Barclaycard/Cabot/Mackenzie Hall

[Donel261]

Hi Rhia, they have provided a copy of the application form, which is the only document I would have signed, I thought that was the credit agreement.

 

Will look up the other threads, thanks!

[tbern123]

Just a thought, I am going through something very similar with Cabot and Barclaycard. Check the signature box to see it has also been signed by Barclaycard. Mine wasn't, thus it is a improperly executed agreement

[Donel261]

No its not signed either, I just want to get these bloody fools off my back once and for all. They are screwing my credit report big style with the default! aggghhhhh

[tbern123]

No its not signed either, I just want to get these bloody fools off my back once and for all. They are screwing my credit report big style with the default! aggghhhhh

 

I know exactly how you feel. That is why I have given them 7 days to remove the default notice from my credit file or I will start legal proceedings. I will be claiming damages in relation to the additional interest I have paid on other credit agreements since this default was registered on my file. I have already started legal proceedings against Cabot for some of their other mistakes

[Donel261]

Right the latest, I sent a prelim request for charges to Barclaycard and got an offer stating that the OFT stated they could charge £12 so they would pay me the difference.

 

No!

 

I sent them a letter before action demanding the repayment of the full charges over 50% of the debt they have sold on to Cabot. I have stated that they have misquoted the OFT statement, they only said £12 was the level that they would not get involved, can they justify the charges of £12 to me, doubt they will!! anyway, I have demanded a deletion of the default notice and stated I will initiate court action against both them and Cabot as they are jointly responsible for this mess.

 

I await a Barclaycard response, I copied in Cabot and now have a letter from the (Assistant Legal Council) on very posh paper/envelope giving me the name of a woman who is dealing with my case, Horay! I now have a person to deal with instead of the Cabot machine.... and standard letters.

 

Let you know how it goes,

[Donel261]

No response from Cabots legal team yet but Barclaycard have refused to refund my charges after originally offering partial payment. Looks like a very standard letter, probably just churned out with the others. They also state "we are not prepared to tell you how much Cabot paid us for the debt, nor are we obliged to."

 

Anyway, I am holding out for a response from Cabot and then I need to start court proceedings. Now here is the questions:

 

Can I include two companies on one claim, i.e. say this debt is in dispute with barclaycard on the standard unlawful charges arguement and that they have sold it to Cabot who refuse to negotiate or remove the default, which they had no right to enter on my cra file in the first place.

Or should I just do barlcaycard for the charges and wait for settlement and then turn my attention to Cabot? or any other advice?

 

Any help you can give is greatly appreciated. I need to start thinking about how to word a good argument. I am not the best and will probably make a mish mash but I will give it a go,

[NailPost]

No keep it simple and go for Barclaycard only. Its their fault for selling the debt to Cabot and if they have to pay you more than they received from Cabot for it then that's a matter for them.

 

Once they receive the court claim they will have 14 days to respond and a further 14 days to file a defence. Such action tends to concentrate the mind and it will be interesting to find out if they take the £12 the OFT have issued as a guideline only to a judge. He won't be bothered with guidelines and will base his judgement (if it ever gets that far) on the Unfair Terms in Contracts Act 1999 which states charges must cover administration costs only.

 

Sadly a county court judge cannot set case law but it would be useful to have a precedent and in that event I would lay odds Barclaycard will capitulate before that day dawns.

[Donel261]

Thanks Nail, I will get onto the court claim then. Should be worth a few quid to see how it pans out.

[Donel261]

Just in the process of issuing my court claim and I am not sure if I should say something in it about them selling on a debt with a default to a DCS when 50% of the alleged amount consisted of unlawful charges. I don't know if they have any power to get Cabot to remove the default and if I could then negotiate this as part of the settlement?

 

If so would I need to submit an N1 as opposed to a moneyclaim online.

 

Can Anyone help? could I include something along those lines and if so what would I say? (Confused!)

[Donel261]

Letter fromCabot (dont worry Cabot I will be coming after you once I have dealt with barclaycard and the unlawful charges, court action started!!)

 

Dear Donel,

 

I write im relation to the aforementioned and yoru letter dated 7th February 2007.

 

I apologise that you felt the need to write to us in relation to this matter and that you are dissatisfied in the manner that we have dealt with your account.

 

Cabot Financial (UK) Limited, formerly Kings Hill (No1) Limited, which is part of the Cabot Group of companies ("Cabot"), purchased your account from Barclaycard and therefore Cabot Financial (UK) Limited is the legal owner of your account. The rights, but not the duties, of Barclaycard were assigned to Cabot (UK) Limited in dealing with your account and therefore we are the assignee of your account and not the creditor. It is therefore that we are legally entitled to collect any outstanding balance on your account.

