Claimant Commitment for ESA claimants (trial) early 2015

[Littleredriding]

Check your stats. ASIDE from pensions the biggest welfare bill is on Housing benefit of which the majority is paid to Low income families IN WORK. Our tax money subsiddises companys making private profit by paying below a living wage.

 

More resources were paid to prop up the banks than spent on welfare in many years.

 

Government borrowing this parliment has Risen!

 

Attacking the sick n poor is a dehuman distraction n those who believe the spin should take a good hard look in the mirror

 

 

From the government's position, they have already hit HB with the CAP, they can't very well touch the pensioners as they have no means of increasing their income by working. That just leaves Tax Credits and ESA/JSA claimants. They have reduced the level at which TC is paid and are on course to make further attacks via UC. That just leaves ESA/JSA. What do you suggest they do? Where would you suggest that they reduce the costs of those two benefits?

[Littleredriding]

I would not pay too much attention to the big bad wolf huffing and puffing and trying to blow someone's house down. Today it's the sick and disabled.

 

The number of people whose death can be attributable to the current government's welfare policies is estimated to have now reached 60,000. There cannot be any justification for that and no amount of wriggling can make it right.

 

 

And precisely where are those facts and statistics? You could well say that the early deaths of pensioners during the winter period is attributable to the level of the Winter Fuel Allowance. Should it be doubled to avoid those deaths?

[SabreSheep]

From the government's position, they have already hit HB with the CAP, they can't very well touch the pensioners as they have no means of increasing their income by working. That just leaves Tax Credits and ESA/JSA claimants. They have reduced the level at which TC is paid and are on course to make further attacks via UC. That just leaves ESA/JSA. What do you suggest they do? Where would you suggest that they reduce the costs of those two benefits?

 

Why reduce the cost of a very small % already?

Would it not be more cost efficient to make savings in the places where noone will be harmed. I don't know, maybe the tax money spent on bailing out bankers while they STILL award themselves high bonus's

Why not tackle the LARGE SCALE TAX AVOIDANCE by multinational company's

Why not reduce the cost of GOVERNMENT by stopping ridiculous pay rises MPS will be voting for

Why not SCRAP HS2 which is 52 Billion (to start with) where the benefits will nto be felt by the many.

Why not SCRAP Universal JOB MATCH and STOP applying unfair sanctions and STOP denying targets exist for claiments being sanctioned. WHICH result in EPENSIVE TRIBUNALS costing TAX PAYERS MONEY

Why not SCRAP inefficient Government bureaucracy which wastes MORE MONEY than it saves?

 

Why do you not take your head out of your dwp bubble and look at the real world

[SabreSheep]

From the government's position, they have already hit HB with the CAP, they can't very well touch the pensioners as they have no means of increasing their income by working. That just leaves Tax Credits and ESA/JSA claimants. They have reduced the level at which TC is paid and are on course to make further attacks via UC. That just leaves ESA/JSA. What do you suggest they do? Where would you suggest that they reduce the costs of those two benefits?

 

So why *MUST* these smaller costs be further reduced?

[Littleredriding]

So why *MUST* these smaller costs be further reduced?

 

 

 

As has been said, the Welfare budget includes, Housing Benefit, Tax Credits, pensioner payments leaving ESA/JSA and a few other nits and bobs such as IS/IIDB/CA.

 

 

It was accepted that the Welfare budget had to be cut along with the Defence budget and a whole host of other departmental budgets. Looking at the Welfare budget, the CAP has been brought in (to be further reduced shortly) to cut back on Housing Benefit. Working & Child Tax Credits have been hit with reductions/income limits with further cuts relating to the number of eligible children & Universal Credit. Pensioner payments, no one in their right political minds would attempt to touch this as most pensioners are on fixed incomes with no option to increase them by working.

 

 

What we need is to have a bigger stick as a deterrent to get more into some type of work. You must admit that there is a large number of people that abuse the ESA & JSA system simply because it is an easier way to get a guaranteed income, probably topped up with money out of the 'black economy'. In my honest opinion ESA/IB has been easy street for years. JSA was just the same by getting money for the least amount of activity that they could get away with.

