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    • Post in Suing a parcel delivery company when you don't have a direct contract with them – third-party rights Copy of judgment available

      BankFodder posted a post in a topic,

      We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Parcel delivery insurance is prohibited under section 57 – Consumer Rights Act – Read about It Here and in The Times.

Tanzarelli v Cap One... £ + default **WON**

TANZARELLI

By TANZARELLI
in Other Institutions Successes

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caro

caro

Posted
Posted
Cheers, it took some time but we got there in the end. lol (With some great help from J2B to boot)

 

Should have guessed Jonni had a hand in it.;)

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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ony

ony

Posted
Posted
I would just add to Willow's excellent post that I have claimed contractual against Cap One at 34.9%. My charges did go back almost 6 years but, it did turn around £500 of charges into a total claim of £2600 so, it may be worth throwing your charges onto Vamp's spreadie at 34.9% just to see if it is worth the extra time delay of starting again (don't forget as well that the amount is compounded daily so, the extra wait only adds to the amount)

 

Hi,

 

been reading this thread with interest but just wanted some clarification on the correct contractual interest to appy. In my letters to Cap1 I had been using 22.44% (monthly rate x12) but I see you used 34.9%. Is this supportable; it would take my claim from £864.60 to £1318.59. Here's my thread: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/capital-one/93853-ony-capital-one.html

 

I am about to send my LBA to Cap1 as thy have refused my refund request. If I use the 34.9% instead would a sentence in my LBA advising them of this and the revised higher figure suffice?

 

thx

  • Barclaycard (2 Accounts) CCA sent to both on 20.5.07 (defaulted)
  • MBNA CCA defaulted 14.6.07 (Claim £2600)
  • Capital one: Reject offer LBA 18.6.07
  • HSBC/Metropolitan/DG Solicitors: Credit agreement not found by DG Solicitors. Sent new CCA to Metropolitan 18.6.07 with original timeline 18th May 2007.

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TANZARELLI

TANZARELLI

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Hi,

 

been reading this thread with interest but just wanted some clarification on the correct contractual interest to appy. In my letters to Cap1 I had been using 22.44% (monthly rate x12) but I see you used 34.9%. Is this supportable; it would take my claim from £864.60 to £1318.59. Here's my thread: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/capital-one/93853-ony-capital-one.html

 

I am about to send my LBA to Cap1 as thy have refused my refund request. If I use the 34.9% instead would a sentence in my LBA advising them of this and the revised higher figure suffice?

 

thx

 

This is the rate for the capital one classic credit card:

 

Typical 34.9% APR variable

https://www.capitalone.co.uk/web/raid/templates/formdual_temp_10_001.jsp?page_id=10400&context_id=2&step=1&product_id=2400

 

Tanz

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TECHSPEC

TECHSPEC

Posted
Posted

How do we work out the contractual rate.

 

I used Martins calculator for the 8% rate.

[COLOR=#2e8b57][B][SIZE=1][U]Claimed & won so far[/U]:-[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen][U]Banks[/U]:- NatWest Personal £1000, Natwest Business £2000, Lloyds TSB Personal £1500, [U]Mortgages[/U]:-Central Capital (PPI) £500, Natwest MEAF £140 [/COLOR][COLOR=#2e8b57][U]Credit cards[/U]:- HSBC Gold card £365, Capital One £599.55 Barclaycard £1070 ( i only aske for £700) , Lloyds £500 [U]Catalogues[/U]:- Littlewoods Direct Flex Account £60 :D [/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][B][U]For Friends[/U][/B]:- Natwest £1500, £1800 & £500, Cap One £600, Barclaycard £400, Solutions £100, Aqua, £105.[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][B][U][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen]Pending:-[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/B] [COLOR=seagreen][SIZE=1]Barclays Bank Personal (On hold - Thanks a lot OFT) :mad:.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR]

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TECHSPEC

TECHSPEC

Posted
Posted

Cap One will be my first credit card court case.

 

Can anyone point me to the POC template, and how to apply contractual rate interest.

[COLOR=#2e8b57][B][SIZE=1][U]Claimed & won so far[/U]:-[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen][U]Banks[/U]:- NatWest Personal £1000, Natwest Business £2000, Lloyds TSB Personal £1500, [U]Mortgages[/U]:-Central Capital (PPI) £500, Natwest MEAF £140 [/COLOR][COLOR=#2e8b57][U]Credit cards[/U]:- HSBC Gold card £365, Capital One £599.55 Barclaycard £1070 ( i only aske for £700) , Lloyds £500 [U]Catalogues[/U]:- Littlewoods Direct Flex Account £60 :D [/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][B][U]For Friends[/U][/B]:- Natwest £1500, £1800 & £500, Cap One £600, Barclaycard £400, Solutions £100, Aqua, £105.[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][B][U][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen]Pending:-[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/B] [COLOR=seagreen][SIZE=1]Barclays Bank Personal (On hold - Thanks a lot OFT) :mad:.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR]

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TANZARELLI

TANZARELLI

Posted
  • Author
Posted

What are you claiming CI under as you may be aware there has been a precedent set stating CI can not be claimed under the Implied terms of Mutuality and Reciprocity so you would need to read up about other angles which may be more difficult for credit card claims, such as Equity due to breach of fiduciary relationship which is hard to prove anyway but the relationship with a credit card provider is different to that of your bank. IMHO

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elizabeth1

elizabeth1

Posted
Posted
Cap One will be my first credit card court case.