 

At the time of purchasing your account from Barclaycard, the amount outstanding was £xxxxxx and therefore the amount that Cabot is entitled to collect. We confirm that we have not added any charge or interest on the account at any time. Notwithstanding that latter, we are legally entitled under the original credit agreement to apply interest. (but you dont have the original credit agreemenent, do you?)

The amounts that you refer to in your letter were charges added onto your account, prior to our purchase, by Barclaycard as a consequence of failure to pay the minimum amount under the credit agreement. (very presumptious of you given you dont really have the credit agreement to hand do you?) Furthermore you signed the terms of the credit agreement which confirms that you understood the terms on failure to pay the minimum amount under the credit agreement. (did I? I would love to see this credit agreement you keep banging on about? Barclaycard sure haven 't been able to supply it.)

We have investigated your case thoroughly (yep, I belive that, "Cabot style!") and confirm that the outstanding balance on the above account now amounts to £xxxxx. Cabot has previously confirmed that it is willing to accept £xxxx in full and final settlement which amounts to a 20% discount as a gesture of good will and we are willing to extend this offer to you. (how very kind of you, but I dont think I will be taking you up on that, why would I pay you what was never owed to Barclaycard in the first place? if you bought the debt from them in good faith then that is your problem with them, not mine, they have sold you a wrong'un mate!) This generous offer significantly reduces the charges made by Barclaycard for each failure to pay the mimimum amount under the credit agreement.

 

Furthemore, Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited and/or Cabot Financial (UK) Limited at no time registered a default on your credit report but continued the reporting of a default which was originally registered by Barclaycard. (and what right do you have to do that?) The file now shows Cabot as owner and not Barclaycard and accordingly, Cabot are legally entitled and legally obligated to report your account in the same manner as the original lender. (oooooh really? prove it!!) When you signed your credit agreement with Barclaycard, you consented that information was to be passed to credit reference agencies when dealing with your account. we have a right under the original credit agreement and under the Data Protection Act to report to the credit reference agencies. (getting very bored with this tosh now, you refer to this credit agreement that I have never seen, please can I have a copy? can I also have a substantive response outlining exactly where you draw your rights under the DPA?)

Cabot has at all times acted appropriately and in accordance with all relevant laws and regulations and denies that it has acted unlawfully at any time.

 

In conclusion to the avove, if you decide to accept our geneous offer and pay £xxxx in full and final settlement in clear funds, we shall immediately credit your file to confirm that the account has been "satisfied" and confirm that Cabot shall no longer contact you in relation to this matter.

(I dont think so somehow!!)

 

Yours Sincerley

 

Willem Willinghoff

Head of Compliance

[andrew1]

I think Surelybonds would have some fun with that one !

[Donel261]

Surely has the nack of kicking ass, I on the otherhand do not. :-|

 

It just gets so frustrating because they are all in it together, the ICO, the DCA's, the CRA's.... all b**stards!! I get some satisfaction out of knowing we are driving them mad with our constant complaints and challenges.

[humbleman]

Surely has the nack of kicking ass, I on the otherhand do not. :-|

 

It just gets so frustrating because they are all in it together, the ICO, the DCA's, the CRA's.... all b**stards!! I get some satisfaction out of knowing we are driving them mad with our constant complaints and challenges.

 

How very right. I wouldnt be surprised when you make a complaint to ICO, they probably ring the CRA's and ask, By the way what is the Industry norm for this, and the CRA would reply by the way its ....... and coming from ICO we take it as gospel.

[Seahorse]

OOOOH. The Cabot/Barclaycard template, eh? Shame on you Willem. I thought you'd have a bit of originality. Oh, wait. There is a bit more to it than mine. You've got a 20% off sale. I didn't get that.

[humbleman]

OOOOH. The Cabot/Barclaycard template, eh? Shame on you Willem. I thought you'd have a bit of originality. Oh, wait. There is a bit more to it than mine. You've got a 20% off sale. I didn't get that.

 

Wait till the summer and you will get the specials

[tbern123]

Cabot Financial (UK) Limited, formerly Kings Hill (No1) Limited, which is part of the Cabot Group of companies ("Cabot"), purchased your account from Barclaycard and therefore Cabot Financial (UK) Limited is the legal owner of your account. The rights, but not the duties, of Barclaycard were assigned to Cabot (UK) Limited in dealing with your account and therefore we are the assignee of your account and not the creditor. It is therefore that we are legally entitled to collect any outstanding balance on your account.

 

Anyone else notice the use of words ??? account not debt.....