 

 

It may be a small part of the budget, but it must be tackled either by voluntary or compulsory means.

[SabreSheep]

As has been said, the Welfare budget includes, Housing Benefit, Tax Credits, pensioner payments leaving ESA/JSA and a few other nits and bobs such as IS/IIDB/CA.

 

It was accepted that the Welfare budget had to be cut along with the Defence budget and a whole host of other departmental budgets. Looking at the Welfare budget, the CAP has been brought in (to be further reduced shortly) to cut back on Housing Benefit. Working & Child Tax Credits have been hit with reductions/income limits with further cuts relating to the number of eligible children & Universal Credit. Pensioner payments, no one in their right political minds would attempt to touch this as most pensioners are on fixed incomes with no option to increase them by working.

 

 

What we need is to have a bigger stick as a deterrent to get more into some type of work. You must admit that there is a large number of people that abuse the ESA & JSA system simply because it is an easier way to get a guaranteed income, probably topped up with money out of the 'black economy'. In my honest opinion ESA/IB has been easy street for years. JSA was just the same by getting money for the least amount of activity that they could get away with.

 

 

It may be a small part of the budget, but it must be tackled either by voluntary or compulsory means.

 

Im sorry. You are blind ignorant or both.

Have you seen the number of vulnerable people suffering. Esp those with mental health problems?

 

Easy Street?

You are out of touch with reality.

There is a reason most pple leaving jsa end up being in esa or subsidised through wtc and housing benefit. The working hours are not there!

The support given does not support at all. More money is spent on frivilous sanctions and courses than saving?

 

This money ends up with wps that soley exist to make money. It is a scandal. Only the uneducated and ignorant can support the system as it is.

 

I ASK YOU what is the point of the welfare state?

 

WHY are the most vulnerable suffering disproportionatly?

 

WHY do you support inhuman suffering on the weak?

 

AND large numbers abusing the system? I suspect a larger number of those reside inside the dwp and work providers.

 

Those that are cheating the system need catching. But not at the expense of innocent lives and certanly not at the expense of private corps set up to make money.

 

I ask again as a full time employed person. Why should my tax money be used to persecute the weak the sick and those in need.

 

NoT IN MY NAME

 

And you with your attitude should be ashamef of yourself

[SabreSheep]

THE dwp has no credability anymore imo.

[Nystagmite]

The amount of people claiming ESA / JSA when they shouldn't do is tiny, btw. Can't remember what it is for JSA. But for ESA, it's something like 0.5%.

[sadone]

From the government's position, they have already hit HB with the CAP, they can't very well touch the pensioners as they have no means of increasing their income by working.

 

Neither do the sick!! The problem is when you have the world run by accounts and brain dead middle men is that they refuse to believe that some people will never be cured or that their disability will just won't magically disappear overnight.

 

This idea that people are ill and so incapable of work, but apparently they're fit enough to be harassed by the DWP and shoved onto a work program.

[Nystagmite]

A lot of people can't increase their income by working - the very people being hit by the benefit cap. (carers, disabled people, etc)

[Littleredriding]

A lot of people can't increase their income by working - the very people being hit by the benefit cap. (carers, disabled people, etc)

 

That's not quite right. Carers for a start need only care for 35 hours a week to gain the benefit. Yes they may well care for 60+ a week, but they can still find time to work and earn another £100 a week on top AND still get the benefit. As for the disabled not being able to work and earn, I'm sorry but I know many that are disabled and no matter what they work every week despite being completely worn out by the weekend. Being disabled doesn't mean that every disabled person is in a vegetative state.

In my opinion far too many people in this country are now accustomed to living on benefits.

I have a seriously disabled husband and my health isn't that great and we are both in our 60's. Yet we live on just his state pension!

[sadone]

That's not quite right. Carers for a start need only care for 35 hours a week to gain the benefit. Yes they may well care for 60+ a week, but they can still find time to work and earn another £100 a week on top AND still get the benefit. As for the disabled not being able to work and earn, I'm sorry but I know many that are disabled and no matter what they work every week despite being completely worn out by the weekend. Being disabled doesn't mean that every disabled person is in a vegetative state.

