mummybird V Barclays

[slick132]

Smutley,

 

See my reply to your post #4 on your thread.

 

Slick

[Rooster-UK]

Hi mummybird,

 

I have merged both threads into one to keep it all together.

 

Regards, Rooster

[mummybird]

Hello,

Further to getting my Judgement by Default on the 10th. Sept.(N30)

I am a little confused. Some advice is to sit tight but there is a template letter to use for writing to the Bank, before enforcement. Should I send that now?

Advice much appreciated:?

[mummybird]

Had hoped to get a reply to my last post! So got N30 Judgement for Claimant 14days ago. I note that Tonycee advises waiting 21 days, but on the "Got a judgement" advice there is a template to write to the bank giving them seven days before enforcement proceedings.

 

I didn't realise they could still apply to have judgement set aside. Is this really likely?

Please has anyone got any further advice?

[tezl]

hi,your nearly there,

i took tonys advice and no probs.

it tells you on the, how to get paid, links

.especially now times have changed re,stays and setasides.

wait for 28 days to lapse before reminding them that you exist and you want your money.they then have to have a good reason to get judgement setaside and get another hearing,which will cost them.

within the 28 days they can ask for setaside of judgement and get another hearing and ask for stay,havent seen this happen yet but they might chance their arm now after oft.so just keep stum,i did and money appeared in account without notification.within the 28 days.

tez

[tonycee]

I didn't realise they could still apply to have judgement set aside. Is this really likely?

Please has anyone got any further advice?

 

I havent heard of Bs doing this yet.

Unfortunately it is still possible, NatWest are doing it a lot.

My advice was based purely on my own experiences.

Obviously only you can decide which way to play it.

My fingers are crossed for you and my instinct still says do nothing yet.

[mummybird]

oK you did warn me and Barclays have done it. I can't believe it. This will be quite a long post so stick with me.To save anybody looking at previous posts, I'll do a quick resume of what has happened so far..........

 

8/06/07 Amended my particulars of claim. Took three copies to Cardiff of N1, N244 and updated SOC

 

27/07/07 N244A Notice of hearing of application for 9/08/07 before Judge Hendicott.

 

9/08/07 Appeared before Judge who gave leave to amend POC( issued N24 General Form of Judgement dated 14/08/07 I asked the Judge did I need to sent anything to Barclays - he so no, the court would do that and added that my paperwork was very well presented

and that "The defendants shall file and serve an amended defence within 14 days etc.

An N30 Judgement for the Claimant (in default was issued) on 10/09/07

 

Today a letter from Barclays together with copy of Application Notice

saying "the default judgement in this claim be set aside and the claim be stayed until test case blah blah.

because

the Default Judgement has been entered in error and the test case will cover all aspects of these claims and the High Court will provide a more suitable setting than the Count C."

 

I suspect that this is standard but Part C is a pack of lies

"1. the Claimant had leave to amend POC given by the order of 14/08/07

2. The same order asked the Claimant to re-file the POC with the Court.According to the records of both the Courts and the Defendant this was not complied with.

3. Because the Defendant was not re-served with the new POC their was no opportunity to file an amended defence. This was the reason the Default Judgement was subsequently awardrd in favour of the Claimant."

 

The remaining six points to support their application refer to the High Court Case.

I'm so angry. I took great care to make sure I had done everything correctly. Has the court messed up Surely not. Barclays must be lying. What shall I do - I'll not let it rest.

I won fair and square. Thomas Hickey was the Legal Assistant on this occasion.

:evil: :evil: :evil:

 

 

 

 

[tonycee]

Im really sorry to hear this.

[tezl]

hi,think you have to get to court house ,chain yourself to counter until you get exsplanation of what happened to your ammended pocs.etc.

why would the judge give bs 14 days to file new defence,if there wasnt any new pocs.?

tez

[mummybird]

Thanks Tez

My darling daughter has just come home, after working away for several weeks. She's a lovely girl, who's working her A..... off - trying to make life a little better for OAP's in care homes and to hear this news has devastated her. What's 3000quid to them. Nothing, but everything to her. I just can't cheer her up tonight, even with bubbly:mad: I'll go to Cardiff on Monday. I've got to get the b.........'s

On a practical note following Barclays action will I have forms to fill and a chance to see the judge again?

[slick132]

Hi MB,

 

So, on the basis of info from the Judge, you DID NOT serve copy of the amended POC to Barclays. Is that right.

 

So, IMHO your case balances not on whether bank is lying but on whether you can prove Judge said that Court would send the POC to bank.

 

Slick

[mummybird]

Hi slickwilly 132

Yes I took the judge at his word that- I needed to nothing more. He was (I thought at the time)kind and helpful. If you can't trust a judge, who can you trust? Like most of us I'm not familiar with court procedures and he said my three copies were all that was needed. Funny that one copy was stamped and returned to me? Have I been stupid to assume that another copy went to Barclays and one was retained by the court?

[tonycee]

Today a letter from Barclays together with copy of Application Notice

 

saying "the default judgement in this claim be set aside and the claim be stayed until test case blah blah.

because

the Default Judgement has been entered in error and the test case will cover all aspects of these claims and the High Court will provide a more suitable setting than the Count C."

 

I suspect that this is standard but Part C is a pack of lies

"1. the Claimant had leave to amend POC given by the order of 14/08/07

2. The same order asked the Claimant to re-file the POC with the Court.According to the records of both the Courts and the Defendant this was not complied with.

