Lowells Claimform - old LLoyds TSB Credit Card 'debt'

[Guest]

ok

you said prior #10 that you had had a def notice. was it wholly compliant in form?

re things being prior to april 2007, they wld need to show that there was a signed doc containing at least all of the prescribed terms.

[dx100uk]

Today I received more mail from Lowells in response to my CPR 31.14 request ; a notice of assignment and notice of their solicitors taking over the account.

 

They're saying that the documents they sent me previously are a copy of the agreement (attached in initial post) as requested under s78 and a statement of account.

 

This is a pre 2007 debt, what they claim is a copy of the consumer credit agreement appears to be a copy paste job, has errors in the address (postcode from an address 10 years later), no signatures and no dates.

 

How do I respond?

 

You don't respond....

Scan the stuff up to one multipage PDF

Upload

[ufk]

ok

you said prior #10 that you had had a def notice. was it wholly compliant in form?

I honestly couldn't tell you, it was 4 odd years ago, and I was too busy dealing with more serious issues to take notice.

 

re things being prior to april 2007, they wld need to show that there was a signed doc containing at least all of the prescribed terms.

Should I tell them this, or should I let them carry on being incompetent?

 

I'm assuming that the account start date (04/2004) is the date that applies.

 

Unfortunately I'm having troubles uploading a scan of the documents they sent me, so I've plonked them on google drive.

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BykSmuZdQNJyTEVPN2xHc0ZzVU0

 

Edit~ just checked the court timetable, I've got to have my defence in by the 23 April, and due to a cockup on my part I can't use MCOL to do it

doc1.pdf

Edited April 6, 2017 by ufk

[dx100uk]

if the claim was issued 21st march then..21st april by 4pm as 33rd day is a sunday.

 

they've still must produce the dn via cpr or a disclosure stage.

 

no you don't tell anyone esp the claimant..

 

 

done your upload for you

so a series threat-o-grams

and a notice of assignment.

[ufk]

Thanks very much, I shall let them continue to be incompetent while I try and sort a defence.

 

Presently it's along the lines of :

Yes I have had a LLyods credit card in the past. Due to the my LLyods credit account being opened prior to April 2007, Lowells' response to my s78 request has failed to meet the relevant requirements;as such the debt is still in dispute and thus currently unenforceable.

 

 

If they can produce the right paperwork, I'll come to some sort of arrangement with them, but I'll make the buggers sweat for it.

Edited April 6, 2017 by ufk

[dx100uk]

you need to be mindful that they returned you £1 fee

so that absolved them from having to 'comply' with the act.

 

 

its a clever tactic.

 

 

however

id be filing the std holding /no paperwork defence

sadly not including your notes

their POC is vague

your defence will be equally vague.

less is more

use the search cag box top red toolbar

 

 

Lowell claimform credit card

[ufk]

you need to be mindful that they returned you £1 fee

so that absolved them from having to 'comply' with the act.

As far as I know they kept the £1 fee, I've certainly not received it back.

[ufk]

If someone could look this over I'd be grateful, I'll use the fact that the account was started in 2004 if that's relevant but I'd rather keep it to myself than help them out. I think I'll save it for the witness statement.

 

 

1.The defendant entered into a consumer credit act 1974 agreement with LLoyds Banking Group PLC under account reference xxxxxxxx (the agreement)

 

2.The defendant failed to maintain the required payments and a default notice was served and not complied with.

 

3.The agreement was later assigned to the claimant on 24/11/2015 and notice given to the defendant.

 

4.Despite repeated requests for payment, the sum of £3069 remains due and outstanding.

 

And the claimant claims

 

the said sum of £3069

 

interest pursuant to s69 county court act 1984 at the rate of 8% p/a from the date of assignment to the date of issue, accruing at a daily rate of £0.673, but limited to one year, being £245.51

Costs

 

My proposed defence.

 

1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature.

 

The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

2. Paragraph 1 is noted. I have in the past had an agreement with Lloyds Bank PLC but do not recognise this specific account number and have therefore requested clarification by way of a CPR 31.14 and (s)78 request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

3. Paragraph 2 is noted however I do not recall having been served with a Default Notice pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

4. Paragraph 3 is noted I am aware of a legal assignment or Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law and Property Act 1925 Section 136(1)

 

5. On receipt of the claim, a request was made via CPR 31.14 to the claimants solicitor, requesting disclosure of all documents on which the Claimant is basing their claim. To date this request has not been fully complied with.

 

6. It is therefore not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

 

a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement and;

b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for and;

c) show the nature of the breach and evidence by way of a Default Notice pursuant to sec 88 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim

 

7. As per Civil Procedure 16.5 it is expected that the claimants prove the allegation that the money is owed

 

8. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

Edited April 11, 2017 by ufk

[dx100uk]

On the DD/MM/YYYY ( sent by recorded delivery) I requested information pertaining to this claim by way of a CPR 31.14 request and a Section 78 request. The claimant solicitor has failed to date to respond to the CPR and remains in default of the section 78 request.

 

 

not due till 4pm Friday week.

[ufk]

Thanks dx100uk, I'll edit that accordingly with the dates for the (s)78 and CPR 31.14 requests.

 

Deadline for me is Tuesday of next week, got to do it by post because I made a colossal cockup with MCOL and can,t access the case; they can't help either I've already tried their tech support.

 

It now reads.

 

My proposed defence.

 

1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature.

 

The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

2. Paragraph 1 is noted. I have in the past had an agreement with Lloyds Bank PLC but do not recognise this specific account number and therefore in October 2016 (sent first class signed for) I made a s(78) request under the Consumer Credit act 1974, furthermore on the 01/04/2017 (sent first class signed for) I requested information pertaining to this claim by way of a CPR 31.14 request.

