT has not concluded its review, the offer of settlement contained in this letter is made on an entirely ex gratia basis and without any acceptance by us that £12 is an appropriate charge for returning an item unpaid.

This letter is written without prejudice to any contention that the Alliance & Leicester may have for saying you do not have a reasonable cause of action against us or that you do not have a reasonable prospect of succeeding in any claim you may bring.

Yours sincerely,

Sprogett and Sylvester !

In essence they have offered:-

 

£619.50 in respect of the account for which I was seeking £1,354.86 plus costs, and

£984.50 for the other account in which I was seeking £3,949.73 plus costs

No reply re third claim (??)

 

Can anyone help or advise in respect of the following:-

 

1. What is your view re the current soundings from the OFT ?

2. Is A and L's position reasonable ? ( I don't believe it is as it seems a mulch of a no. of positions, but wondered what you thought ??)

3. Alternatively, is it a new and devious strategy - indicate they intend to defend the action whilst simultaneously making a derisory offer

4. Is there the option of cashing the cheques and continuing to pursue the claim ?

For example, could I respond to each letter along the lines of ' I accept your cheque, not as full and final settlement but as part payment of the total sum I am seeking to claim from you, I shall deem you to have accepted my counter response unless I have heard from you in 7 days ' ??

Is this worth a go ??

5. I have sought to claim for the following charges, for : Failed cheques; Paid Items; Unauthorised Overdrafts; Failed DD's - I presume that the A and L cannot limit their liability to merely charges for bounced cheques ??

6. I hope I have not made a mistake, but I have also sought to claim for Monthly overdraft charges (only a small % age of the total number of charges). Given such charges were £25 each is it reasonable for me to seek to reclaim, or regrettably would it be seen as a reasonable fee for a service ??

 

Excuse the long thread, but I would be greatly for any assistance, advice or opinion.

 

Cheers,

 

Eddie

(now bloody fuming from Caerphilly !):?

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

Hi, I have just posted a thread in the Alliance and Leicester Sub-forum re a no. of issues, as indicated by title.

 

Am also seeking advice re reasonableness of cashing a cheque sent in full and final settlement yet well short of the amount claimed.

 

Any advice or support would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

 

All the best, Eddie

[pinkerton_angel]

Hi,

I've received exactly the same 2 letters from A&L today and unsure what to do next.

If we refuse their offer, will this look unreasonable in court?

Can someone please advise???

Thanks

Pinky

[Parkvale]

A F C, this might help you. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/25716-rejecting-offers.html Post any new questions on your new thread on A&L forum. Good luck.

[Bookworm]

Can anyone help or advise in respect of the following:-

 

1. What is your view re the current soundings from the OFT ? The OFT have said that only a court can decide what constitutes a lawful charge, so ignore that.

2. Is A and L's position reasonable ? No.

3. Alternatively, is it a new and devious strategy - indicate they intend to defend the action whilst simultaneously making a derisory offer Yes. They're trying to mitigate their loss by hopefully scaring you into accepting a lower settlement.

4. Is there the option of cashing the cheques and continuing to pursue the claim ?

For example, could I respond to each letter along the lines of ' I accept your cheque, not as full and final settlement but as part payment of the total sum I am seeking to claim from you, I shall deem you to have accepted my counter response unless I have heard from you in 7 days ' ??

Is this worth a go ?? There is a letter in the Library for accepting part-offers. Some banks will withdraw the partial offer, some won't. Adapt your claim accordingly.

5. I have sought to claim for the following charges, for : Failed cheques; Paid Items; Unauthorised Overdrafts; Failed DD's - I presume that the A and L cannot limit their liability to merely charges for bounced cheques ?? Correct.

6. I hope I have not made a mistake, but I have also sought to claim for Monthly overdraft charges (only a small % age of the total number of charges). Given such charges were £25 each is it reasonable for me to seek to reclaim, or regrettably would it be seen as a reasonable fee for a service ?? That depends on whether that was the fee for arranging an o/draft, or whether it is the fee charged every time you go into unauthorised borrowing. If the latter, claim.

 

 

So there you are. Hope I have answered all your queries.

[Bookworm]

4 threads merged, please keep to 1 thread per claim for all your updates and queries.

[pinkerton_angel]

Keep me updated as to what you do next AFC, looks like we put our MCOL'S in on the same day so exactly same stage!

I'm going for £4900, chq they sent today was for approx £1500!!

