Welcome/Cohens - case withdrawn ***WOO-HOO ***

[Prudence]

Hi Steven, do I need to write again to Welcome (see my last post above)? Or shall we go direct to the Court? (will it cost us to do so?) I will post up the amounts & dates tomorrow. Thanks again

[dx100uk]

can you give me an idea of why the PPI will/was the cause of the issues?

 

if the losan was only paid for 7 mts? then reclaiming the PPI will not get anywhere near clearing the balance?

 

sorry if i've misread....

 

dx

[Prudence]

Hi dx

After hubby lost his job WF hounded us - Direct Group kept us waiting months for their eventual refusal. We tried to maintain half payments during this time but still WF were not satisfield and were extremely intimidating, coming to the house on one occasion. Husband then became ill and again, months of waiting (Direct eventually got 2.5 yrs medical records from hubby's doctor) to again be refused on 'pre existing condition' which we disputed - (our Doctor didn't commit either way in his letter in response to Direct Group). By this time, we were in a mess financially and mentally and never did recover. Hope this explains the background a bit. We paid them about £1700 in first seven months then with the half payments total about £3500.

 

Amount of Credit for the goods 6400.00

Amount of Credit for the insurances 1791.91

Total amount of credit 8191.91

 

Duration of Agreement 48 months

Total amount payable for the goods 9283.00

Total amount payable for the insurances 2508.67

Total amount payable 11,791.67

APR 20.8%

 

OTHER FINANCIAL INFORMATION

 

Cash Price of Goods 6400.00

Total Cash Price of Insurances 1791.91

Total Cash Price 8191.91

Deposit Cash 0.00

PX Allowance 0.00

Total Deposit 0.00

 

INSURANCES

 

Payment Protection Insurance (see clause 15 of the Terms and Conditions) 1546.91

Mechanical Breakdown Insurance 0.00

Emergency Recovery 0.00

Shortfall Extra Insurance 245.00

Collision Call 0.00

Other Insurances

 

Acceptance Fee 195.00

Finance Charges for Goods 2638.00

Option Fee 50.00

Charge for Credit for Goods 2883.00

Charge for Credit for Insurances 716.76

Total Charge for Credit 3599.77

Rate of interesticon on Credit (per annum) 10%

[dx100uk]

not being funny

but could you....

 

scan the required letters/agreements/sheets

as a picture file

remove all pers info inc barcodes etc using paint

but leave all figures and dates.

goto one of the many free online pdf converter websites

convert the image to pdf format.

or ir you have PDF as an installed printer drive use that

open a new msg box here

hit go advanced below the msg box

hit manage attachments below that box

hit the add files button on the top right

hit select files, navigate to your file on your pc

hit upload files

NB:you can set where it goes in the post by hitting insert inline.

the hit reply button

 

dx

[Prudence]

Thanks very much. Yes I will follow those instructions and scan them all in tomorrow. Nite nite & thanx x

[pdb1980]

AFAIK, yes, going through FSCS is optional. Who told people taht a court would strike out their claim? Welcome? (it wouldn't surprise me)

 

Hi there,

 

My understanding is that the PPI will only be dealt with through the FSCS the reason for this is because welcome got so many complaints and basically don't have a pot to wee wee in they could not pay out or deal with what was landing on their desk. The FSCS pay up to 90% and welcome pay the other 10% if the claim is successful (correct me if I'm wrong there).

 

The issue you may have by going through the courts could possibly be the fact the the FSCS have got involved because Welcome are in Default and court may tell you to peruse it that way.

[Prudence]

Hi dx Steve & all

Here is the first document, the Agreement (which doesn't know if it's a Credit or Hire Purchase Agreement). Hope it comes out alright, couldn't seem to do it your way sorry! It has taken me ages!

