Used Partner's Student Oyster Card **SETTLED BEFORE COURT**

[ICG]

Dear all,

 

 

Some little advice please. I've read other people's threads on the same subject but cannot find all the information I seek.

 

In January, I was caught with my g/f's student oyster card. I did only do it a handful of times but will not try and justify my actions.

 

When I first received a letter from TFL, I wrote back with a full apology, an offer to pay fines and assoc. costs and explaining how I have never had been in trouble with the law before and how negatively this could affect my future career prospects.

 

I have received a mag. court summons this morning for the 20th of May. From what I've read on here, I think I'm going to write to the prosecutor from TFL requesting a settlement out of court and hope for the best.

 

My questions to you are: if I end up pleading guilty, how serious will the charge be? Will it be a CCJ? Will future employers see it when applying for a new job? I'm due to visit the US at the end of the year, will this stop me entering?

 

Also, I hear about people getting out of things on technicalities... They have noted in the summons that I was stopped at Acton Town station... When in fact I was nowhere near there. Would a wily solicitor get me off on something like that??

 

Thanks in advance

[honeybee13]

Hello and welcome to CAG. The forum guys should be along later with advice for you.

 

Please could you tell us which law you're being charged please?

 

My best, HB

[ICG]

Hi HB, thanks for the response.

 

It states:

 

That you are on 20 to January 2015 at Acton town

did enter a compulsory ticket area without having you a valid ticket.

 

 

Contrary to bylaw 17 (1) of the transport for London railway byelaws made under para 26 of schedule 11

to the greater London authority act of 1999 and confirmed under sec 67 of the transport act 1962

[BazzaS]

Dear all,

 

 

Some little advice please. I've read other people's threads on the same subject but cannot find all the information I seek.

 

In January, I was caught with my g/f's student oyster card. I did only do it a handful of times but will not try and justify my actions.

 

When I first received a letter from TFL, I wrote back with a full apology, an offer to pay fines and assoc. costs and explaining how I have never had been in trouble with the law before and how negatively this could affect my future career prospects.

 

I have received a mag. court summons this morning for the 20th of May. From what I've read on here, I think I'm going to write to the prosecutor from TFL requesting a settlement out of court and hope for the best.

 

My questions to you are: if I end up pleading guilty, how serious will the charge be? Will it be a CCJ? Will future employers see it when applying for a new job? I'm due to visit the US at the end of the year, will this stop me entering?

 

Also, I hear about people getting out of things on technicalities... They have noted in the summons that I was stopped at Acton Town station... When in fact I was nowhere near there. Would a wily solicitor get me off on something like that??

 

Thanks in advance

 

 

"If I end up pleading guilty, how serious will the charge be?"

 

You'll be guilty of a criminal rather than a civil offence. You can't go to prison for a Bylaw offence (even a second or subsequent bylaw offence), only receive a fine.

"Will it be a CCJ?"

If fined, it is a criminal conviction fine, not a CCJ. You can't be sent to prison for not paying a CCJ, you could (at least in theory) be sent to prison for deliberate non-payment of a fine from a criminal case.

"Will future employers see it when applying for a new job?"

 

It depends. You may have to declare it while it isn't 'spent', and some jobs are exempt from the Rehab of Offenders legislation : if the application form notes this you'd always have to declare it, whenever.

 

Other replies I've seen on CAG in the past suggest this is a "non-recordable" conviction.

My understanding of that is that it wouldn;t show on a basic or standard disclosure,

but likely would show on an enhanced disclosure (DBS, the replacement for CRB).

" I'm due to visit the US at the end of the year, will this stop me entering?"

It is a criminal conviction, and why take the chance of not disclosing it?. If you disclose it, and get granted a visa, it can't come back to bite you. If you don't disclose it, and try for the ESTA / Visa Waiver programme, and lie (saying "no convictions"), and they then spot it: you could get refused at the border, sent back, and banned from the USA.

I suggest your better option is to declare it, apply for a visa noting it is a conviction but for an offence dealt with only at Magistrates Court,, at the lower end of seriousness of the criminal cases, and attracting at worst a fine, and thus (accepting your guilt, having made an error of judgement and learnt your lesson) that you pose no risk to the USA.

Once you have the visa you don't face "looking over your shoulder" all the time that you get found out as concealing a conviction.

[ICG]

Bazza, thanks so much for your help. I really appreciate it.

 

The charge that I am to answer specifically states that I did not have a valid ticket at Acton Town.

 

I was stopped at Leicester Square. Is that a defence for me? As I am absolutely not guilty of having an invalid ticket at that particular station.

[BazzaS]

Bazza, thanks so much for your help. I really appreciate it.

 

The charge that I am to answer specifically states that I did not have a valid ticket at Acton Town.

 

I was stopped at Leicester Square. Is that a defence for me? As I am absolutely not guilty of having an invalid ticket at that particular station.

 

I don't know for sure, BUT the dates are important : see below.

 

Where did you travel from to get to Leicester Square? Did you mention Acton Town at all when questioned?

 

If you are claiming innocence of the offence of not having a ticket at Acton Town : you need to be aware they might recharge you with the different offence (at Leicester Square).

I doubt you can use "double jeopardy" to prevent you being recharged for the correct station : after all your (potential?) defence is the fact the two offences are factually different....

 

They have 6 months to lay a summons.

So, even if you get found not guilty of not having a ticket at Acton Town : is there anything to stop them re-laying the correct summons after your court appearance but before 20th July?

[Old-CodJA]

The charge that I am to answer specifically states that I did not have a valid ticket at Acton Town.

 

I was stopped at Leicester Square. Is that a defence for me? As I am absolutely not guilty of having an invalid ticket at that particular station.

 

 

 

They have noted in the summons that I was stopped at Acton Town station... When in fact I was nowhere near there. Would a wily solicitor get me off on something like that??

 

 

 

If it was Acton Town where you started your journey the offence is correctly identified

 

 

TfL Byelaw 17.1 states that 'no person shall enter a compulsory ticket area without having with him a valid ticket'

 

 

The point at which you entered the system will show on the record of 'touch-in'. Where you were stopped is simply the point at which the offence was detected and where you still did not have a valid ticket because you were using an oyster identified as valid only for the sole use of your girlfriend.

 

 

This is a strict liability Byelaw offence and as such non-recordable (no criminal record), and as others have said unlikely to cause you any great employment problem, unless you work in a notifiable occupation, when it would be best declared.

[ICG]

Thanks both.

 

I was travelling from Hammersmith to Leicester Square. I never mentioned Acton Town, nor do I think I've ever been there...

 

Point taken about them probably re-trying me even in the unlikely event that I could get out of it with such a technicality.

 

I'm going to write to them, throwing myself at their mercy in the hope that I avoid a criminal record.

[Old-CodJA]

Deleted duplicate post

[Old-CodJA]

I was travelling from Hammersmith to Leicester Square. I never mentioned Acton Town, nor do I think I've ever been there...

 

 

If that is factually the case it is probably worth challenging the charge in open Court on that basis

[ICG]

Hi all,

 

Thanks for the words of advice here.

 

Just by way of update; I wrote a grovelling letter to TFL's prosecutor, apologising for my transgression and committing to pay fees, fines etc.

 

They wrote back to me, with an offer to settle out of court for £400. I took them up on the offer to avoid a criminal record.

 

Thanks

[dx100uk]

well done!

 

 

dx