Hope so. I will keep you posted. Thanks.

If I had any luck it would be bad! Here we go again. I have just taken delivery of a brand new Aquarium from an online retailer. Upon delivery i removed the outer packaging to ensure there was no glass breakage before allowing the driver to leave and signing for the package as being received 'in good condition' Now the package itself was too very large boxes upon a pallet, which the driver removed from said pallet in order to remove the boxes individually from the wagon. My colleague from work had to help me to lift the boxes off the wagon and into my house. My first question is with regard to the delivery and/or collection of a faulty item. Is it my responsibility to help load/unload when the packaging is clearly labelled as "over 25kg 2 man lift"? Secondly, upon further unpacking and inspection, a number of quality issues became apparent. 1) The black vinyl backing on the rear glass has a piece of white backing paper left on it meaning there is a white 'patch' showing inside the tank. 2) The underside of the tank surround which overhangs the cabinet has paint scuffed off. 3) The bottom left corner of this overhang has a paint run. 4) There is evidence of filler in the mitred joint of the top pelmet which has not been sufficiently covered with paint. 5) There is a small gap/split in the face of the mitred joint in same corner. 6) There is a small chip in the cabinet door PRIOR to painting. 7) There is evidence of masking tape glue all round the adjustable feet as a result they are a dirty cream colour instead of white. I have emailed the store to tell them the quality is shocking and I want a full refund and for them to collect the faulty goods. QUESTIONS: Am I right to claim under Section 14 of SOGA subsection 2 and 2A? Is it up to them to ensure 2 guys come to collect it as my friend and I might not be available and what if we dropped it! Surely they should send 2 guys for a large package? Its even too heavy for my girlfriend to help me lift back into the conservatory where we left the packaging after my friend and I placed it in the living room before fully inspecting it! Any advice appreciated please? Trying to upload pics from PC but keep getting message "this is not a valid image file" despite the thumbnails showing in my image folder??? How do I upload from photobucket??

Done! Light went back today by courier. Thanks to all for your patience and help.

I might have got this sorted now after all. I sent the links regarding the BBC News report into online retailers flouting DSR's by email to the supplier and received an email back in which he said he had seen his solicitor and he conceeded that I was indeed entitled to a refund. He explained that his terms & conditions were put in place by his website designer and that he would be ammending them. He said that he was quite new to internet shopping and was not familiar with the additional rights of the consumer. He agreed to give me a full refund to my credit card but still insisted on getting the goods back first saying that his solicitor had said I should do so, so I have agreed to send them back as he is no longer stating that the refund is conditional. Apparently his solicitor did say that a refund was due even if the product had been opened, but his solicitor still reckoned that they should not be 'used'. Despite this he indicated he will still refund.

Also, do I have to have an engineer when the last fridge freezer they brought us had the same fault. In fact do I have to have an engineer at all? I thought faulty goods could be rejected anyway?

I havent done anything yet as I am trying to determine whether I have cause to reject the item on the basis that it was delivered 'not as ordered'?

Thanks people I've heard this on the news today also... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19910561 I have also read that if the T&C's are on their website, they also have to send you 'written' information in 'durable form' ie email or letter, detailing their returns policy and who is responsible for return postage. If they don't then they can't charge anything. This is what I thought. You should see the big fuss/argument this caused on the other Legal (dogs that rhyme with eagles) site for thread entitled "Section 75 yes or no" where I have been totally confused as to whether to pursue Section 75 for S13 of SOGA or DSR's!!! http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2012/oct/12/top-retailers-oft-action-online-services

That sounds like a plan! Thanks for the advice.

Thanks Nagasis I think that is good advice. Thanks Conniff

It is really annoying we can hear it when we go to bed!

I wouldnt mind but when we ordered it the picture on the website showed a fridge freezer with silver handles. When it arrived-no handles. Spent ages on the phone and they told me i had old model and they would re-order the 'correct' one. Then it arrives-no handles! So the delivery guy phones his depot and tells them and then wrote on the delivery note that customer said it is not the right model. So I have 2 approaches. 1) Complain about noise and request new. OR 2) How long would I have to send it back based on the wrong model-or has that passed?