 

Can anyone point me to the POC template, and how to apply contractual rate interest.

 

You'll find POC's in here

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/681-4-particulars-claim-n1.html

 

Then spreadsheets are in the template Library - with the letters

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TECHSPEC

TECHSPEC

Posted
Posted

Thanks elizabeth1 & TANZARELLI.

 

I have looked at the spreadsheets, and havent got a clue, so will stick to Martin's 8% calculator. I have read of a few problems with CI, and would like things to go smoothly.

 

Many thanks for the POC link - much appreciated.

[COLOR=#2e8b57][B][SIZE=1][U]Claimed & won so far[/U]:-[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen][U]Banks[/U]:- NatWest Personal £1000, Natwest Business £2000, Lloyds TSB Personal £1500, [U]Mortgages[/U]:-Central Capital (PPI) £500, Natwest MEAF £140 [/COLOR][COLOR=#2e8b57][U]Credit cards[/U]:- HSBC Gold card £365, Capital One £599.55 Barclaycard £1070 ( i only aske for £700) , Lloyds £500 [U]Catalogues[/U]:- Littlewoods Direct Flex Account £60 :D [/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][B][U]For Friends[/U][/B]:- Natwest £1500, £1800 & £500, Cap One £600, Barclaycard £400, Solutions £100, Aqua, £105.[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][B][U][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen]Pending:-[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/B] [COLOR=seagreen][SIZE=1]Barclays Bank Personal (On hold - Thanks a lot OFT) :mad:.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR]

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TANZARELLI

TANZARELLI

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Thanks elizabeth1 & TANZARELLI.

 

I have looked at the spreadsheets, and havent got a clue, so will stick to Martin's 8% calculator. I have read of a few problems with CI, and would like things to go smoothly.

 

Many thanks for the POC link - much appreciated.

 

IMHO and without some serious reading up on CI in equity or AoP etc, I think you have made the right choice, good luck with it anyway a smooth 8% claim is fairly straight forward and unless you make some big mistakes you will win without a doubt.

 

Tanz

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Alphageek

Alphageek

Posted
Posted
What are you claiming CI under as you may be aware there has been a precedent set stating CI can not be claimed under the Implied terms of Mutuality and Reciprocity

 

Can you elaborate on this please?

The REAL Axis of evil: Banks, Credit Card Companies & Credit Reference Agencies.

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TANZARELLI

TANZARELLI

Posted
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Posted
Can you elaborate on this please?

 

See here for more info: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/halifax-bank-bank-scotland/97691-contractual-interest-precedent-lost.html

 

But basically dad (not mine) took a CI claim to the high court and it was ruled against him in regards to the CI using M&R.

 

This now means a precedent has been set. The only other way to take this rooute now is to go for disgorgement of profits under equity using Account of Profits. So lots more reading and searching for caselaw on the cards. It is now now advisable to enter claims for CI using the M&R arguement.

 

HTH

 

 

Tanz

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  • 4 weeks later...
TECHSPEC

TECHSPEC

Posted
Posted

Crap one defended mine today. Is this normal, as i heared they were paying up?

[COLOR=#2e8b57][B][SIZE=1][U]Claimed & won so far[/U]:-[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen][U]Banks[/U]:- NatWest Personal £1000, Natwest Business £2000, Lloyds TSB Personal £1500, [U]Mortgages[/U]:-Central Capital (PPI) £500, Natwest MEAF £140 [/COLOR][COLOR=#2e8b57][U]Credit cards[/U]:- HSBC Gold card £365, Capital One £599.55 Barclaycard £1070 ( i only aske for £700) , Lloyds £500 [U]Catalogues[/U]:- Littlewoods Direct Flex Account £60 :D [/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][B][U]For Friends[/U][/B]:- Natwest £1500, £1800 & £500, Cap One £600, Barclaycard £400, Solutions £100, Aqua, £105.[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][B][U][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen]Pending:-[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/B] [COLOR=seagreen][SIZE=1]Barclays Bank Personal (On hold - Thanks a lot OFT) :mad:.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR]

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Armsoft

Armsoft

Posted
Posted
Crap one defended mine today. Is this normal, as i heared they were paying up?

 

When you say "Defended" I assume you mean that you have received notification of their intention to defend?

This is standard practice with Cap1, you should receive communication from them within 21 advising of settlement, then settlement within a further 28 days.