 

 

Agreement fax print.pdf

Edited May 23, 2011 by Prudence

[dx100uk]

convert it to PDF

 

that is too small

 

dx

[Prudence]

It's still very difficult to decipher so I'm putting my 'typed up' version on shortly, thanx Pru

[Prudence]

CREDIT AGREEMENT REGULATED BY THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

 

Progressive Financial Services Limited trading as Welcome Financial Services of Mere Way, Ruddington Fields Business Park, Ruddington, Nottingham NG11 6NZ ("we, us, our")

 

First Customer & Second Customers

(personal details in box)

Key Financial Information

 

Amount of Credit for the goods 6400.00

Amount of Credit for the insurances 1791.91

Total amount of credit 8191.91

 

Duration of Agreement 48 months

Total amount payable for the goods 9283.00

Total amount payable for the insurances 2508.67

Total amount payable 11,791.67

 

The first weekly/monthly* payment (Payment) is to be paid on or before the same day of the week/month* as the date of this Agreement in the week/month* following the date of this agreement and subsequent payments are to be made on or before the same day every week/month* after that (the "Payment Dates").

 

Payable by 48 weekly/monthly* payments of £244.63 plus the Option Fee which is payable at the same time as the final weekly/monthly Payment if you wish to exercise your option to purchase the Goods (see clause 4 of the Terms and Conditions).

 

*delete as appropriate

 

APR 20.8%

Goods New Used X ALL THIS INFO COMPLETED

Chassis No.

Make/Model

Reg No CC

First Registered Colour

Engine No

 

Cash Price of Goods 6400.00

Total Cash Price of Insurances 1791.91

Total Cash Price 8191.91

Deposit Cash 0.00

PX Allowance 0.00

Total Deposit 0.00

 

INSURANCES

 

Payment Protection Insurance (see clause 15 of the Terms and Conditions) 1546.91

Mechanical Breakdown Insurance 0.00

Emergency Recovery 0.00

Shortfall Extra Insurance 245.00

Collision Call 0.00

Other Insurances

 

Acceptance Fee 195.00

Finance Charges for Goods 2638.00

Option Fee 50.00

Charge for Credit for Goods 2883.00

Charge for Credit for Insurances 716.76

Total Charge for Credit 3599.77

Rate of Interest on Credit (per annum) 10%

[Prudence]

Here is the Default Notice

 

DNfax print.pdf

[lotuselite]

Just wanted to subscribe and put in my support. We are still fighting Welcome, via MKRR. The agreement sucked so they can fight me all the way thru the courts if they want too.

 

Not much help I know but we all have to stick together!

Edited May 23, 2011 by lotuselite

[Prudence]

Thanks lotuselite! I'm very grateful for your support - yes we all need to stick together and keep fighting. I am writing to everyone I can think of, I will not give up till I get a result. I'm not allowing them to ruin our lives the way they are doing. Good luck to you, and you can always mail me if I can be of any help.

[lotuselite]

Thanks for the offer of help, I think this is what David Cameron means by The Big Society!! And I am politically agnostic. My last contact with Welcome was to say if they were so sure they were right, take me to court! They then sold the debt on, what does that tell you!! Don't let them grind you down. I will keep you up to date with whats happening with us, nothing at the mo! We have gone down the FSCS route, thus far, but it seems next to useless if you check out my posts.

[Prudence]

dx, Steve - please let me know if there are any other documents I need to post up whenever you get the chance to have a look at those above. Many thanks, Pru

[steven4064]

The agreement is a HP agreement. In the 'old' days this would have been considered unenforceable because under schedule 1 of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 it should be headed "hire purchase agreement reulated by the CCA 1974", which it deosn't. However, recent court rulings mean that a court would accept this as a 'true copy' as it has all the relevant T&Cs on it.

 

As far as I can see, the DN is OK.

 

From what you have told us, I would say that this is a clear cae of mis-sold PPI and you should write and ask for everything you have paid on the PPI, including the interest on the payments, to be paid back. Give them 14 days to comply with your request. If they do not, send them anothe letter headed "letter before action" asking again, and again giving them 14 days. Tell them that if they do not comply with this letter you will commence court proceedings without further correspondence.

 

If you need help calculating how much they should pay you back, ask here.

