Hsbc Urgent Help Please

[johnnymitch]

I think your account becomes 'In Dispute' when you send the Prelim Letter asking for your money back . Until you receive the SAR documentation and work it out, you can't say definitely that it is in dispute.

[dev123]

hmmmm!!!

 

just had may letters returned due to me signing the letters different!!!

 

didnt sign them with my normal signiture!!

 

guessing now i need to re send and sign correctly.

 

but is this bad news???? as obviously they have my signiture on record so does this mean they will have my original contract for over 10 years ago?

[johnnymitch]

They're playing silly beggars again dev, - technically you don't even have to sign a SAR , they only have to be satisfied that they're dealing with the right person ,so you could go down to the local branch and have them verify who you are without a siggy ..... and they're happily sending you letters - and they don't know who they're sending them to - ? I'll bet !

 

However , if you send a signature back to them , make it just minimally different from your usual one i.e. a dot or tiny mark that you can identify later ......

 

Anyway , everybody's signature changes to some extent over 10 years - IMHO they're playing for time .....

 

Also, they may have your siggy on something other than an agreement - a cheque for instance ?

[dev123]

thanks johnny,

 

yes they are buggers aint they!

 

well i sent a new letter straight back. i am guessing it wouldnt really matter if i signed as normal being they have a copy of my siggy anyway!

[johnnymitch]

i am guessing it wouldnt really matter if i signed as normal being they have a copy of my siggy anyway!

 

Do they though ?, or was this a ploy to get one ? lol!

[dev123]

oh god dont say that!!!!!!!!! but they must have had something to compair it to.

[johnnymitch]

I wouldn't worry dev, didn't mean to alarm you..... the banks have never to my knowledge used 'lift and paste ' tactics on siggies for agreements etc. -some iffy DCAs have been suspected of it though ........

[dev123]

ok, latest update and help!!!! this is the response for the CCA request i sent before the SAR.

 

i have attached the letter received.

 

together with the letter i also got....

 

a- my £1 postal order back!!

 

b- midland bank credit card terms and conditions

 

c- hsbc important changes to your credit card agreement (effective from 1st oct 2007)

 

d- hsbc important changes to your credit card agreement (effective from 1st oct 2008)

 

e- hsbc credit card agreement terms

 

f- last 2 credit card statements

 

i cant see any sign of a contract (original or copy)??

Edited April 8, 2009 by car2403
Removing attachments with personal details attached.

[johnnymitch]

Sorry , I can't read your letter dev - can you post it in larger size , please ? If I magnify it , it goes out of resolution ........

[car2403]

ok, latest update and help!!!! this is the response for the CCA request i sent before the SAR.

 

i have attached the letter received.

 

together with the letter i also got....

 

a- my £1 postal order back!!

 

b- midland bank credit card terms and conditions

 

c- hsbc important changes to your credit card agreement (effective from 1st oct 2007)

 

d- hsbc important changes to your credit card agreement (effective from 1st oct 2008)

 

e- hsbc credit card agreement terms

 

f- last 2 credit card statements

 

i cant see any sign of a contract (original or copy)??

 

Dev,

 

I've removed the attachment from your post, as it contained personal details. (Despite it being very small and unreadable, but it may still have been of some use to someone...)

 

If you read the guide in my sig, there's some instructions on uploading images using the likes of Photobucket that should help you. (After removing personal details, that is...)

 

[dev123]

duuuu! sorry about that guys!

 

i hope this works.

 

[johnnymitch]

Yes dev that's worked ok , I've read the drivel sent by Helen Packwood .

 

Sending back your pound does not absolve them from having to comply with your CCA request - and how can T & C s be changed without you being able to see your signature which agreed to those changes . A blank agreement form and a couple of statements is one of the worst 'compliances ' I have seen I think ....

 

Time for a strong reply ....... you could try this , suitably amended :

 

finding faulty cca agreements after a ccj?? - The Consumer Forums

 

I believe we are also waiting for a SAR to be complied with - that should also give you all the documentation they have on you - if there is no Credit Agreement there either I think it's probable that they cannot produce it .... but we'll have to wait and see on that one - meanwhile , why not put them on the spot for failing to comply with your CCA .....

 

Or something like this , again suitably amended , but you'll have to be prepared to take them to court and make them produce the signed document .

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/hsbc-bank/188794-hsbc-cca-non-compliance-2.html#post2080917

 

However , a court would be a bit unchuffed if they produced one at the last gasp , having refused /failed to let you have a true copy.

Edited April 8, 2009 by johnnymitch

[dev123]

many thanks johnny.

 

ok, i am going to opt for the first letter i think.

 

for this bit what date do i put in? is it that date a sent cca or is it for all charges since i had the card? sorry if its a silly question!