Pinky

[j.barton1]

Hi, Alot of people have got this offer of the excess of £12 lately, i would advise to return the cheques with the thanks but no thanks letter and continue your claim. They are trying to scare you and put you off.

You're on the home stretch now...go for it.

 

Jenny

[pinkerton_angel]

Thanks Jenny,

It really helps to get some wise words of support!!

Have felt like giving up a few times and then I come on here again and read everyone's stories.

Pinky

[j.barton1]

Hi and thanks..here is a link to my thread, it might help you a little bit, i've been through pretty much the same as you...

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/alliance-leicester/56153-hi-all.html

 

Jenny

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

So there you are. Hope I have answered all your queries.

Many thanks - I was getting a bit lost. Also, funny isn't it, by day I am an employment relations adviser and happily mix it with the best of them. Yet as soon as I try to take on a bank, my education and knowledge goes out of the window, and I'm turned into a quivering wreck ! Thanks for your advice and support. This site is invaluable. Many, many thanks.

[pinkerton_angel]

Hi AFC,

Are you going to send the cheque back with a rejection letter now? that's what I'm planning to do.

Interesting that we are at exactly the same stage but we also do the same job!! and yes it is daunting even when you're used to dealing with people all day long!

This forum has kept me going

Pinky

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

Hi, Looking into things. Will get back to you. Cheers, Eddie

[joe1969]

Hi AFC,

I have just sent my cheque back with a rejection letter , as they only offered me less than %10 of my full claim.

Joe

[bobthecabbie]

hi, ive also received all the above from a&l and from wragge. with respect to the letter about keeping account open if i accept offer i sent letter rejecting offer and telling them that this is equivalent of either a veiled threat at the least and blackmail at worse. since had another letter from bank saying that they are looking into my claim. more delaying tactics.

 

also, have sent second nudge letter today asking to settle claim by tues or i will instruct solicitors to act for me incurring them further costs should they loose. i have found a good solicitor in bristol who is willing to take on bank claims

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

Hi, Bookworm

 

Am in a predicament and would welcome your thoughts.

 

Having read the section you referred me to ( ' rejecting partial offers ' ) I can see that as A and L made an offer in full and final settlement after I had commenced court action I cannot accept their chq's as partial payment of money owed, and my only option is to return each cheque, using letter 5 from the aforementioned section as a template.

 

However, I am in a hell of a financial hole at the moment and though I don't wish to do so could really do with cashing one of the cheques.

 

Would it be wise though to settle one claim and continue to pursue the other two ? Would doing so in any way prejudice my other claims ? Or do I have the option of accepting the one, clearly indicating in my acceptance letter that I did so 'without prejudice' (thus precluding A and L from referring to my acceptance in Court)

 

Hate to give up on 1 of the 3 claims now but feel it is my only option.

 

What do think ???

[Russjo]

I know how you feel about the financial situation, but I would be inclined to think that if you buckle on one, it may give the wrong impression on the others. I'm no expert, but hang in there, it will all be worth it. Good luck

 

Jo

[blue.pricey]

i think and this is only my opinion you have to do what is best for you i don't think anyone will think any worse of you if you did settle one but only you can decide just stay strong what doesn't kill us makes us stronger good luck

[pinkerton_angel]

Hi AFC,

What's the latest? what stage are you at now? or have you managed to get a settlement?

They've defended mine and sent my notice of transfer of proceedings so just waiting for a court date now.

pinky

[Annoyed from Caerphilly]

Hi AFC,

What's the latest? what stage are you at now? or have you managed to get a settlement?

They've defended mine and sent my notice of transfer of proceedings so just waiting for a court date now.

pinky

 

Hi Angel,

 

A and L have defended my case also. They did make an offer of settlement but it was much less that I was seeking to claim. After much agonising I sent the cheques back and indicated I intended to proceed with the case. I'm now due in Cardiff County Court on 14th August, so am furiously getting my bundle of documents together. Feel I must go through with it !! Regards

[younganfree]

Hi Angel,

 

A and L have defended my case also. They did make an offer of settlement but it was much less that I was seeking to claim. After much agonising I sent the cheques back and indicated I intended to proceed with the case. I'm now due in Cardiff County Court on 14th August, so am furiously getting my bundle of documents together. Feel I must go through with it !! Regards

Just wanted to say "Well done for sticking to your guns, dude!".