To be honest it all got a little silly once he started BS'ing me I guess I got defensive! I was annoyed he was so 'nice' until I tried to exercise my 'right' to cancel and it annoyed me as I explained my reasons when I didn't have to and they are pretty good reasons IMO! I am worried that: 1) He may well collect the items then 'deduct' for his time and travel from West Midlands area to West Yorkshire area. 2) He may claim the goods are damaged or even damage them himself to be blooming awkward! 3)He may just collect and then still say he is entitled to make deductions or not to refund 'because the package was opened' I don't know whether it is worth making a fresh approach or if he will just think I'm on the back foot due to his mention of his solicitor appointment. I am kind of hoping that his solicitor will explain his obligations under DSR's and he will agree to a full refund.

Let me explain: Initially the supplier was very nice and very helpful. They phoned to thank me for my order and then asked if I needed any brackets (these are an alternative method of mounting to the supposedly 'included' hanging kit and are priced separately at £69). As I had not yet decided upon the final spec of my aquarium (not ordered yet from different supplier), I said that I wasn't sure how I was mounting it yet and I would leave the ordering of the brackets until I knew how thick the glass was to be on my aquarium (as this needed to be specified for the brackets). At this point I figured I might end up using the 'included' hanging kit anyway. So, the light arrives, I unpacked it. The first thing I noticed was no hanging kit, no instructions, no other information. I tried it out on the living room floor (I have no aquarium yet) and yes I was pretty impressed with it. However, I am very disappointed that there is no hanging kit and so I emailed the supplier and told him the light was pretty awesome but that I was disappointed that there was no hanging kit. He replied that the hanging kit was 'no longer included with the light since the manufacturer had reduced the prices across the range', he claimed by £499! (Expensive hanging kit then!) He said I could take it up with the manufacturer if I wished. At this point I got the impression that maybe he wasn't as helpful as I first thought. So bearing in mind this light cost £1674.99, and the bespoke (marine) aquarium quotes were coming in at around £1300, and the associated equipment was going to add up to around £1000, I was not happy that I would now be forced to pay for whichever mounting kit I decided to use. Then, the day after I return home from work to be given the news that I am an expectant father! Suddenly the aquarium project is no longer the priority and we have to consider the costs of baby equipment etc as well as the increasing potential costs of the aquarium project! So after discussions with my better half we decided to exercise our right to a refund on the light. We discussed how nice this guy had been up to that point and we felt bad so I went out of my way to explain our situation and hoped that he would understand. I explained that the aquarium project would not be happening that I was sorry for any inconvenience, but I was still within my 7 day cancellation period and I had no choice as I could not return the baby! This is what I sent him: (Dear Supplier) I am absolutely gutted about this aspect, but I am going to have to send the light back and cancel the contract! I have mixed feelings and should be overjoyed at the news but the timing is appalling! Due to a significant change in our circumstances, I just cannot see a way to continue with the rising cost of this project at the present time. It has suddenly become very low on our list of priorities. I am going to be relying on the refund for this to pay my credit card now...... and buy a pram!!!! I was delighted with both your service and the product and I regret having to do this when you have been so helpful and have even included complimentary items! (This is reference to a "V-Link" dongle USB type device he had said he would include FOC) I will arrange to send this back to you first thing tomorrow morning. It is still packaged in the original packaging. It's a blessing in disguise that I am still within my 7 days from delivery cooling off period. God knows how I would have managed otherwise! I would like to take this opportunity to thank you for your outstanding customer service so far , and would hope that I will be welcomed back as a customer at some time in the future. I am very sorry. You have been great, but I have to make a choice, aquarium or baby.. ..and I cant send the other one back!!! Sincere apologies, His response was as follows: (Dear Redletter) "Bit of a surprise to say the least but regarding returning the unit we cannot accept the unit for return for refund due to the fact the unit has not remained new and unopened due to the fact you have stated in previous emails that you have used and installed the light rendering used and unable for us to resell the unit as new. We can on receiving the light if you still wish to return it assess its condition and possibly discuss the refund but we are unfortunately not obliged to give you a refund under trading laws and our TAC once the item has been used and opened which it clearly has from