 

3. Paragraph 2 is noted however I do not recall having been served with a Default Notice pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

4. Paragraph 3 is noted I am aware of a legal assignment or Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law and Property Act 1925 Section 136(1)

 

5. On receipt of the claim, a request was made via CPR 31.14 to the claimants solicitor, requesting disclosure of all documents on which the Claimant is basing their claim. The claimant solicitor has failed to date to respond to the CPR and remains in default of the section 78 request.

 

6. It is therefore not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

 

a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement and;

b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for and;

c) show the nature of the breach and evidence by way of a Default Notice pursuant to sec 88 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim

 

7. As per Civil Procedure 16.5 it is expected that the claimants prove the allegation that the money is owed

 

8. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

Edited April 11, 2017 by ufk

[dx100uk]

1. does not need to be numbered

 

its a coverall statement of the points below it.

 

the claimform date is 21st march

so your defence does not need to be filed till/by Friday 21st april.

 

and the claimant remains in default of the CCA section 78 request.

 

removed the repeat in point one of CCA/CPR

[ufk]

Lowells have now sent me a copy of a directions questionnaire and followed it up with another copy of what they claim to be a copy of the Consumer Credit Agreement;

 

 

the new CCA is a repeat of the last one and still has exactly the same mistakes in the address used,

the postcode is wrong for the address I was living at when the account was started, it's from an address 8-10 years later.

 

They've admitted in the latest letter that the account was started on 9/4/2004 but have still failed to provide a proper CCA that complies with the requirements of a section 78 request for debts predating 2007.

 

When I receive the directions questionnaire from the court I shall post again seeking advice.

[AndyOrch]

Would be advisable to upload a copy of this agreement if not already ufk

 

Andy

[ufk]

it's pretty much identical to the one already linked in the thread, however I'll get this latest one, and the accompanying letter, scanned and uploaded over the weekend.

[AndyOrch]

Yes we need to see your not some other posters thats identical.

[ufk]

Sorry to necro the thread, I forgot all about it and think it deserves some closure.

 

Many thanks to all who helped me, Lowells discontinued the case the day before it was due in court.

 

I've had the confirmation from the court and it's now framed on the wall. The default itself has been removed from my credit file, although it was due to become statute barred in mid October anyway.

 

1 down a few more to go, 1/1/19 is a momentous day, because the last one goes statute barred on the 31/12/18; assuming the default date is the date the clock started ticking, mid September if the clocks are triggered by a couple of missed payments.

[dx100uk]

nope

there is no link between defaulted date and SB date.

 

sb date is your last payment or useage..

[ufk]

That's good news, it makes a couple barred next month. I take it that's what people mean when the use the term cause of action?

 

I'm going to err on the safe side though and use the DF date as I've heard that DCA's sometime like to try and convince courts that's when the clock starts; and I'll be section 78ing anyone who comes after them for a CCA and statement of account for definitive last payment dates, as I only have a rough idea to within a couple of months.

Edited July 24, 2018 by ufk

[dx100uk]

cause of action..last payment date..that is the cause of the action of the debt being defaulted..the service of a default notice.

 

theres no point in sending a CCA request..the debt is statute barred..if anything you send our statute barred leter..in the debt collection section of our library.

 

if you want to know the last payment date ..go ring the OC and ASK them...

 

as for the dca's trying the default dodge date in court..no dice if properly defended.

 

have you moved since taking these out

and have you informed either the OC or the DCA of your current correct address?

 

re Backdoor CCJ's?

 

when did you last check your credit file?

[ufk]

theres no point in sending a CCA Requesticon..the debt is statute barred..if anything you send our statute barred leter..in the debt collection section of our library.

Oh I know, I just like to make them work for a living I'd request everything, and then tell them it's statute barred; and have the paperwork to back it up.

 

have you moved since taking these out

and have you informed either the OC or the DCA of your current correct address?

 

I have moved, all 3 CRAs have my correct current and previous addresses going back more than a decade; I'm on the electoral roll at my current address for over 3 years, and was on it at my previous address for 4. A couple of them show my previous address on my credit report, but the love letters come to my current address.

 

re Backdoor CCJ's?

 

when did you last check your credit file?

Sunday, it gets checked on noddle clearscore and experian at least twice a month.

 

No CCJ's listed.

[dx100uk]

have you informed either the OC or the DCA of your current correct address?

 

just because you get a phishing letter to the address you are at does not answer the above...

[ufk]

have you informed either the OC or the DCA of your current correct address?

 

just because you get a phishing letter to the address you are at does not answer the above...

 

The answer to that is no as far as I know.

[dx100uk]

you risk a backdoor CCJ then

they are quite legally allowed to serve everything to the last known address

never run from debt...

 

is this your only debt where you've done this SB'd or otherwise

sb'd does not play a part until you inform them of such

a robo claim never sees a human being and will be rubberstamped by dafult because it was not defenced.

[ufk]

Any mail to my previous address, which is the one that a couple of them have listed and is registered with the original creditors, is given to me within a couple of days as the person living there is my landlords son so it wouldn't be a problem even if they did serve the paperwork to that address.

 

I'm a bit loathe to contact them this close to the SB date unless I absolutely have to, as I understand it they should practice due diligence with reference to my address before starting proceedings for a CCJ, given that the information is available to them via electoral role and credit reference agencies it's not exactly hard for them to find me; although I do see your point.

 

I'll certainly keep an eye on my credit file and mail to my old address just in case; and given what you've said I think it may be wise to send a SB letter if I get any communications after the relevant dates, no point in messing with them after the fact.