 

At the point where this account entered into the disput situation as described in s78 (6) CCA 1974 no other charges are allowed to be added until such time as HSBC become compliant with my request. As HSBC are still not in compliance with my request I insist that the following takes place with immediate effect.

• All charges levied since ??/??/?? be removed from the account and further charges cease until such time as HSBC comply fully with my original request or such time as a court makes an enforcement order
  

also should i send the postal order back ( dont want them having that as an excuse)

[johnnymitch]

If you have proof of when they received the CCA request letter Rob , I would use that ...... if not make it from when you sent it plus two days ...

That's when the account entered 'Dispute' stage I would say ......

 

You can't do it from when you had the card because you haven't got proof yet as to what charges have been applied - or have you?

 

It wouldn't hurt to send back the £1 PO .... shows them you can't be fobbed off that easily - and point out that they still have to comply - .

[dev123]

ok latest update!!

 

 

Following my reply letter to then not conforming to my request for the cca this is the letter i received today (this is for Credit Card)..............

 

I refer to my previous correspondence dated 3 april 2009 concerning your request that we provide you with an original signed agreement for the above account. we have complied with the requirements of section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act. in particular, we have supplied copies compliant with regulations 3(2)(b) of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983.

 

Whilst i understand this may not be the response you were hoping to receive, i trust i have now clarified the banks final position on this matter.

 

Since we do not concider the account in dispute, futher action will continue against you untill satisfactory repayment proposals are received.

 

 

 

 

so what do i do now?????!!!!!!!!

 

i am still waiting for the SAR requests on all accounts,they wrote asking for my local branch to drop off the paperwork i guess.

[johnnymitch]

How long before the SAR deadline runs out Dev ? They'll have to send everything with those anyway , so them time-wasting with the CCA request is not going to do them any good in the long run .

 

If the SAR is overdue then come back and we;ll find another letter for you to send ..........

[dev123]

no the SAR isnt overdue, its 30 days isnt it?

 

so should i just forget about the CCA for now and just concentrate on the SAR when it arrives?

 

thanks again johnny

[johnnymitch]

Hi Dev

 

It's actually 40 days , unfortunately - (but it's 40 calendar days ,not working days:)) -but it'll come around and you can see then what they've got on you ....... if your Credit Agreement doesn't appear in there , it may be that they haven't got it - that's when you start pushing them to admit it !

 

btw , don't completely forget about the CCA - just keep it up your sleeve for 'non-compliance ammunition' if what you want is not in your SAR .

Edited April 23, 2009 by johnnymitch
afterthought,...............

[dev123]

so are my accounts in dispute now then, i thought they were but wasnt sure.

 

i had a call off the bank yesterday after payments for my credit card. i told them that i had sent off a SAR request and they didnt know what it was!!! the person even went off and asked around the office and no one knew, i couldnt beleive it!!

[johnnymitch]

I find that hard to believe too Dev, unless they're using green trainees or thick call-centre numpties lol...

 

But it's not your fault if they're ignorant - the Data Protection unit know what a SAR is and it's up to them to produce .

 

If they ring back tell them you're account is in dispute until you receive the info you have asked for ....... and you could ask them to comply with your CCA - if they know what one of those is ......

[dev123]

haha no i mentioned cca as well and they didnt have a clue!!

[dev123]

interesting update i think!!

 

i went into hsbc today to pay in a little as i have done for the last few months.

 

to my suprise i was told that my current account and flexilone had been passed on to a debt collecting agent.

 

can they do this during the period they are due to supply the SAR?

 

my credit card is still running though!

[johnnymitch]

interesting update i think!!

 

i went into hsbc today to pay in a little as i have done for the last few months.

 

to my suprise i was told that my current account and flexilone had been passed on to a debt collecting agent.

 

Looks as if they're getting these transferred before you submit a Prelim Letter , Dev - a bit devious , but not illegal........ makes me think they knew what a SAR and CCA were all along.......

 

can they do this during the period they are due to supply the SAR?

 

Technically , they can , because at the moment you're only asking for the info you need to prepare a case if necessary .... your 'In Dispute' really begins when you send your Prelim Letter asking for your money back ..

my credit card is still running though!

 

As long as you've got a parachute account running it won't affect you much day-to day .... but don't give them a second over the deadline for your SAR ..... If they're going to be pedantic , so can you ......

[dev123]

yes i set up a basic account with nationwide a long time ago so not used hsbc current account for 6 months or more

[dev123]

my SAR was sent on the 24th march. but had a letter back off them about a week later asking me to go the my local branch to prove my signature (as advised not signed on the SAR).

 

so has this given them more time or should the deadline still be from the original 24th date + 2 days.