your own words. We will do our best to help you in with this situation but it will be at our discretion." So I responded with this: "Not as surprised as I am-trust me! I am also surprised at your lack of knowledge with regard to the Distance Selling Regulations. I have checked the law on this one and your TAC cannot be outside of the law as to compromise my statutory rights. I have a right to inspect and try out the goods. My rights do not depend on them being unopened or unused as you state. I have not even got a fish tank so I do not accept the light unit was installed in any shape or form. If you are in any doubt of your legal obligations, please see the following OFT guidelines taken from their website; http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/general/oft698.pdf" Where the DSRs give consumers the right to cancel an order, this right is unconditional and begins from the moment the contract is concluded. Unlike when buying from a shop, the first time that a consumer will typically have an opportunity to examine goods purchased by distance means is when they receive them. The DSRs give consumers who buy by distance means more rights than consumers who shop in person. When a distance consumer cancels a contract to which the cancellation provisions apply they are entitled to a refund of any money they have paid in relation to the contract even if the goods are not defective in any way. Please also see paragraph 3.46 for further information We are conscious of concerns about reselling items which may raise concerns about hygiene. However, the DSRs do not link cancellation rights with a supplier’s ability to resell items as new. 3.43 With items that fall outside the exceptions, cancellation rights will apply, but the consumer has a duty under the DSRs to take reasonable care of the goods throughout the cancellation period. 3.44 What constitutes reasonable care depends on a number of things. It may be reasonable for the supplier to stipulate what they consider to be reasonable care , such as not removing hygiene seals on garments or only trying out shoes indoors. But these stipulations cannot restrict a consumer’s reasonable opportunity to inspect and assess the product. Consumers have the right to cancel even if they fail to take reasonable care of the goods.. The DSRs require you to refund any money paid by or on behalf of the consumer in relation to the contract to the person who made the payment. This means the full price of the goods, or deposit or prepayment made, including the cost of delivery. The essence of distance selling is that consumers buy from home and receive goods at home. In these circumstances, almost every case of home shopping will involve delivery of the goods ordered and so delivery forms an essential part of the contract. Re the V-Link... But you must make sure consumers have agreed to receive the gift by placing an order. Otherwise the consumers can treat the gift as unsolicited and can keep it as though it were an unconditional gift. I am disappointed that you have chosen to take this approach as I am only exercising my right to cancel. I have no obligation to return the goods before a refund is given, but I have expressed a wish to do so. Please be aware that the right to a refund is not in any way linked to the condition of the goods upon return.... "On cancellation, if your customer can prove they returned an item in an appropriate way, they will not have to bear the cost of any loss or damage to the goods in transit." As you have acknowledged receipt of my notice of cancellation.... A customer must tell you in writing, or in another durable medium, if they want to cancel. The customer can give notice by; faxing or emailing the notice to you on the last fax number or email address known to the customer, in which case notice is said to have been given on the day it was sent. Therefore notice has now been served and I await your instructions regarding return of the goods. Please be aware you are legally required to make a full refund within 30 days of the notice I have served today 27th September 2012 which you have acknowledged. I trust this is satisfactory, Regards, (Redletter) I then followed it up with this and also by post by recorded delivery. (Dear Supplier) "With regard to the below order received on Tuesday 25th September 2012. Please take this as confirmation that; Under the above regulations, I would like to cancel this order and ask you to confirm that you will not be claiming any payment and that a refund will be made to the credit card on which I made payment. This is in line with regulation 14 section 1 which states that "on the cancellation of a contract under section 10, the supplier shall reimburse any sum paid by or on behalf of the consumer under or in relation to the contract to the person by whom it was made free of any charge". Please contact me within 14 days to arrange return of the goods. I understand that as per the above regulations (regulation 10 sections 1 & 2) you are not able to make any restocking charge(s) as I am cancelling the contract within 7 days of delivery as per my statutory cooling off period. As such the regulations state that "the effect of a notice of cancellation is that the contract shall be treated as if it had never been made”. Please accept my apologies for any