TBI got CCJ/CO , now trying to force sale - old HFC loan

[Pen]

Hi guys

I need some advice urgently. In 2005 I was approached by a compant TBI.

 

Who claimed to have been assigned a debt the claimed I owed to HFC Bank.

I have always denied owing this debt.

 

to cut a long story short the took me to court for a CCJ

I wrote to HFC for my Date information because I knew I did not owe them anything.

this I could not get off them and TBI got their CCJ plus a charging Order.

 

I issued proceedings against HFC for my data info but somehow they always managed to stall them.

Thought that if I could prove I had paid the debt in full then I could get the CCJ and Charging Orde removed.

 

Last week after 6 years of waiting for a hearing the court sent me a letter stating that they thought mediation should be explored first .

I agreed to this but when I spoke to the officer doing it he said my case was not suitable because I am suing HFC not TBI and that I should withdraw.

I don't want to do this but I see his point.

I thought once my debt had been sold then TBI were responsible for all of it. ??

 

today I got a letter from TBI stating that they are going to act on the charging order.

WHAT DO I DO NOW..... I have a hearing in April for HFC .

Do I have to apply to the courts to get TBI to hold off any action and if so what order do I ask for. ow much will this cost me.

 

Any advice with this would be great

Thanks x

[BankFodder]

You should have applied to have the judgement setaside. You would have to make this application against whoever had obtained the judgment against you. In order to succeed in a setaside application you would have to show that you have a defence to their claim which stands a good chance of success at trial.

 

TBI have the rights to the debt but the duties rest with HFC.

If you have made a data request against HFC and they have not complied then you are right to sue them on that issue.

 

If you can show that HFC have been deliberately frustrating your data request then you might be able to use that as a basis for showing that there is an unfair relationship per s.140A CCA. However, you need to be very measured about the way you present your case and not just wade in shouting the odds. You need to show good logical evidence for what you say

[dx100uk]

thread moved to legal forum and renamed.

 

TBI are well known for getting CCJ/CO's on sb'ed HFC debts.

 

so have you even SAR'ed HFC or checked your CRA file.

 

did you attend the CCJ or not know anything about it?

 

dx

[debbbbsy]

Help with N244 form please

 

 

Where an occasion were judgment has been entered, and a long period of time has passed since the CCJ was granted. Normally the time issue would be a problem, but because the claimant is threatening to further enforce the judgment order and charging order with a Sale order. The defendant can refer to Southern \District V Elizabeth Mary Turner.

 

CPR 3.9 and 3.10 allow the courts to 'overlook' errors of procedure as long as there is a good explanation for the error and there is merit in the underlying argument asked to be heard.

 

The debtor must make an application to the courts for 'Declatory Releif'. This can be done in conjunction with an application to set a side. In doing so, he can challenge the enforceability of the original claim. The claimant will have to provide proof that the original claim was enforceable.

 

Now you say, you always denied the debt. How dod you defend the original claim ?

 

You did a SAR, but did you make a CPR request or a CCA request ?

[Pen]

Hi guys.

yes I did SAR but got nothing of them hence my claim against them for data info.

 

When this all started the CAB where helping but when the hearing came around they had to cancel attending court with me due to staff shortage so i was on my own.

 

The hearing was a bit of a mess as TBI were claiming for both the CCJ and the charging order at the same time so to be honest I did not know what one I was defending.

 

at the time as some people on here may know I was really seriously I'll and on tons of medication it took all my energy just to attend court and I had difficulty following what was going on.

 

My thought now are to carry on with my claim against HFC.

if I can prove I had made the payments hopefully I can then get the CCJ and Charging order wiped off.

 

the original debt was for £1,200 now with the charging order it is £9,800.

I am expecting some action from TBI any day now

so I would like to be prepared for it hence my question

of can I apply for a order to stop them taking action if I can what would I write on it?

 

 

as to my claim against HFC I left the amount upto the courts decretion. I am now wondering if I should have put the amount of £9,800 to cover what this a tigon is costing . Any thoughts.????

 

Thanks Guys.

pen x

[debbbbsy]

This happens so many times, the CAB actually making things worse.

 

When they issued the claim you should have sent off a CPR 31.14 request for all the documents referred to in the claim.

 

And a CCA request for a copy of the credit agreement.

 

If you want to prove this wasn't your debt, and get the CCJ set a side, use CPR 18 to force them to respond to an Official request for answers and documents, for full disclosure. If they refuse or ignore you, you can make an application to the courts to get the information.

 

Clearly they have nothing, or they would have responded to the SAR.

[Ford]

hi pen

is this some background info on this? http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?276606-Help-with-a-Charging-Order

[Pen]

Hi ford. Nice to hear from you again.

 

Yes that's the background info.

 

When I filed my claim for data info they managed to get a stay in proceedings hence its still ongoing

and I have only just got a hearing date

 

however TBI are saying my claim with HFC has nothing to do with them even though the debt was assigned to them - I suppose they're right - but I never thought of that at the time.

 

When I do go to court I will have to have good evidence for a amount I am claiming.

