Phew! I need help re being chased for debt overseas

[Guest Ecoecho]

Hi. I did post about a year ago I think and breathed again, but now the debt has reared its ugly head again right on my doorstep here in South Africa.

I had a Virgin card and an HSBC card. I had to come back to SA rather abruptly and things here blew up in my face. Basically I ended up stuck here for the time being with no job, no income. I have been selling belongings in order to just survive.

My problem is that last week my elderly parents received a call purporting to come from a company that had mail for me. I have read up on that, and when my mother phd I said to her it was obviously one of the companies now holding my debt. Unfortunately my stepfather said I was living in SA now, before my mother was able to snatch the phone away from him. He just gives out information to anyone.

Now, today, there have been some calls with strange numbers on my phone here in SA, one just showed 000 and another was private. I do not answer calls that do not have a number showing on my phone. There was a message left by one of these two, rather garbled so I could not get the name of the company, but to the effect that the call was for [gave my name] and that this was urgent and I was to call [garbled] on 0115604673 [a Johanneburg number], giving a Virgin [she used that word] ref number. This was extremely urgent, a private matter, and I was to call [garbled] and a garbled company name, something group.

To say my heart is beating rather fast and I am feeling sick does not exactly tell you how I am feeling, but I guess you all know that feeling. I feel sick. I have a house here, but cannot sell due to market depression, it still has a bond on it [mortgage] and I have a vehicle that is on hire purchase. I have no job. I am a pensioner. The house is my pension when I can sell it. I wanted to move back to the UK at that point and settle the two debts.

Now, my question is, can anyone give me advice regarding the legality of this debt agency or whatever they are trying to collect the debt here in SA. My Virgin card was £5,000. My daughter said I should fly back to the UK and sort it out there, applying for debt clearance of some sort, but I cannot even buy food this month let alone find money for air fare! I cannot find anything on the internet regarding the legality of them going after me here for debt, even if the debt has been sold to a company here. The debt was incurred in the UK. I last used the card in about the first quarter of 2008.

I just don't know what to do, as here they are not nice about debt and will come into your house and take everything that is not bolted down, take your car even if if is still on HP and payments up to date, force the sale of my house for a paltry sum etc.

I am very frightened.

[dx100uk]

pers

 

i'd totally ignore it

 

there is nothing they can do to you.

 

dx

[Guest Ecoecho]

Problem is that I cannot go to a lawyer here for advice either, as I have no money, and, if it has been sold to a South African company to collect I have no idea of what the legal ramifacations are. They now own the debt so I need to know if they can then recover the debt here. Virgin is in this country now too, but this is not Virgin calling me.

 

I did some research on the net and there are now companies here and in the UK who offer foreign debt recover services and they seem to be successful, as the first thing they do once they know where you are is to check the property registers, so they will now know I have a property here too, and then the go after you. If I thought they could not do anything legally I would ignore them but our debt collectors in this country are not governed by the same laws as in the UK and some of them are extremely nasty - kneecapping stuff! I have no one here I can turn to for help either. I am alone in this country now.

[cerberusalert]

See http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/overseas-debt/250889-can-i-sued-overseas.html

[Guest Ecoecho]

Thank you for taking the trouble to reply with all this information. I am still not quite sure about where I stand but...

 

Basically, although where I am living is outside the EU and not listed as having a reciprical agreement, it seems tfrom this info that if they have tracked me down and found that I have a property here, they can then sell the debt to a local company and that company can now come after me. So, sometime soon I will be served with legal documents demanding an absolutely vast sum of money [the exchange rate is currently about 11.50:£1] and I will be forced to put the house on the market for a paltry sum [properties are taking a couple of years to sell here at the mo] in order to pay the amount, which will no doubt have horrendous costs added to it by now.

 

Thanks again for taking all this trouble to find this information for me. Bad dreams for me again tonight I guess.

[cerberusalert]

It is highly unlikely that they'll be able to take any enforcement where you are for a couple of reasons, the first is they would need to have obtained a CCJ against you in the UK which they cannot do if you are a non-resident & even if they had it can easily be set aside. Then there's the little matter of your agreement, more than likely it states in the T&Cs that it is governed by UK law (CCA 1974) add to that.... would it be economically viable for them to attempt to pursue wherever you are?

[Guest Ecoecho]

I looked up the telephone number that was left in the message on my phone and found the co and checked them out on the internet. They talk about how they are able to collect debts incurred overseas, and that they first check the property registers [we have a deeds office and rates list that anyone can access for a small fee]. If the person owns property etc. here then they advise the client that they are able to collect the debt, and act accordingly.

 

The card was granted in May 2006, so I am not sure what the T&C's were at that point. They keep changing them.

[cerberusalert]

They'll be like some of the bottom feeders here in the UK and try to intimidate people into paying. They can do nothing without a court order and that will not be easy for them to do.

[palomino]

Cerberus, I think the point the OP is making that legal niceties such as obtaining a CCJ are not observed in SA.

 

Should it come to a head I would expect that, even in SA, the claimant (debt collector in this case) would have to prove that the debt exists, that they are indeed the creditor or the creditor's representative, that repayments are legally enforceable and that the claimant has the right to collect any repayments that might be due.

I have no idea of the SA legal system but is there any facility for the defendant to represent themselves?

 

I don't know the answers and I doubt whether there is anyone on CAG who is knowledgable in this area. However I hope it might be a start in helping the OP find the necessary answers.

[bazaar]

Well so far all you have is a garbled message telling you to call them, ( Most likely at a higher rate). How easy is it for you to change your phone number? this will give you a little breathing space. These companies rely on you being frightened, so please take a step back. Your mum has the right idea, dont tell anyone anything.

As far as the intimidation, have they got your adddress? If its just phone calls, then its likely not.

Try not to worry, the original creditor should know the law in the UK. So, if they know you are non resident, then they cant get a CCJ against you.