inconvenience caused. Kind Regards, (Redletter)" Hope you are keeping up! His response then was: you have stated in a number of emails that you have clearly opened and used the goods to which I have on email s o that would clearly under mind your statement of not used and unopened you have purchased goods under MY terms and conditions they are not your statuary rights you have entered a contract with us on your purchase and those are our terms regardless of your statuary rights you have entered a legally bidding contract with us once you agree to purchase from our store. As I have stated once I receive the light I will asses situation and no longer wish continue this conversation at this hour!! How ever I will call you first thing in the morning to discus the returning of the light. So I sent this... Had you read my last email fully you would see that the Distance Selling REGULATIONS do not require returned goods to be in a resaleable condition. However, as I have stated, the goods ARE in brand new originally packaged condition and there should not be a problem. The whole point of the DSR's is to give the customer reasonable time to inspect and try out the goods, which means that your requirement to return the goods unopened is an unfair term. However, again, as I previously stated YOU ARE REQUIRED BY LAW to provide aFULL REFUND AS SOON AS POSSIBLE AND IN ANY CASE WITHIN 30 DAYS OF RECEIVING MY NOTICE OF CANCELLATION! See also Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008. The CPRs can apply to the use of unfair contract terms. They are intended to provide broad protection for consumers, and business practices which are likely to distort consumers' decisions regarding their purchases generally fall within their scope. Certain kinds of unfair term can have that distorting effect, for instance through misleading consumers about their rights. The use of such terms could give rise to enforcement action under the CPRs as well as, or instead of, the Regulations. Your previous emails could also be deemed to be an attempt at misleading the consumer with regard to my rights and I also reserve the right to keep copies of our correspondence for the purpose of evidence. "If a term is unfair, it is not legally binding on the consumer." I will await a full refund to my account. If this does not take place within 30 days of today 27th September 2012 I will take the necessary steps to force you to carry out your legal obligation AND report you to the OFT for unfair Terms. I do not need to argue further as the LAW is clear in this matter. Please abide by it. Thank you. Then got this.... no light no refund simple and can peruse that if you wish you have received goods and you have agreed that in email if you now wish to return then do so as long as they are in original packing and in satisfactory condition a refund will be made or if you wish not return them I can collect them form either address I have on file that you choose??!! Kind Regards and sent this... Please find attached OFT guide which clearly explains your obligations in law. Please see relevant paragraphs 3.46, 3.47, 3.48. Please pay particular attention to paragraph 3.51 Please also note that I could, if I wanted to consider the complimentary V-Link as a gift as per paragraph 3.58. Please also consider that according to paragraph 3.74 you could potentially be committing a CRIMINAL offence by requesting any payment for said gift. This should clarify the position with regard to your statement "no light no refund". As you can see it is not that simple and I will return the light once the refund has been received as cleared funds into my credit card account from which it was paid. This must take place within 30 days of my notification of 27 September 2012 which you have acknowledged. I trust this leaves you in no doubt of my position in this matter. Kind Regards, Then HE threatens ME with a solicitor!... You have been given that light by means of sale in good faith by myself now you are attempting to steel the light in my eyes and this will not be stood for in anyway shape form!!! you can return the light and I can then refund you will not be getting any refund until I receive the light simple!!! If you do not wish to send the light back and you can then go about whatever means you wish to try to get a refund I will now today inform my solicitor about this attempt to steel the light and place it in their hands. So simple return the light or I will collect it!! If you choose to keep hold of it and request a refund also. Sent this.... Don't be so ridiculous! I have furnished you with a copy of the OFT guide which outlines the law. You really need to read it carefully. Firstly upon accepting my order you are required to send me specific pre-contractual information, in 'durable form'. This means something I can keep rather than referring me to T&C's on your website which you are able to modify at any time after I have entered into a contract. You are required to supply certain information on acceptance of my order IN WRITING outlining your returns policy, postal address etc including details of who should pay return postage in the event of a return. As you failed to provide this the assumption can be made that you will be liable for the return postage or collection. As I indicated previously, contrary to your