StayingCalm vs Abbey with no CCA**WON**

[pt2537]

u could ask the courts to demand they comply with ur cpr request.

 

Unlikely to succeed IMHO, especially given the directions ordered and the consequences of failure mean they cannot rely on anything not disclosed by the 20th

 

here is the form you will need for the disclosure statement

 

 

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/n265_1005.pdf

[The GodMother]

ok just an idea.

[pt2537]

ok just an idea.

Erm, may i ask why? when there is clearly an order that

 

A) requires disclosure of documents which they will rely

 

and

 

B) if they fail to disclose then they cannot rely upon undisclosed docs in court

 

that is exactley the order that you are suggesting that SC ask for as i read it GM and there is no need as the order has been granted:confused:

 

im confused??????

[StayingCalm]

Thanks Paul, at least I know what I am doing now.

[StayingCalm]

Multay, CB, GM thanks for your interest, all help appreciated.

 

GM, I was thinking along those lines, but wasn't sure how to go about it. But then I suppose Paul is right because they are going to have to disclose now anyway. So unless they conjure up an agreement from somewhere it will be interesting to see what they disclose, and they have only got until the 20th.

[The GodMother]

Erm, may i ask why? when there is clearly an order that

 

A) requires disclosure of documents which they will rely

 

and

 

B) if they fail to disclose then they cannot rely upon undisclosed docs in court

 

that is exactley the order that you are suggesting that SC ask for as i read it GM and there is no need as the order has been granted:confused:

 

im confused??????

 

Well if u look on page one a CPR request was put in any they refused as the CPR request came off the interent and they said the request would not be valid anyway.

 

And i was thinking charges that have been applied to the account my not be valid due to the CCA not being available but them basing the whole case on it.

[The GodMother]

Staying.

 

I would say that 2 pieces of paper u need to disclose is that they have said they dont have a credit agreement and a letter refusing you access to the CPR. It shows them failing to co operate within the law for the CPR and they have nothing to base there accusations on with the CCA not available.

[pt2537]

Well if u look on page one a CPR request was put in any they refused as the CPR request came off the interent and they said the request would not be valid anyway.

 

And i was thinking charges that have been applied to the account my not be valid due to the CCA not being available but them basing the whole case on it.

Oh ok, its just that as i said before they have to disclose everything now anyway so any application in this case would be likely to fail for that reason

 

i see why you would have thought it would be a good idea though

[tinkerbell20]

How can they hope to win without at the very least having something with your signature on????:confused:

[The GodMother]

well they hoped to win because they hoped that Staying Calm would not reply to the court papers. So they would win by deafult.

 

Now they are going to start to realise that as they stupidly brought the matter to court they actually have to prove the debt is owed.

[The GodMother]

PT

 

Just a question, which u may have covered but i cant remember.

 

In the first post the company have refused to deal with the CPR request. Is there any reason why they are allowed to do this?

 

They have stated that there are 2 reasons. 1 it has come of the net and 2 it is the OP trying to hold up the court process and an abuse of powers. Is this rite?

[StayingCalm]

Regarding the Allocation Questionaire which I completed and returned to Court in July.

 

In Section A, I said 'No' to 'do you want to attempt to settle at this stage'

 

Reasons:

The Claimant does not respond to my communications. Under CPR I requested information from the Claimant's Solicitors on 28th April 2008, but this was declined. I sent a reminder on 7th May 2008 (with a copy to MBNA) which was received by them on 8th May 2008. To date I have not received a reply.

 

Section I, Other Information

 

On 19th March 2008 the Claimant stated in a letter that they are unable to provide a copy of the original credit agreement. Nevertheless on 25th April 2008 the Claimant's Solicitors commenced legal action knowing full well that without a fully compliant credit agreement that this action would be unenforceable in Court.

The Claimants Solicitor declined to respond to my request for information under CPR.

Tha above is all fully documented in my Defence.

The Claimant has since failed to respond to my Defence within the time limit.

In view of the above, I respectfully request the Court give consideration to strike out this claim forthwith.

[StayingCalm]

I did not send a copy of my AQ to Restons, and neither did I receive a copy of their's.