 

HTH

VIEWS EXPRESSED ARE MY OWN - IF THEY HELP - PLEASE CLICK MY SCALES

Halifax - S.A.R - June 06

- Pre-Lim(£1665) July 06

- LBA - July 06

- MCOL - 15th Aug 06

- Acknowledged 18th Aug

- Settled IN FULL :eek:

- 2nd Claim Started - 12 Dec 2006

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

- 3rd Claim Started (Phone Call) 1st March 2007

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

Abbey National - S.A.R - 23/08/06

- Default Removal Letter sent 21st Sept

- LBA sent with Estimated Charges 4/10/06

- 2nd LBA 23/10/06

- N1 filed 9/11/06 - Deemed Served 16/11/06

- AQ & Draft Directions filed 19/12/06

- Court Hearing 22/3/07

- SETTLED IN FULL:o INCLUDING £5k COMPENSATION

Capital One - S.A.R. 10/10/06

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

Alliance & Leicester - Mortgage E/S/C Claim 02/03/07

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

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TECHSPEC

TECHSPEC

Posted
Posted

It just says they have said they will defend, and are disputing the whole amount, and that no more action can take place online, as it as been transferred to my local court.

 

But you have both raised my spirits.

[COLOR=#2e8b57][B][SIZE=1][U]Claimed & won so far[/U]:-[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen][U]Banks[/U]:- NatWest Personal £1000, Natwest Business £2000, Lloyds TSB Personal £1500, [U]Mortgages[/U]:-Central Capital (PPI) £500, Natwest MEAF £140 [/COLOR][COLOR=#2e8b57][U]Credit cards[/U]:- HSBC Gold card £365, Capital One £599.55 Barclaycard £1070 ( i only aske for £700) , Lloyds £500 [U]Catalogues[/U]:- Littlewoods Direct Flex Account £60 :D [/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][B][U]For Friends[/U][/B]:- Natwest £1500, £1800 & £500, Cap One £600, Barclaycard £400, Solutions £100, Aqua, £105.[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][B][U][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen]Pending:-[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/B] [COLOR=seagreen][SIZE=1]Barclays Bank Personal (On hold - Thanks a lot OFT) :mad:.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR]

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Armsoft

Armsoft

Posted
Posted
It just says they have said they will defend, and are disputing the whole amount, and that no more action can take place online, as it as been transferred to my local court.

 

But you have both raised my spirits.

 

TECHSPEC

Its the same as all other cases for Cap1 they just say they are going to defend to buy themselves some more time to arrange to settle with you.

Their defence to the court will be that they owe you nothing, as they will have already paid you the money by then.

Spend Wisely

VIEWS EXPRESSED ARE MY OWN - IF THEY HELP - PLEASE CLICK MY SCALES

Halifax - S.A.R - June 06

- Pre-Lim(£1665) July 06

- LBA - July 06

- MCOL - 15th Aug 06

- Acknowledged 18th Aug

- Settled IN FULL :eek:

- 2nd Claim Started - 12 Dec 2006

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

- 3rd Claim Started (Phone Call) 1st March 2007

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

Abbey National - S.A.R - 23/08/06

- Default Removal Letter sent 21st Sept

- LBA sent with Estimated Charges 4/10/06

- 2nd LBA 23/10/06

- N1 filed 9/11/06 - Deemed Served 16/11/06

- AQ & Draft Directions filed 19/12/06

- Court Hearing 22/3/07

- SETTLED IN FULL:o INCLUDING £5k COMPENSATION

Capital One - S.A.R. 10/10/06

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

Alliance & Leicester - Mortgage E/S/C Claim 02/03/07

- SETTLED IN FULL:eek:

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ukaviator

ukaviator

Posted
Posted
It just says they have said they will defend, and are disputing the whole amount, and that no more action can take place online, as it as been transferred to my local court.

 

But you have both raised my spirits.

 

 

This is quite normal with Capital One. . you should hear very soon from them..

 

Uk

WARNING TO ALL

Please be aware of acting on advice given by PM .Anyone can make mistakes and if advice is given on the main forum people can see it to correct it ,if given privately then no one can see it to correct it. Please also be aware of giving your personal details to strangers

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TECHSPEC

TECHSPEC

Posted
Posted

I want one of your crystal balls lol.

 

Letter recieved today offering full amount of £699.55.

 

Happy Days :D

 

I filled in my friends against crap 1 same day, so hopefully they have the same letter. :)

 

Thanks to you all for keeping my chin up.

 

Will donate to site shortly.

[COLOR=#2e8b57][B][SIZE=1][U]Claimed & won so far[/U]:-[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen][U]Banks[/U]:- NatWest Personal £1000, Natwest Business £2000, Lloyds TSB Personal £1500, [U]Mortgages[/U]:-Central Capital (PPI) £500, Natwest MEAF £140 [/COLOR][COLOR=#2e8b57][U]Credit cards[/U]:- HSBC Gold card £365, Capital One £599.55 Barclaycard £1070 ( i only aske for £700) , Lloyds £500 [U]Catalogues[/U]:- Littlewoods Direct Flex Account £60 :D [/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][SIZE=1][B][U]For Friends[/U][/B]:- Natwest £1500, £1800 & £500, Cap One £600, Barclaycard £400, Solutions £100, Aqua, £105.[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#2e8b57][B][U][SIZE=1][COLOR=seagreen]Pending:-[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/B] [COLOR=seagreen][SIZE=1]Barclays Bank Personal (On hold - Thanks a lot OFT) :mad:.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR]

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