 

But I also need to complete a application notice to stop them taking action I think

 

I'm just at a loss as to what to do and what to write on it.

 

I have phoned around a few solicitors to see if I could get a free half hour advice on it but they don't seem to do that anymore.

And as I said CAB are useless.

 

I did think once I got my data I could prove I did not owe the debt but it seems time is running out and TBI are not going to wait any longer no matter how I'll I am.

 

Pen xxxx

[Pen]

More info on this case

A hearing was arranged forJanuary 2011 but was cancelled by the courts. I think it was due to snow i cant remember now hence this new hearing in April.

 

Bankfodder

IIn relation to requesting a stay against TBI is there a time limit that i should have requested it in and if so have i missed it?? they acquired the CCJ and Charging order in June 2005 although my application against HFC has been with the courts since 2004. can I just comment on my case against HFC and theircontinuance to nattempts ot not comply with my requess. Would it be possible if you have the time and are not to busy to help with suggestions for the wording of my request for a . stay in proceedings.

It was HFC who requested a stay in proceedings stating that they wanted to try and work this out with me without the need for court but they did not even contact me once they got their stay.

The reason the debt has gone up so much is that charges as well as interest have been added each year. When the CAB could not attend court with me they wrote me a letter to give the judge in case i lost. The letter explained my illness and my very small income yet the judge dismissed it. I was always under the impression that there were no chargers added in the small claims am I wrong???.

 

Oh on a different note HFCs solicitors are DC solicitors who are also the solicitors for TBI in fact they both have their office in the same building. it makes one wonder just who contacted who in getting this debt assigned to TBI

 

Thanks Everyone,

Pen xxx

Edited February 8, 2012 by Pen
bad spelling

[Pen]

hi Ford. One more thing. The trial that was set for January 2011 was cancelled hence this new date in April.

Hope your keeping well

Pen x

[Ford]

hi pen

 

bump

[Ford]

[Ford]

 

 

when is your hearing in april?

[Pen]

Hi guys just to update in this case.

 

As you may be aware it has been dragging on in the court arena since 2005/6

 

Yesterday was the final hearing and my case got dismissed on the grounds that HFCs finally swore a statement stating

they no longer have any information and that it was all sent over to TBIL

so I should have requested it from them in the first instance.

 

The judge was quite sympathetic to my case and ordered no cost be given.

 

What concerned me was how they won.

 

My understanding of SAR is that the company I requested it from had 40 days to comply with my request or give me a good reason as to why they couldn't

 

Not once in the 7 years this has been fought in the court have they done that.

in fact they changed their argument on every hearing

 

first when in court there defense was they were unclear as to what I was asking for

I wrote very clearly to them on a number of occasions stating what I wanted.

 

The directions at that hearing was I write them out again and send them a copy.

 

The second hearing the company requested a stay in proceedings so that they could negotiate with me direct.

 

After many letters to them and 2 years elapsing I wrote to the court asking judgment be made against them as they had failed to communicate with me in that time.

 

The judgement was denied because the court had revived a defense by the company stating that my claim was time barred

since their solicitors said HFC have had no contact with me since 2001

and are still unaware of what i am seeking from them

 

I challenged their defense stating I have letters regarding my request for date dated 2006 and 2007

and I have sent many letters requesting the information I wanted

 

A new hearing date was sent with the judge directing HFC to swear a oath that the do not have this information

 

On there last hearing yesterday HFC finally said they did not have the information I was requesting

and that I should have requested it from TBIL

the judge agreed so my case was dismissed.

 

I still am confused on how I lost !

 

Why could they not tell me within the 40 days for SAR information that they did not have it. ?

 

This 7 year delay by them means I can no longer challenge the judgement from TBI

as that is now time barred due to HFCs time wasting in court

not to mention the cost of bringing this case in the first place.

 

It seems that no matter how strong a case you have as a lay person you are very really going to win.

 

As magistrates assume solicitors know thee law, we don't so often decide in there favor.

 

I thought my case was straight forward enough.

 

I requested SAR info. the law states the time limit in which they have to provide it or explain why they can't.

End of case not give me a answer 7 years latter .

. Is this the end folks?

 

Is there anything else I can do?

Thanks everyone for your input over the years with this one

Pen x

Edited March 7, 2013 by Pen

[Ford]

hi pen

not a good result. you're quite right, 'they' should state prior categorically that they don't have any such data/that's all they've got (maybe one reason why j didn't give them their costs?). once they state on oath, then seems not much a j could do unless there is poss anything to show (tip the balance) to the contrary. good though you didn't get stung for their costs as that could've been quite high!

are they still trying to force sale? whats the situ re that?

[Pen]

Hi thanks for replying

Yes they are still trying to forse sale. Not sure what the situation is though as the CAB are now dealing with that, I have a meeting planned with them for next week. I'm so annoyed over this as I'm despite to sell our house but not be able to get a remortgage with this charging order in place

 

Pen

[Ford]

see post #523 here for some case egs re co sale orders

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?203298-A-guide-to-Charging-Orders-amp-Orders-for-Sale/page27