 

Am I able to request to see their AQ? I assume they must have sent one to Court.

 

 

Regarding my Disclosure List.

 

My Defence included 14 numbered exhibts attached to it. Do I have to list these individually, or just list the Defence as 1 item together with other items?

 

I hope to get this completed today and will post it for comments.

 

SC

[StayingCalm]

This is what I have done so far, mostly taken from my defence by Paul.

Any comments appreciated.

1. Correspondences

Copy of County Court Claim form issued by Claimant, dated 31st August 2007.

Copy ofDefence (including 14 numbered exhibits) submitted to the court by the defendant, dated 27th May 2008.

Money Claim Online: Confirmation for Acknowledgement of Service, submitted 12th May 2008

Court Document: Acknowledgement by court of receipt of defence entered, dated 28th May 2008.

Court Document: Advising Allocation Questionnaire enclosed, dated 2nd July 2008.

Copyof Allocation Questionnaire completed by the defendant (with additional information sheet) as returned to court, dated 21st July 2008.

Court Document: Notice of Allocation to Fast Track, dated 5th August 2008, and standard disclosure of documents by list to be served by 4pm on 20th August 2008

Disclosure by List for the defendant, dated 19th August 2008 and posted toRestons Solicitors Ltd by Special Delivery by 1pm next day (with proof of postage).

 

2. Authorities

Civil Procedure Rules, Rules & Practice Directions.

Consumer Credit Act 1974

Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983

Consumer Credit (Agreements) (Amendment) Regulations 2004

Consumer Credit Act 2006

Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983

Companies Act 1995

Finance Act 1998

Money Laundering Regulations 1993, 2003 & 2007

Money Lenders Act 1927

Crowther Report

Francis Bennion website: http://www.francisbennion.com/pdfs/f...974-s127-3.pdf

The OFT Guidelines on Debt Collection

Statute and Regulations

Human Rights Act 1998, Article 6 of the Convention rights

The Administration of Justice Act 1970, section 40

3. Case Laws

Wilson v Robertsons (London) Ltd [2005] EWHC 1425 (Ch)

Wilson v Secretary of State for Trade and Industry [2003] UKHL 40, [2004] 1 AC 816, [2003] 4 All ER 97

(GG) Wilson and another v Hurstanger Ltd [2007] EWCA Civ 299

(HH) Wilson v First County Trust Ltd - [2003] All ER (D) 187 (Jul)

Orakpo v Manson Investments Ltd [1978] AC 95

Dimond v Lovell [2002] 1 AC 384, 397-398

Dimond v Lovell - [2001] GCCR 2751

London North Securities Ltd & Mr and Mrs. Meadows [2005] EWCA Civ 956

Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain & Co - [1998] All ER (D) 339

 

[pt2537]

Do you have the Crowther Committee report on consumer credit?

 

if you do great but if you dont then you will be in trouble when they say "OK Can we have a copy as you have disclosed it"

 

you can only disclose docs in your possession

 

 

I can help you with the case laws etc but i do not have the Crowther report

[The GodMother]

PT

 

would this be it?

CONSUMER CREDIT: THE CROWTHER REPORT (Hansard, 28 June 1972)

[pt2537]

PT

 

would this be it?

CONSUMER CREDIT: THE CROWTHER REPORT (Hansard, 28 June 1972)

Hi,

 

Nope sorry but its not the Crowther report

 

there was a copy on Ebay the other day, the only copy close to it i could find is this Consumer Credit report of Crowther Commitee Vol 2 on eBay, also, Non-Fiction Books, Books, Comics Magazines (end time 03-Sep-08 15:20:15 BST)

[The GodMother]

well i tired.

[StayingCalm]

No I don't have it so I will remove that one. Do I need to disclose all the other ones as there will be a lot to print out if they are needed, and should I include anything else?

[StayingCalm]

Hi Paul

 

I would be grateful if you could check the following as I need to post today.

 

Do I need all of these documents, because some are very large if I should have to produce them.

