ICO and six year time limit - FOI Reply

[powerful_rogue]

Back in January I submitted a Freedom of Information Act request to the Information Commissioners Office because Experian stated in an email that the 6 year retention period was a decesion between the Information Commissioners Office, Credit Agencies and the OFT.

 

Today I get the Freedom of Information Act back from the Information Commissioners Office and it has some quite interesting bits!

 

Here was my original request

 

I have been in discussion with the credit reference agency Experian who have advised me that the decision to retain financial information such as credit accounts, credit history, default information and judgments for six years was agreed between the credit industry, the Office of Fair Trading and the Information Commissioner. Six years is considered a reasonable amount of time for data to be retained as it enables lenders to make responsible lending decisions when processing applications by having access to an individuals credit history over this period.

 

I request under the Freedom Of Information Act to be provided with all documentation realting to this decision agreed between the Information Commissioner and the credit industry.

Ive scanned the documents in for you all to see, however here are some quotes I find interesting!

 

Apparently the Crowther Report on Consumer Credit 1971 expressed support for a statutory limit and suggested that a period of six years should be adopted. I assume that this guidance is ultimately derived from earlier guidance produced by this office, probably initially in 1986 or 1987. We do not have a copy of this report. I did "Google" it. I found various references to it but, unsurprisingly given it is 37 years old, I did not unearth a copy of the report itself.

Now isnt it amazing that the Information Commissioners Office is stating comapnies can retain information for six years based on this report, but they dont actually have a copy of it!

 

We have found no evidence of any formal agreement between this office, the OFT and the credit reference agencies. However, we have found a few documents which touch upon the 6 year retention issue.

So why are Experian stating they have a decesion agreed between the Information Commissioners Office, OFT and the CRA's

 

A letter from the Data Protection Registrar dated December 1994 states

 

As the Office of Fair Trading advised in their letter of 9 May 1994, credit reference agencies hold information relating to County Court Judgements and file for six years and default data is held for 3 years.

So up until 14 years ago, defaults were only held on file for 3 years. makes you wonder who then decided to double this retention period!

 

The CRAs had reached an agreement with the OFT some years ago that data be held for 6 years. This agreement was based upon the principle of the rehabilitation of offenders for minor offences - After 6 years the slate should be wiped

 

Lovely. At least we know where the 6 year rule now comes from.

 

[powerful_rogue]

[powerful_rogue]

[noomill060]

So now we know- its based on rehabilitation of offenders.

 

Interesting that they draw a parallel between a civil debt and a criminal offence, making the 6 years retention of data the modern equivalent of a Victorian debtor's prison

 

Debt is not an offence and has not been an offence for errrrr........ quite some time!

[noomill060]

Thanks for the info.

[noomill060]

The laws governing bankrupcy were changed some years ago, the bankrupt is now discharged after one year and the Lord Chancellor's Department has now been abolished, replaced by some part of the Ministry of Justice.

 

It would be interesting to find out if the period bankrupcy records are held has been changed to reflect the new legislation.

 

If the period records has been reduced, the corollery would seem that the period data is held by CRAs should also now be reduced to reflect that, given that the period of 6 years is based on the former Lord Chancellor's Department retention period.

[noomill060]

According to this:

 

Bankruptcy Records | Records of personal bankruptcy | Bankruptcy Helpline

 

bankruptcy records are held for THREE years.

[noomill060]

Hmmmmmmmm......

[powerful_rogue]

Just received my reply back from the OFT in relation to the same question. here is their reply:

Freedom of Information Act 2000 (‘FoIA’)

 

I am writing further to my colleague’s letter of 8 January 2008 acknowledging your email request for information under the FoIA in which you wrote:

 

“I have been in discussion with the credit reference agency Experian who have advised me that the decision to retain financial information such as credit accounts, credit history, default information and judgments for six years was agreed between the credit industry, the Office of Fair Trading and the Information Commissioner. Six years is considered a reasonable amount of time for data to be retained as it enables lenders to make responsible lending decisions when processing applications by having access to an individual’s credit history over this period.

 

I request under the Freedom of Information Act to be provided with all documentation relating to this decision agreed between the OFT and the credit industry”.

 

Under the FOIA we have a duty to confirm the existence of information requested and to supply that information unless there are good reasons for not doing so.

 

I am writing to advise you that following a search of our paper and electronic records, I have established as follows:

 

We found no evidence of any formal agreement between the OFT, the Information Commissioner and the credit reference agencies on the length of time information can be held on credit reference agency file. However according to a letter (copy enclosed) between the OFT and a company, Credit and Debt Information Services (CDIS) in 1994 which touched on the 6 year retention issue, it seems that the retention period of 6 years has been followed in practice since mid 1970s by credit reference agencies in line with the guidelines issued by the Registry Trust for retention of CCJ information. No staff has any specific recollection of when this was agreed with the OFT.

 

As this is a data protection issue, it is an Information Commissioner (ICO) area of responsibility.

 

They also included the following document which the ICO also supplied

 

 

I'll now be drafting my letter back to Experian over the next few days and ask why they are informing people that it was agreed between then, the ICO and the OFT, when quite clearly is hasnt!

 

It seems to be that no-one knows exactly where the 6 year rule has come from!

[itsamomentintime]

good work powerful rogue

[file_wizzard]

Just received my reply back from the OFT in relation to the same question. It seems to be that no-one knows exactly where the 6 year rule has come from!

This has been "borrowed" from the 1981 Limitation act where a simple form of contract has a 6 year expiry, whereas a sealed contract is enforceable for 12 years.

 

Nonetheless you are quite correct there is no statute or lawful right to retain for this amount of time, it is just considered “reasonable” given the common law precedent sent under the limitations act.

[tomterm8]

This is interestong.

[huggles]

interesting stuff!

 

*subscribes*

[flash]

Well done - a nice bit of research. It's amazing that something arranged so informally can have such a major impact on people's lives. Can it be legally challenged? Perhaps on a human rights issue?

[jysmystry]

I know what has happened here! The OFT and FOC have both made a mistake. They must have done because how else could I have several letters from my friendly bank and Experian in which they repeatedly use terms such as...

 

We are legally obliged/required to load details of the operation of your account with the CRA's

 

...Surely you are not suggesting they are wrong/lying to us about this?

 

In all seriousness those of us who are looking to have defaults removed bow down to you Powerful_rogue, this is what you might call weapons grade scrumpy, I see this response getting banded around a fair bit now

 

Ttruly thank you!!!

[europa16]

Subscribing also. Would love to know the CRAs response to this

[hme.4x4]

I love this thread! it's unbelievable!

isn't it interesting that if I had been Bankrupt, or in many cases committed a crime such as manslaughter, etc it would be considered that my sentence was 'served before 6 years?

Someone said to me a while ago that the criminal justice system was geared to protect the financial industry and not the average Joe..how true!

[Dipply75]

so all this time the cra's have been giving the definite impression that they have to hold all this data legally, and the 6 years is not up to them, its legal.....and its all just out of habit after a few random letters YEARS ago decided this, using whatever random laws they could find to associate with civil debt? Oh, take a bow powerful rogue!

 

Can I challenge the CRA's to remove my old defaults if they cannot prove the 6 year rule - I mean other than 'cause we've always done it this way' lol

 

Any updates on this?

 

So when did the 3 year default 'habit' double, and who decided that?