A little help with SOGA rights.

[solar101]

I brought a car on Monday(2/7/10) from a private seller, he described the car as "nice little runner and drives around very well". So after i had brought it from him i proceeded to drive home which was a 77 mile journey. Into that drive home it broke down 40 miles into it. I had to call RAC to come and tow the car. when the RAC engineer had a brief look at the car he said "it has a hole in the engine" and needed a new one. I asked him what causes that and he said that if the car is badly kept and not serviced regularly. So i tried to call the guy that sold me the car and no answer so i had to email him and ask him to call me back and that i want a refund or a partial refund to fix the car and his response was.

 

 

 

hi sorry i havnt got bk to you been at work and couldnt answer my phone.

sorry to hear about the car but it was in good working order when it left my hands. it has been used regulary (including the odd long distance journey) and never missed a beat.

If there had been a fault with the engine at the time of purchase then the car would not have run.

You also test drove the car before paying and agreed it ran fine.

Unfortunatley I am unsure what else to say, I cannot offer a refund, as the car was in good working order when it left my hands and as described on the listing. I have no idea what has been done with the vehicle since it left my posession.

Once again I am really sorry to hear this has happened - the car was sold in good faith.

 

 

I have tried to reason with him but he simply takes no for an answer and keeps repeating things that hes said above. So is it right that i buy a car and it only last 40 miles then break down on me? I'm planning on taking this guy to court, do i have a leg to stand on if i do so?

[solar101]

Just a little more information. I won this car on ebay. I also see that hes sold 2 more cars in july and another car 3 months ago, would this class him as a trader? how do i report him?

Edited August 3, 2010 by solar101

[sailor sam]

Unfortunately you would have to prove that the seller knew there was a problem with it or he miss-represented it in the advert to have a chance of a claim. SOGA only protects you if you buy from a trader/dealer.

 

Which leads me to ask; how did your purchase it? = through a news paper advert/Auto Trader/Ebay? Have you checked to see if he is selling any other cars?

 

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[sailor sam]

Just a little more information. I won this car on ebay. I also see that hes sold 2 more cars in july and another car 3 months ago, would this class him as a trader? how do i report him?

 

You posted at the same time I did.

 

It appears he could be which changes the whole ball game. Can you PM me a link to the listing.

 

__________________

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my scales at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice usefull.

[solar101]

I brought the car in through eBay but paid in cash to him. He currently isn't selling anymore cars.

[sailor sam]

Fiat Bravo correct?

 

I see he has sold 3 cars this month (including yours) which suggests he is a trader. However, you need to prove it. I suggest yo write to DVLA to enquire about the previous RK. If it matches the seller's details and he has been the RK for say more than 3 months then you may have a problem.

 

In the meantime, you should open a dispute through Ebay. Also he may not appreciate your yet to post negative feed back as I note so far he has 100%

 

I do have a couple of further observations on this as I used to own (from new) the HGT version of this car and also worked for a main dealer. I find it hard to belive that the engine would suffer from a serious failure after only doing this kind of mileage unless it had been neglected badly by not maintaining the correct levels ect. These engines do not suddenly give up without warning. Are we sure the milegae is correct? maybe you need to check the MOT history as well.

 

__________________

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my scales at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[solar101]

Yes it is a Fiat bravo. looking at his older feedback he has also sold 2 more cars within this year totaling 5 including mine. I will write to DVLA to check that and the MOT history as well. I'll keep you posted. Thanks for your help so far.

[sailor sam]

No probs. You have to act fast though, because the quicker we find he is a trader, the more chance you got of rejecting the car and getting a refund. There is a time limit from the date of purchase. I think I would be inclined to write a formal letter to the seller asking him if he will agree to rectify the problem. Keep it as simple as that but mention that you reserve the right to take legal action as a last resort and that all communication must be done in writing. If he is a trader, yo9u will need to send such a letter as stage 1 of the rejection process so I see no reason why you cannot do this now because at least you have started the ball rolling. Have you opened a dispute with Ebay by the way?

 

__________________

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my scales at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[solar101]

we've been sending emails back and forth using ebay, asking him for a fund or for repair costs of the car but he keep sending the same replies saying that the vehicle was "as described" and thinks that's the end of it. Are are the emails sufficient enough as sending a letter? I have tried opening a dispute against him via ebay but the message I get from ebay is "We're sorry there's an issue with your purchase. Unfortunately, this item isn't in a category covered by eBay Buyer Protection. We don't offer buyer protection on items listed in the Real Estate category, certain Motors categories, or in the Classified Ad format. You can try to resolve this problem by contacting the seller."

[sailor sam]

Yeah, ok. It seems Ebay are treating it as a private sale. I trust you will leave the appropiate feed back then!

 

By the way, emails (providing you can produce a paper copy) can be used in evidence although actual postal letters are better and more formal. All letters should ebsent recorded and DO keep copies of everything including ALL emails.

 

__________________

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my scales at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[solar101]

Ok I sent the letter off to him yesterday by recorded post as you advised and also contacted Consumer Direct to have Trading Standards look into if this guy is a really trader posing as a private seller. I have more reason to suspect he is a trade seller as when we was discussing about insurance for the car he told me he had car trade insurance policy instead of a normal car insurance policy which raises my suspicions. I even have a text message from him saying the same thing to confirm this as well. So Iv'e sent the rejection letter off to him and have to give him at least 10 days to reply right? Is there nothing else I can do in the mean time? Forgot to mention he never registered him self as the RK of the vehicle it was still in the name of the 3rd keeper who lives in halifax 90 odd miles away from where I bought the car. This is something car traders sometimes do right? not change the RK.

[sailor sam]

If you had read my post (#8 ) correctly, you would note that the first stage is to write to the seller asking him to rectify rather than reject. However, you say that he has comunicated to you there is 'nothing he can do' so providing you can produce paper copies of that then that should suffice. Also, keep the text message which he admits to having trade insurance. Basically if you take the matter to court, you have to show that the seller had an opportunity to put things right before hand.

 

Incidently, you must not use the car following sending the rejection letter... not that you can anyway.

 

__________________

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my scales at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[scaniaman]

Not good reading Solar. All previous advice is excellent (as per usual) but you will have to box clever. To me, this smells like a previous thread, where a car salesman, or other in the motor trade, are punting off cars that their firm don't want anything to do with. These are sold from the employees home as "Private" and explains the availability of trade insurance. A good tip when buying private is to ask seller how long they have owned the car.--explains why not reg as RK. Hope all turns out ok for you.

[wheelergeezer]

Seller has sold 3 cars in July and another a short time before? that makes him a trader, which changes everything.

 

Reject the car under the SOGA and give him 7 days to collect the car and refund you. If he doesn't then involve trading standards immediately. It is a criminal offence to make a false statement in relation to a business. If he is a trader, and I believe he is, then pretending to be a private seller is a major deception.

 

I know excatly what i would do, but that is unfortunately not advise I can publicly print!

[wheelergeezer]

I didn't see the post that you had already started this....

 

Also, see if you can contact the registered keeper. Ask them if there was a problem when he sold the car. If there was that 100% confirms that the trader knew about it.

 

In any event, as a trader he is responsible whether he likes it or not.