 

 

In the XXXXXXXXXXXX County Court

Claim number: XXXXXXXX

 

 

 

Between

MBNA EUROPE BANK LTD Stansfield House – Claimant

(Ref XXXXXXXXXXXX)

 

And

MR StayingCalm – Defendant

 

 

 

 

DISCLOSURE BY LIST - of – StayingCalm – DEFENDANT

 

 

I, StayingCalm, of xxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxx, being the defendant in this case, intend to rely on the following documents in court, which I am required to disclose under the order made by the court on 5th August 2008:–

1. Correspondences

(A) Copy of County Court Claim form issued by Claimant, dated 25th April 2008.

(B) Copy ofDefence (including 14 numbered exhibits) submitted to the court by the defendant, dated 27th May 2008.

© Money Claim Online: Confirmation for Acknowledgement of Service, submitted 12th May 2008

(D) Court Document: Acknowledgement by court of receipt of defence entered, dated 28th May 2008.

(E) Court Document: Advising Allocation Questionnaire enclosed, dated 2nd July 2008.

(F) Copyof Allocation Questionnaire completed by the defendant (with additional information sheet) as returned to court, dated 21st July 2008.

(G) Court Document: Notice of Allocation to Fast Track, dated 5th August 2008, and standard disclosure of documents by list to be served by 4pm on 20th August 2008

(H) Disclosure by List for the defendant, dated 19th August 2008 and posted toRestons Solicitors Ltd by Special Delivery by 1pm next day (with proof of postage).

 

2. Authorities

(AA) Civil Procedure Rules, Rules & Practice Directions.

(BB) Consumer Credit Act 1974

(CC) Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983

(DD) Consumer Credit (Agreements) (Amendment) Regulations 2004

(EE) Consumer Credit Act 2006 – Section 15 & Schedule 3

(FF) Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983

(GG) Companies Act 1995 – Sections 221 & 222

(HH) Finance Act 1998 – Schedule 18, paragraph 21

(II) Money Laundering Regulations 1993, 2003 & 2007

(JJ) Money Lenders Act 1927

(KK) Francis Bennion – document posted on his website

(LL) The OFT Guidelines on Debt Collection

(MM) Statute and Regulations

(NN) Human Rights Act 1998 - Article 6 of the Convention rights

(OO) The Administration of Justice Act 1970 - section 40

3. Case Laws

(PP) Wilson v Robertsons (London) Ltd [2005] EWHC 1425 (Ch)

(QQ) Wilson v Secretary of State for Trade and Industry [2003] UKHL 40, [2004] 1 AC 816, [2003] 4 All ER 97

(RR) Wilson and another v Hurstanger Ltd [2007] EWCA Civ 299

(SS) Wilson v First County Trust Ltd - [2003] All ER (D) 187 (Jul)

(TT) Orakpo v Manson Investments Ltd [1978] AC 95

(UU) Dimond v Lovell [2002] 1 AC 384, 397-398

(VV) Dimond v Lovell - [2001] GCCR 2751

(WW) London North Securities Ltd & Mr and Mrs. Meadows [2005] EWCA Civ 956

(XX) Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain & Co - [1998] All ER (D) 339

 

Statement of Truth

 

I certify that I understand the duty of disclosure and to the best of my knowledge I have carried out that duty. I further certify that the list of documents set out in this List is a complete list of all documents which are or have been in my control and which I am obliged under the order to disclose.

 

I believe the facts stated within this document to be true and the document comprises of two pages.

 

Dated this 19th day of August 2008.

 

Signed

StayingCalm

[pt2537]

Hi there

 

IT all depends upon if the other side asks for a copy, if they dont then you will only need them for the hearing if it gets that far,

 

 

but if they do ask for a copy then you are duty bound to supply it

 

the same goes the other way though and if you do not receive their disclosure by list statement and the court form which i posted above from the abbey then they are in trouble

[tinkerbell20]

Do you need to disclose the cases you are relying on at this stage?

[pt2537]

Officially, no but its always a good idea to disclose everything, because peeps are litigants in person it doesnt matter toooo much

[StayingCalm]

Do I need to send the form as well?

[StayingCalm]

Bump