[Prudence]

Thank you Steven. In my defence (in the removal of the CCJ) Surfaceagentx20 put it together for me and the Default Notice was deemed as faulty - see clause below:

 

"The default notice relied upon by the Claimant was a notice dated 22 June 2007. Save that the notice was served upon the Defendant on a date thereafter and that service was by post, the Defendant is now unable to recall on what precise date and by what precise means the notice was served upon him/her. The notice failed to specify a date being a date 14 days after service of the notice or any date after service by when the Defendant was required to comply with the notice. Alternatively, the date specified in the notice by when the Defendant was required to comply was stated to be before 6 July 2007 which was not a date which was 14 days after service of the notice."

 

The reason we didn't want to go thru FSCS was because we felt that this PPI non payment had a knock-on effect and caused us to get into much worse financial difficulties. Due to this, we feel it extremely unfair that our Credit Report is badly affected and impeding our life progress.

I am putting a letter together to the CRAs.

As the original contract between WF and us was based on misleading/incorrect information, the PPI being part of the loan, this would render the contract null and void wouldn't it?

[steven4064]

I don't think that is sufficient to render the contract void. What would do it is if you can show that Welcome acted in bad faith in selling the PPI as well as just mis-selling it.

 

I can tell you that they almost certainly did sell it in bad faith because they made a whopping profit on it which they didn't tell you about at the time. From information I have they will have bought the policy from Norwich Union (now Aviva) and added something like 82% profit to it. As they were acting as agents in the sale of the PPI, this constitutes a secret commission, which case law says is a form of fraud - that would make your agreement void.

 

Further, the commission ought to be included in the cost of credit but it is not - it is in the principal. This means that all the prescribed terms (principal, cost of credit and APR) are all wrong - that makes the agreement unenforceable anyway.

 

To prove this, you would need to get a copy of the underwriting sheet. The only way to get that is to get a court order for it under CPR 31.16

[Prudence]

I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed on what to do next. We wrote to MKRR (a 'letter before action') last year and a letter to WF demanding PPI + interest and compensation for distress + charges on acount etc. We were rebuffed by MKRR and WF wrote with a 'Final Response' to our complaint in March to say have done no wrong of course (they did request a copy of our Credit File in order to 'investigate further' which I thought was strange???)

So do we write again as you suggest above.

Won't they just refer us to FSCS - and also if going to Court, how do we calculate claim for distress caused etc?

[steven4064]

I don't personally think you would be awarded damages for distress - it is very hard to prove. I went down the route of getting the underwriting sheet - that shows they have been involved in wrongdoing.

[Prudence]

In getting the CCJ removed, they didn't respond to my CPR ever or Disclosure

[steven4064]

What CPR did you use and how did you use it?

[Prudence]

Hi Steven, I've been sifting through the files/paperwork and it was a CPR 31.14 Request whichwas sent to Cohens. Also they did not comply with Disclosure to the court and then finally sent in the Notice of Disontinuance.

[Prudence]

Below were requested in the CPR request:

 

1 the agreement.

 

2 the default notice

 

3 payment protection insurance policy

 

i require your client to release all the details stated below in regards to this policy

 

Full copies or transcripts of any correspondence in post, email or any other format which you have entered into with any individual, organisation or third party which contains my personal or financial, or which pertains to me, including correspondence to the underwriter of any insurance policies and details of the relevant insurance premium tax (IPT) payable on any single premium policies. Please ensure how much tax was payable, who payment was made to, and the date of this payment.

I also require your client to disclose the total amount payable to direct group who you report to administer any policy and any commission payments Welcome Financial services received.

As this is subject to litigation on behalf of your client, corporate sensitivity does not apply and an order through the court for compliance will be requested.

 

I require all details you hold as to why my PPI claim was turned down, that is all details you hold on file from yourself, Norwich union and Direct Group.

 

I also require confirmation from you, with supporting evidence, that the sales person was qualified to sell the ppi insurance at the time of application.

[steven4064]

which CPR did you use? did you just write to Welcome or did you get a court order?