In my opinion far too many people in this country are now accustomed to living on benefits.

I have a seriously disabled husband and my health isn't that great and we are both in our 60's. Yet we live on just his state pension!

 

Hey, whats it like working for the DWP? The money any good?

[Nystagmite]

That's not quite right. Carers for a start need only care for 35 hours a week to gain the benefit. Yes they may well care for 60+ a week, but they can still find time to work and earn another £100 a week on top AND still get the benefit. As for the disabled not being able to work and earn, I'm sorry but I know many that are disabled and no matter what they work every week despite being completely worn out by the weekend. Being disabled doesn't mean that every disabled person is in a vegetative state.

In my opinion far too many people in this country are now accustomed to living on benefits.

I have a seriously disabled husband and my health isn't that great and we are both in our 60's. Yet we live on just his state pension!

 

You clearly have no idea what it's like to look after a severely disabled person, do you? My mum is a paid, employed carer for two people. (and gets a proper wage for it) For a lot of it, what she does, can require more than one person for her own safety and that of the disabled person. Unlike someone in employment, a carer can't just choose not to do their job. The disabled person will still need caring for and a care home isn't always appropriate.

 

Some of us could possibly work; but like I said earlier, our adjustments would be seen as completely unreasonable. Before I started on the nasty drug I was put on before Christmas, I was in pain pretty much everyday. Now, the pain has pretty much gone. But so has my concentration. I can't even do basic maths, atm. Please explain to me, given the above, how the hell I can work? And that's even before you take into account the other disabilities I have. Oh, and every winter I would be calling in sick for weeks on end because of my chest.

[antone]

I know many people that are old and still manage to work every week despite being completely worn out by the weekend. Being old doesn't mean...

 

It's funny, in a perverse sort of way, when people show up saying things that amount to "Working age people aren't working hard enough to support me!!!!!" Personally, I preferred Andy. Can we have him back please?

[SabreSheep]

That's not quite right. Carers for a start need only care for 35 hours a week to gain the benefit. Yes they may well care for 60+ a week, but they can still find time to work and earn another £100 a week on top AND still get the benefit. As for the disabled not being able to work and earn, I'm sorry but I know many that are disabled and no matter what they work every week despite being completely worn out by the weekend. Being disabled doesn't mean that every disabled person is in a vegetative state.

In my opinion far too many people in this country are now accustomed to living on benefits.

I have a seriously disabled husband and my health isn't that great and we are both in our 60's. Yet we live on just his state pension!

 

And with that statment you confirm you are in fact a troll.

[sadone]

Aww bless.

[honeybee13]

I know many people that are old and still manage to work every week despite being completely worn out by the weekend. Being old doesn't mean...

 

It's funny, in a perverse sort of way, when people show up saying things that amount to "Working age people aren't working hard enough to support me!!!!!" Personally, I preferred Andy. Can we have him back please?

 

That's a bit hard on Flo, isn't it?

 

HB

[antone]

That's a bit hard on Flo, isn't it?

 

HB

 

Flo scores rather poorly with the judges, I fear

[estellyn]

I knew it!!!

[worried33]

As has been said, the Welfare budget includes, Housing Benefit, Tax Credits, pensioner payments leaving ESA/JSA and a few other nits and bobs such as IS/IIDB/CA.

 

 

It was accepted that the Welfare budget had to be cut along with the Defence budget and a whole host of other departmental budgets. Looking at the Welfare budget, the CAP has been brought in (to be further reduced shortly) to cut back on Housing Benefit. Working & Child Tax Credits have been hit with reductions/income limits with further cuts relating to the number of eligible children & Universal Credit. Pensioner payments, no one in their right political minds would attempt to touch this as most pensioners are on fixed incomes with no option to increase them by working.

 

 

What we need is to have a bigger stick as a deterrent to get more into some type of work. You must admit that there is a large number of people that abuse the ESA & JSA system simply because it is an easier way to get a guaranteed income, probably topped up with money out of the 'black economy'. In my honest opinion ESA/IB has been easy street for years. JSA was just the same by getting money for the least amount of activity that they could get away with.