3. Because the Defendant was not re-served with the new POC their was no opportunity to file an amended defence. This was the reason the Default Judgement was subsequently awardrd in favour of the Claimant."

 

Are these not quotes from Bs own response.

I see nothing from the court to say the application has been granted.

I think they are just using the system to their advantage.

 

I think on your visit to court, you should ask about another hearing.

Slick is right, i dont believe for one second the courts would admit to NOT SENDING the new POC, this sevice is included as part of your court fee.

I will make a phone call tomorrow.

All is not lost.

[slick132]

MB,

 

You've certainly not been stupid.

 

Further thought re my opinion above, what is relevant is whether bank received a copy of the new POC, whether from you or Court. Only if the POC was sent to bank by Rec'd Del'y with proof of delivery could you prove bank HAS rec'd them.

 

Even if it's the Court's fault POC wasn't fwd'd, there's little you can do now, as far as I'm aware.

 

I would dearly love to be proved wrong by someone with greater knowledge.

 

Slick

[mummybird]

Thanks Tonycee and slickwilly132. In retrospect I should have send a further copy to Barclays rec.del. but I didn't.......

[tonycee]

In the eyes of the courts.

You need proof of posting, not proof of receipt.

I believe proof of despatch, is deemed as proof of service.

By all means tell me im wrong.

I would simply ask the court to forward another copy.

Its THEIR obligation to dispatch documents accordingly, appropriately, and diligently.

Thats why you pay a fee, thats why they stamp all 3 copies.

 

Ive said on many occasions that the courts make lots of mistakes, 12 in my own 3 claims.

I have read many threads where i could not believe what i was reading.

 

Can i prove it was the courts fault. ? Nah.

Will they admit it was their fault. ? Nah.

Have you got anything to lose by trying ? Nah.

 

Please stay positive on this for the moment.

[mummybird]

T

elephoned Cardiff today. Spoke to somebody in the District Judges Listing Office. She said I would be hearing from the court in the next few days had ticked and although Barclays had ticked "without a hearing", there would be a hearing and I would be able to attend.

She said if Barclays hadn't received an amended POC it was the courts fault not mine, so this would be in my favour.

And of course they did know about the amended POC because it says so on their N244 (and the date)

Wish I had that in writing.

Had a sleepless night thinking about Barclays dirty tricks - so am going to to try and shut my brain down tonight with the aid of a couple of Vodka's.

[slick132]

Hi MB,

 

Just been reading GaryH's thread which d/w N244 where claim started out weakly - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/47344-claim-too-vague-defence.html

 

And I quote:-

 

" The Court will then amend the details, re-seal the claim and return it to you and it is your responsibility to re-serve it on the Defendant. Ensure that you keep a copy of the sealed N1 for yourself too. Once you have served the claim you should send the Court a completed certificate of service, here http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/c.../n215_0106.pdf along with a copy of the N1 so the court knows when the bank need to respond. "

 

Slick

[mummybird]

Have read Gary's post. So why did the judge tell me I didn't need to send anything to Barclays and also the comments from the court yesterday and why did she say I would be receiving a copy of Barclays N244 from the court in the next few days, if they didn't serve mine to Barclays.

Is it to late to do anything now? I feel so utterly demoralised, but I'll try anything if anyone has any suggestions.

Why can't we trust the courts?

[slick132]

MB,

 

No idea why judge said to you what he said. Just posted this cos I came across it and it helps explain how this happened.

 

Don't know how you might progress now.

 

Ideas anyone?

 

Slick

[mummybird]

Thanks slickwilly will wait and see what comes from the court in the next few days. Meantime somebody might have an idea. More vodka 2nite methinks!

 

Me and the daughter (barclays victim) have just spend two days stripping (!), battoning, refelting and tiling our roof - so Cream crackered.

However will probably be on this sight at 4.30 am 2morrow as better-half will be watching the Jap Grand Prix. He'll keep bringing me cups of tea until I have to get up.

Luv to you all

[smutley]

Really hope this works out for you MB - Im a bit confused though as I also updated my POC/SOC, sent in 3 copies to court and also one off to barclays. Got general form judgement back from court, 1. leave granted to amend particulars of claim, 2. case thereafter stayed. I havent done anything. but I didnt get anything back stamped, so just assumed that was it, wondering now if I should have sent the amended POC/SOC to barclays with a copy of the general form of judgement...

[olden]

Hi there mb, I am so sorry this happened to you , it is way out of order!! As you say if the judge said to you that the court would send to Barclays, that is good enough. They normally are responsible for forwarding copies between claimants and defendants, but the only snag is they do not use recorded delivery. that doesn't mean the court won't have proof themselves, I should think they would have some sort of record of what goes out. If I were you I would ask them for proof and surely the judges decision still stands (just thought, they are lying b...... I sent all my copies to the bank myself by recorded delivery, they still lied and said in their ' defence ' that they had not recieved details

[tonycee]

And of course they did know about the amended POC because it says so on their N244 (and the date)

Wish I had that in writing.

 

Then the court must have the original.

Have you asked for a copy.

[mummybird]

Thanks for all your support - do you think I should go to Cardiff and try and sort it out. Presumably one can see members of staff of approriate departments without an appointment.