Bus driver stops disabled scooter passenger boarding bus

[sailor sam]

Right or wrong? (Forget about the the 'licence excuse') Speaking as an ex-bus driver, I actually know the answer!

 

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/features/4859900/council-jobsworths.html

[citizenB]

Stagecoach later apologised, confirmed there was no requirement for disabled

passengers to do “ramp training” and reimbursed her taxi fare.

 

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/features/4859900/council-jobsworths.html#ixzz2OdVqYwpc

 

 

Well as Stagecoach said there was no requirement for disabled passengers to ramp training, presumably the Bus driver was wrong !

[sailor sam]

No, there is no requirement for a disabled passenger to have 'ramp training'. From that point (assuming the story is correct, remember this is the Sun we are talking about!), the driver is wrong. BUT the actual problem lies with the scooter.

 

When low floor/disabled access buses were introduced, all drivers (at West Midlands Travel anyway) had to have training on how to use the ramp and assist a disabled passenger. The training was for WHEELCHAIR users only. The bus is designed to carry wheelchairs, not scooters. There is only one permitted way that the wheelchair can be carried; facing backwards and against a long narrow bulkhead so the handles fit either side to prevent side to side movement. Also, the wheelchair brakes MUST be applied. So in effect, it is impossible for the wheelchair to move forwards if the bus were to brake suddenly. AFAIK scooters do not have brakes and cannot be positioned within the wheelchair space correctly.

 

ANSWER; Disabled scooters cannot be safely carried on a bus and as such, should not be allowed.

[citizenB]

Aha.. many thanks SS

 

I seem to recall another such incident about 3 or 4 years ago. The Disabled scooter driver was actually banned from using the bus, period, because of not having brakes.. I will have a looksee later on.

[Conniff]

I remember that, quite a big thread I think.

Edited March 26, 2013 by Conniff

[BanditQueen]

Can the bus driver actually do this or is this technically discrimination as most disabled people do not have wheelchairs? It is not access for wheelchair users; it is access for disabled people, whatever they have that limits them. And push chair parents have taken advantage of this. You should see the size of some push chairs and double prams!

 

They take up the entire floor space! It is technically illegal to refuse outright access to public transport based on disability, but there is a safety issue here and there is a statement about reasonably practical. This means that if there is a safety issue then they can say no to access. A scooter! Some scooters can fold and go in the boot. If this is a national express bus then that is fine, they can load in the boot and passenger on the bus. If it is public transport this is not possible as they do not take luggage in boot space. They have limited space in any event.

 

I have to admit this is a new one on me and I would really love to know what happens if the disabled passenger made a formal complaint via a disabled tribunal or authority against the bus company. I also feel sorry for the driver and he or she is probably correct: safety of the other passengers is a problem here. I assume that the scooter does not have a break although actually they do: you have a key that turns them on and off and they can be immobilised safely! But what if they were not done correctly: they are quite large items and could cause some damage.

 

There have been a few incidents with scooters being driven into the path of someone and an accident happening and injuries were quite bad. I have used scooters in the centre of town and believe me as hired items they are not easy to use and get out of the way: I had to use the horn a number of times as people wander into your path and are not aware you are there.

 

There may be some issues here on the bus and safety would be one of them. The issue, however, is: is this legal, can you refuse access to disabled people in scooters? I would assume that the issue has not been looked at very closely as you would not get many people on scooters getting onto a bus: but I can certainly, even as a disabled customer, understand if a driver refused. I also have seen mums told to put the pram down as it takes up room for other people and you cannot get past to get off or a wheelchair user may get on and this is quite right as they have a choice: a wheelchair user does not and has priority on public transport. Those are the rules.

 

I have had pushchairs run over my feet to try and force me to move from the disabled seat on the bus and refused as I cannot stand and this was when there was enough room for the chair and me in the same space. I also had to ask a bus driver to help me up as a mother had hysterics as I was sitting where she wanted to put her huge pram. The driver got up and abused me! I told him if he wanted me to move then he needed to assist me and he soon shut up and told the mother to move instead or put the chair down.

 

It was only when a younger person moved from the ordinary disabled seat at the front that I was able to actually move in any case! No, I will not stand while a mother gets on and takes my disabled place with her tripple brat mobile.

 

To get back to the point I would actually move for a wheelchair: I would not move for a scooter either: there is no need for a scooter on a normal bus. A national express bus can put it into the boot in a special department: the local bus cannot.

 

Sorry, but even at the risk of having every other disabled person in the world attack me, law not withstanding, I believe the bus driver acted in the interest of safety, was being practical and he was thinking of the other passengers. The law may well say otherwise: I am not sure; but I feel the drive acted correctly and was not discriminating in any way.

Edited March 26, 2013 by citizenB
formatting

[dx100uk]

use the edit post and put some blank lines in...

 

dx

[sailor sam]

Bandit Queen raises an interesting point about pushchairs and buggies. It's obviously A difficult one for the poor old driver sometimes, but he is ultimately responsible for the safety of his passengers. PCV regs stipulate that the aisle MUST be kept clear while the bus is in service. As far as prams/pushchairs are concerned, if they impede into the aisle then they should either be folded or refused on board. But the reality is that most drivers will turn a blind eye and they will carry more than they should. I personally allowed 2 unfolded pushchairs on providing there was space in the 'buggy zone' to accommodate them. After that, any further passengers with pushchairs would have to fold them so they would fit into the luggage rack.

 

Problem is though is when you have your full compliment of pushchairs and then you come across a disabled person in a wheelchair! Then the driver theoretically should make the wheelchair space available by getting one of the two buggy passengers already on board to fold their buggy up to allow the wheelchair user onto the bus. Not so easy in practice, I can assure you!

 

Bandit Queen is correct in saying that you should not refuse to allow a disabled person to travel. But you can if it is not safe to do so, i.e. if they are in a scooter which cannot be carried in the same fashion as a wheelchair.

[Nystagmite]

Isn't there also an issue of size of the scooter? I seem to remember that on trains, there's something about the maximum size of a wheelchair / scooter.

[firstclassx]

I remember a mobility scooter boarding a Metro train in Newcastle and going straight through the doors on the opposite side onto the track. Used to be CCTV of it available.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7582097.stm

 

Turning circle is too small on buses/trains. Could also impede evacuation of a vehicle.

 

I would go further and say that users of these scooters should be made to hold a license. They can be surprisingly fast and heavy, and if they ever hit someone whilst rushing about on the pavement, they could seriously hurt someone or damage property.

 

Some train companies issue permits to customers that allow them to travel with their scooter, but only if specific measurements are met, and the user can demonstrate a level of competency.