 

 

It may be a small part of the budget, but it must be tackled either by voluntary or compulsory means.

 

This post leaves you with no credibility your proposals are based on a theory of a high fraud rate which isn't backed up by facts.

 

If ESA is easy street then why are genuinely ill people been found fit for work?

 

There is no requirement to tackle the budget, its ideological and you have fell for it.

 

When compared to other wealthy countries in the EU we actually underspend on the sick and unemployed.

 

If I was asked the question tho, how to reduce the budget, I would reduce the amount each person gets rather than helping less people. However if I was in charge of such a decision and it was been forced on me, I would resign in shame, refusing to put my name to such a decision.

 

This government keeps rambling on about fairness, what is far is a matter of personal opinion, but if they were applying cuts without bias, with no doubt pensioners would have taken a hit, the reason they haven't taken a hit is little to do with ability to work (many pensions do work) but more to do so with political incentives.

 

Forcefully making people enter poverty encourages distrust and crime, nothing else. People no longer trust the government, so as such they less likely to be honest with the government and crime will increase.

 

The cuts have been cruel and targeted at the weak. They target people with the least influence in politics.

 

To make matters worse there is silly novelty things such as taxpayer subsidised bonds that are exclusive to pensioners only, pensioners who are supposedly poor and in need spent billions on these bonds.

[tommy456]

What we need is to have a bigger stick as a deterrent to get more into some type of work. You must admit that there is a large number of people that abuse the ESA & JSA system simply because it is an easier way to get a guaranteed income, probably topped up with money out of the 'black economy'

 

A deterrent from what making a claim for benefits when you have no income or are too ill to work ? what would you like these people to do starve, die, freeze in the cold,? do you really want a civil war in the uk?

because there would be some who wouldn't bend over for government,

 

And what makes you so sure that most people on benefits topping up with money from the black" economy" ? Nice to know you automatically assume those on benefits are cheating the system,

As for "getting more into some type of work" how when there aren't many jobs available and lets not forget there has to be an incentive ,of being better off working, it is after all presumably why you worked for the DWP ? without the need for wct and housing benefit, if a job is so low paid then why bother,

 

If you sorted out the labour market made employers pay a living wage the min wage isn't that, what would happen ? more unemployed as employers would pay more but employ less people, but that may just help the economy as those in work may just have some cash to spend and want to spend it, unlike what we have now,where most are keeping their hard earned,because they don't know what the future holds

[estellyn]

Originally Posted by Littleredriding

What we need is to have a bigger stick as a deterrent to get more into some type of work. You must admit that there is a large number of people that abuse the ESA & JSA system simply because it is an easier way to get a guaranteed income, probably topped up with money out of the 'black economy'

 

Even with every single job filled, there are still millions without jobs - exactly what are you trying to encourage people to do with your bigger stick?

[SabreSheep]

And let us not forget

1 person now requires 2 or 3 of "these jobs" to make ends meet

[down'n'out]

IMHO, This is just about finding more ways to inflict sanctions on ESA claimants. The more sanctions they can make, the better chance they will not breach their own welfare spending cap.

[tommy456]

I had a listen to the select committee over the sanctions and UC , and All that Mc vey could go on about is the new sanction time limits being part of the DWP's plans of helping people in to work, they came unstuck on quite a few questions put to them, one being how many claimants who are sanctioned actually then find employment, and another was regarding the hardship payments being too low, if they claimant has enough to live off why are they having to use food banks to get buy?

 

I would love the opportunity to question that smarmy lying woman she is , and buy the way she was necking the water i think she was recovering from a night on the booze , but her body language to me gave her lies and omissions away,well certainly quite a few, and the way that they where talking was they are going or have started dishing out sanctions to those on ESA in the WRAG , and the changes are instead of the 2week sanction it will be a 4week sanction, and the max length of time for a sanction decreased from 3 yrs to 2yrs, and they don't keep records of how many have topped themselves following being sanctioned but they wouldn't would they as it isnt in their interests to do so http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b053t12p/select-committees-benefits-sanctions-committee

 

For anyone who has the time to watch