statement of "no light no refund" you are in breach of the regulations to withold my money after 30 days from the date you received the notification. So here you are in breach of the law accusing ME of being a common criminal and accusing me of attempted theft! I would be very careful if i were in your position as I too can instruct a solicitor for libel and slander! Please feel free to consult your solicitor, as he too will advise you of what your obligations are in law and that will only serve to incurr further costs to you. Had you been aware of these obligations in the first place you would know that you are in breach of the regulations by refusing to refund and claiming you have the right to inspect the goods and only refund at your discretion. Had you been the reasonable, honest person I thought you were when you were really helpful whilst taking money from me then we wouldn't be in this situation now. The law is the law and i totally refute your accusation of attempted theft. As I'm sure your solicitor will advise you, I am well within my rights and to expect a refund and then to arrange the return of the goods at your cost. I am under no obligation to return the goods before a refund is given, only to take reasonable care of the goods whilst in my possession. Quite simply if you do not make the refund as soon as possible and as the law states 'in any case within 30 days" then you are the thief not me as you will be withholding my money to which you have no legal right. The regulations state that my right to a refund is unconditional. I would have trusted you completely and returned the light in good faith had you not tried to mislead me and compromise my consumer rights. I have only stated facts based on law and I have supported those facts by providing you with the facts in the form of the OFT guide which clearly outlines both our obligations in law. For you to continue with your position to refuse my FULL refund in view of having the facts there in front of you is both arrogant and foolish. As I said please feel free to consult a solicitor, as unlike you, I have not broken any laws! Please also do not attempt to contact me by telephone, as for the purpose of keeping accurate records, I will only correspond in writing either by email or by post. I will in fact I will no longer be drawn into squabbling on points of law. The law is clear and you have the remainder of 30 days in which to make a full refund, after which time you have my assurance that the goods will be returned. and this...... Dear Supplier, I hope this clarifies the law for you. http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/distance-selling-downloads/Explained/DSexplained_PDF.pdf Please pay particular attention to pages 24,30,31,34 Regards, Redletter Dear Supplier, You say in your opinion I am dishonest. Can you tell me how you arrive at this conclusion? I am not the one trying to mislead my customers with lies and unlawful terms which clearly restrict the customers' rights despite your claim that they will not! I have done nothing but provide the facts and your blatant disregard for legislation does not exempt you from being bound by its requirements in law. Please read the following and then consider your position. The fact is you are required by law to obey the legislation regardless of whether or not you agree with it. Please explain to me why you think the law does not apply to you? Are you refusing to comply with consumer law? I would once again ask that you grant me a full refund, at which time I fully intend to return the goods as promised. I give you my assurance that the goods have only been inspected and tested and not damaged in any way. They were simply tested and then placed back in the original packaging, which is not a requirement or condition of a refund in any case! In actual fact you cannot claim that the box was complete and sealed, as the instructions were missing (confirmed by Vertex that there should have been some in the box), and you have obviously opened the box in order to place the V-Link inside it which you indicated you were including as a gift. Therefore the box had already been opened anyway! However, this is irrelavent as per pages 26 and 27 which clearly outline that I have the right to open and test the goods! For the avoidance of doubt I have attached the source of the following information, and I will keep a record of all correspondence so that if and when this matter is escalated, the court will be able to see that I have complied fully with MY obligations as defined in the afore mentioned Regulations. PAGE32: The Consumer Protection (Distance Selling) Regulations 2000 (DSRs) The DSRs implement European Council Directive (97/7/EC) and, for most goods and services, provide additional rights to consumers buying at a distance to encourage confidence in this method of buying. The protection the DSRs offer is important because customers cannot inspect goods or services before they buy when they shop at a distance. The DSRs also contain provisions aimed at ensuring that businesses do not use contractual terms that deny consumers their rights under the DSRs, or impose obligations on consumers that are inconsistent with them. All member states of the European Union (EU) must implement the Directive in their national legislation. The DSRs