 

 

At the time of purchasing your account from Barclaycard, the amount outstanding was £xxxxxx and therefore the amount that Cabot is entitled to collect. We confirm that we have not added any charge or interest on the account at any time. Notwithstanding that latter, we are legally entitled under the original credit agreement to apply interest.

 

ok, bearing in mind that Cabot are insistent beyond belief that the Law of Propery Act 1925 is applicable... How can they turn round and so oh yer, by the way... we will make out we are the creditor so that we can charge interest if we want to...

 

The file now shows Cabot as owner and not Barclaycard and accordingly, Cabot are legally entitled and legally obligated to report your account in the same manner as the original lender.

 

Mmmmmmm Legally obligated..... interesting

 

"same manner as the original lender" Mmmm again.. original lender.. this statement would suggest that Cabot imply there is more then one lender and that they are the current lender (lender = creditor)

 

When you signed your credit agreement with Barclaycard, you consented that information was to be passed to credit reference agencies when dealing with your account. we have a right under the original credit agreement and under the Data Protection Act to report to the credit reference agencies.

 

"We have a right under the original agreement" And what about our rights ?

 

So Cabot want to use the CCA when it suits their purposes but ignore it whenever it is not convenient for them.....

 

Sound like they want they Cake and eat......

[Donel261]

Exactly, they want it both ways and must have employed Willem to ensure they get it. I think Cabot have greatly underestimated our little CAG.

 

This is the second time I have been offered 20% discount.

 

Just had an idea, as I have a claim in against Barclaycard for the charges can I ask for disclosure as to how much they sold the debt to Cabot for? they will probably want to do anything to prevent it going to court after leaving it to the last minute. It would be interesting to know exactly how much they pay for them.

[tbern123]

Exactly, they want it both ways and must have employed Willem to ensure they get it. I think Cabot have greatly underestimated our little CAG.

 

This is the second time I have been offered 20% discount.

 

Just had an idea, as I have a claim in against Barclaycard for the charges can I ask for disclosure as to how much they sold the debt to Cabot for? they will probably want to do anything to prevent it going to court after leaving it to the last minute. It would be interesting to know exactly how much they pay for them.

 

 

In all honesty, I doubt you will ever find out how much it was sold for... My guess would be for a lot less then 10% of the balance

[tiglet]

Erm, I may be missing the point entirely after reading this really interesting thread, but haven't Cabot failed to provide you with a true copy of the CCa? If that's true, surely they are committing an offence by continuing to press for payment?

 

I recently read this thread Mike220359 v Blair Oliver & Scott **I won**.

 

Might this not be a way to get your default removed? Or have i totally missed the point on this thread somewhere?

[Donel261]

You could well be right Tig, I am by no means an expert in these things. Thanks for the link I will have a read

[Donel261]

Still waiting for the latest response, hurry up Cabot, I need cheering up!!

[Donel261]

Hey, I have just realised.... my thread is not in the cabot sub folder I feel left out of the cabot fan club now!!

[pmhcfc]

Hey, I have just realised.... my thread is not in the cabot sub folder I feel left out of the cabot fan club now!!

 

PM a Moderator and ask them to move it to Cabot for you--Unless you wish to start a new thread all of your own on the Cabot sub-thread

[Donel261]

Right, just going through some paperwork and I have noticed that the photocopy of the application form I was sent by Cabot is as everyone else has received (unsigned by barclaycard) anyway, when I made a DPA request to Barclaycard they have sent me the exact same photocopy with a bit of scribble in blue biro next to my name which looks like initials. It is obvious this was done as it was been sent out, can they try and say this is a properly executed agreement? and if it is, why have cabot provided me with the same copy (without signature) - sly foxes!!

 

Furthermore, as part of the DPA request to barclaycard they have provided me with a copy of a default notice they claim to have sent me in March 2003, they sold the debt to Cabot on November 2005 and the default now shows on my credit reports as (Kings Hill No 1) being issued in November 2005. What right do they have to change the date, I thought there were processes in place for renewing defaults after six years but not just amending the dates, also if Cabot are changing the date, should they not have issued a default letter themselves? and if so, what agreement do I have with them to allow that to happen?

 

I think yet another complaint to the information commissioner is needed for clarifcation on this one.

[tiglet]

Donel, why don't you send them the CCA default letter stating that as they ahve provided you with no properly executed credit agreement, unless they stop processing your data and remove your default you will start litogation against them? IMO, stop being messed around by these clowns and make them put up or shut up - you have a perfect case here and having a non-signed and now a signed copy of the application form is perfect.

 

Don't think they'll want to see this in front of a judge, and if it comes to that, don't think m'laud will be too impressed, do you?