came into force on 31 October 2000 and were amended by SI 689/2005 effective from 6 April 2005. PAGE26: DSRs do not link cancellation rights with your ability to resell items as new. Unless the item falls under the cancellation exemption, customers can cancel a contract and return the goods to you even if they have opened and tested the goods and, as a result, you are unable to resell them. PAGE27: Packaging The purpose of the DSRs is to allow customers to examine goods they have ordered as they would in a shop. If that requires opening the packaging and trying out the goods, then they have not breached their duty to take reasonable care of the goods. In these circumstances, you cannot insist that customers return the goods as new or in their original packaging. You may ask customers to take care when they open the package or return goods with the original packaging, but you cannot insist on this. The DSRs do not provide for goods to be returned in a fit state for resale. PAGE28: Refunding a cancelled order You should refund a customer’s money as soon as possible after they cancel an order, and in any case, within 30 days at the latest. The right to a refund is not connected either to the return of the product nor the customer’s duty to exercise reasonable care of the goods. You must refund the customer’s money even if you have not yet collected the goods or had them returned to you by the customer. You cannot insist on receiving the goods before you make a refund. PAGE29: Who pays for returning the goods if the customer cancels an order? If you want the customer to return the goods and to pay for that return, you must make it clear in the contract and as part of the required written information. If you did not include these details in the required written information then you cannot charge anything. I must again express my disappointment at your change in attitude and your unproffessional conduct in this matter. It seems you were happy to be nice and polite to me when you were taking my order and my money. But now that I have requested to cancel my contract with you, and obtain a refund, which I am perfectly within my rights to do so you have completely changed and become arrogant and rude towards me, even accusing me of stealing! Its a real shame as this project is only postponed not written off and when it does finally get off the ground I will take my custom elsewhere. Had you just honoured my right to cancel my contract and not insisted that you somehow have the right to adapt the regulations to your advantage, I would probably have re-ordered with you at some later date and as I said before would have most probably made you my preferred supplier. You simply do not have the right to insist on return of the items or to give a refund 'at your discretion'! It is your legal obligation to do so. I trust this clarifies the situation and I await my refund in full. Kind Regards, Redletter Dear Redletter, You have been offered a refund many times upon me receiving the goods never have I said you would not I have already given you goods in good faith once and you will honour your purchase agreement I will not do that again as you are quite clearly not a honest person (in my opinion). As I pointed out that a refund WILL BE GIVEN once I can confirm that you have in no way damaged the goods that you have received AND USED!!!. So you may go through all the legislation you wish but that is the fact. Regards, Supplier. In response to me (kindly) forwarding copies of DTI and OFT guides.... Dear Redletter, I have made you aware of my position many times you also need to check your information carefully as they and I quote are no means law they are meant as a guide only for the facts of law please consult a legal advisor un quote. Those GUIDES also point out that they do not apply to computer software were the seal has been broken by the consumer used and installed by definition the whole unit is computer software and you clearly broken the seal used and installed the software!! As I pointed out I have forward the query to my OATA (as i am a member) to pass onto my FREE legal advisor so I suggest you EMPLOY your own legal adviser if you to Pursue your course of action. As you wish not to take calls to discuss the matter I will no longer explain myself time and time again. Kind Regards So now he claims a £1700 LED light unit is 'Software'!!! Latest contact email after no acknowledgement of posted letter confirmed delivered 01/10/12... Please be advised I have a meeting with a solicitor next week to clarify my legal obligations to the matter of returning the light as you have pointed on a number of occasions of your possible rights to returning the light these need to confirmed as soon as this is done I’ll be in touch regarding my next course of action. I will aim to do this as soon as possible and within the 30 days you have outlined. Regards Supplier. Response from Consumer Direct now aka Citizens Advice complaint.. Dear Redletter, Thank you for your enquiry to the Citizens Advice consumer service dated 09/10/2012. Your reference number for this case is **************and should be quoted in all further correspondence regarding this case. We understand from your email that a trader has refused to refund under the Distance Selling Regulations and you are trying to establish what your rights may be. Based on the information you have provided the key legal points in response to your enquiry are: When you enter into a contract with a trader by means of a distance communication (telephone, internet, mail order etc.) you will generally have cancellation rights under the Distance Selling Regulations. The period in which you can cancel starts when you place the order. When this period ends depends on when the trader provides written information (in print or by email) confirming details of the order and your cancellation rights: • If the trader sends the written information before they send the goods or enclosed with the goods – the cancellation period ends 7 working days after the goods are received; • If the trader sends the written information after the goods - the cancellation period ends 7 working days after the written information is received; • If the trader does not send the written information – the cancellation period ends 3 months and 7 working days from the day after the goods are received to cancel. If you cancel you may ask for a full refund (including any delivery charges). The trader must provide this refund within 30 days. The law allows a trader up to 30 days to deliver goods that are ordered at a distance, unless specific arrangements have been made for delivery within a certain time frame. If goods are not delivered within 30 days the consumer may consider the contract automatically cancelled. The trader may ask you to return the goods and / or pay the return costs but can only do so if it was made clear in the written information. If the written information does not specify that you are responsible for returning the goods, you may expect the trader to collect the goods; if it does not specify you are responsible for the cost of return then the trader must bear this cost. Until the goods are returned to (or collected by) the trader, you have a ‘duty of care’ over the goods so it is important not to use the goods or do anything else which may damage them as this may mean the trader is not obliged to provide a full refund. To cancel you must inform the trader either by letter, email or fax and it must be sent before the end of the cancellation period. We would advise to include details (e.g. any order reference number) to help the trader match your cancellation request to their records; it is also advisable to keep a copy of your cancellation request and if posting, to get ‘proof of postage’ so you can prove that you sent the cancellation request before the end of the cancellation period. You do not necessarily have to return the goods to the trader within 7 days; sometimes this can be difficult to do in this period. You do have a duty of care over the goods, and if you have used them the trader may be able to claim damages from you if there are any losses to the trader as a result of this. However, this would be an entirely separate issue to your rights under the Distance Selling Regulations. The trader cannot overrule statutory law with his terms and conditions, and to attempt to do so may be deemed to be a criminal offence. You would not have any rights under the Distance Selling Regulations if this were a trade to trade purchase. At this stage you should formalise your complaint by sending the trader a letter in the post by recorded delivery. The letter should outline any relevant events regarding this issue and make it clear what you expect from the trader and why. It should also give the trader a reasonable timeframe in which to respond to your claim(s), we would suggest 14 days. If the trader does not respond to this letter with a satisfactory remedy you should send the trader one more recorded delivery letter. This time giving the trader 7 days in which to respond, making it clear to the trader that this is your final letter before taking further action. You should keep copies of all letters sent. Template letters can be found at: Http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/consumer_e/consumer_taking_action_e/consumer_making_a_complaint_e/consumer_sample_letters_e/list_of_sample_letters.htm (if the link does not work when you click it, please copy and paste it into your browser address bar). In this case, the letter named ‘Letter cancelling a distance sale to buy goods.’ would be most suitable. When using the template letters it is important that you follow the online instructions carefully. In addition, once the letter has been generated it may also need further editing, in order to make it clear to the trader what the nature of your complaint is. The reason we ask you to send mail by recorded delivery is that this may help you prove that you have contacted the trader and tried to resolve the matter amicably, you can also use the ‘Recorded Signed For’ label the post office will supply you with to confirm that the trader has received the letter. In our experience, this is the best way to proceed before you escalate your claim with the appropriate independent body i.e. Ombudsman scheme, Alternative Dispute Resolution scheme (A.D.R) or even a civil court. If you require any further advice or information about this case, please do not hesitate to contact the Citizens Advice consumer service by return email or on 08454 04 05 06 quoting the case reference number. Thank you for your enquiry.

My point is can I use Section 75 for breach of DSR's or would I need to take the alternative path of SOGA with regard to missing hanging kit/not as described??

I have just read a thread on this website to do with Complaints regarding Section 75 claims from the FOS and it stated the following; "There is no automatic entitlement to a refund under Section 75 where, for example, the customer has simply changed their mind." So can I use this route in my case or not?? Thanks

Thanks. It is a Hotpoint FUFL 1810 P

Hi I forgot to update this but I did eventually get my deposit back!!!!!

Thanks dx sorry if I'm being thick here but would I need to write a letter to Cahoot requesting either/or or should I try each approach separately? Include emails from supplier? According to that weblink above for out-law.com, (cant remeber how its worded but to the effect of;) if the consumer keeps the goods as security against the refund there is no obligation to return said 'security' until the supplier has released the funds against the goods.. Great minds think alike_ I unpacked it again and took several photos with copy of front page of newspaper in the frame! Maybe I should send a ransome note! (Joking!)

Hi can anyone tell me what my rights are regarding a Fridge Freezer which was noisy from day one. According to the manual some noise of the refrigerant is 'normal' but the noise is meant to stop after a 'couple of weeks' once everything has 'settled down'. It hasn't! It crackles and pops like a bowl of Rice Crispies with Tourettes! It is in the kitchen but can be heard in the lounge and upstairs when we are in bed. I was willing to wait a while to see if it stopped but it is clear now it has not improved. Not sure if this is relevant but this is the second one we have had. The first one was not the same as the one in the picture on the website and the door was dented. I spent ages (and lots of 10p's per minute) on the phone trying to find out which model was the one in the picture. After assurances that the first one must have been old stock the second one turned up and was the same. I informed the driver this was not the one we were told we were getting and he phoned his 'office/depot' and told them as well as writing this on the delivery note we signed. Would this count as rejection of the item at delivery? If not/so what action should I take? Thanks in advance PS It is less than 6 months old.

em to Thanks dx but can you clarify which route applies, Chargeback or a Section 75 request? If the past is anything to go by Cahoot wont help me. I asked them before when a car dealer refused to return my deposit on a cancelled vehicle purchase. Eventually, after a while I got it back but with no help from Cahoot! In either case do I need to wait until the 30 days expires or can I report him now?

Thanks Locutus it was a box standard product. The guy must have been reading the OFT guides I sent him on DSR's cos he is now trying to say that the LED LIGHT UNIT comes under the definition of 'computer software'! The unit is programmable but there was no software with it. I would have to download the software via my PC and the dongle (V-Link) that he sent me FOC. Err I already went on the fish forum and tried to warn people but the moderator deleted my thread and this morning I got a slapped wrist email! If I use chargeback would I have to change my reason to 'materially different/parts missing' or can I do it purely on the basis that he is refusing a refund to which the DSR's say I'm entitled to? I looked up the 'Visa chargeback reason codes' and there was 53 'not as described' and the another I can't quite remember but something to do with customer returned item but trader failing to give credit?? Bump Can anyone tell me if I can use Section 75 for this dispute and if so do I need to wait until the 30 day refund window has expired or can I just send a copy of the email claiming "MY TAC's are nothing to do with the regulations" and "no light no refund"??

Thanks. Thank you

Hi I put a thread on here and despite 37 views not one comment? Am I doing something wrong? I haven't used this site in a while!

Hi can anyone tell me what course of action to take when a supplier is refusing to refund for goods inside of the 7 day cancellation period? They have acknowledged my request to cancel and are stating that I must first return the goods and then they will evaluate them and will 'see what they can do but any refund will be at their discretion'! They are stating that, because I have opened the packaging I do not have the right to return it. This is despite the fact that they have already opened the box to include a complimentary accessory which I did not order! I have read the OFT guide and it clearly states that the return of the goods cannot be made a condition of a refund. The refund must be made within 30 days of my notice to cancel regardless. You can understand my concerns that I might return the goods and they might deliberately cause damage or claim that they are damaged upon return and so I do not agree to send them back until after the refund has been given. If they stick to their guns and the 30 days expires what do I do next? Thanks I have just read the OFT guide in more depth and have seen a section relating to pre-contractual information. It states that once the consumer decides to buy, the supplier must provide pre contractual information in 'durable form' and that this must be in writing in order that the consumer may keep a copy. It states that certain information must be included in this such as the stores address, their returns policy etc. In actual fact I received nothing except an order confirmation stating the goods and the price. It did not even give me their postal address I had to look this up! Does this mean that they are already in breach of their obligations before I even cancelled? What are the implications of this, as the supplier is quoting his online T&C's as being nothing to do with my statutory rights etc?? Thanks in advance-anyone??

Thanks but as I stated above I have contacted The credit card company who have said they cannot assist me as it is a dispute with the merchant!!!