ABBEY BANK

[TUTTSI]

Hi Guys

Have just joined this forum and I wanted to share with you all another one of Abbey's quirks.

 

A few weeks ago I made a bill paypayment to leave my account on the same day I knew I had a cheque clearing and also 2 bacs payments were also due on that day as credits in my account as cleared funds. 2 days later I receive a letter from their operations department to say that I had insufficient funds to make the bill payment. Although on this occassion they did not charge me. This was I thought to be impossible since I had enough cleared funds on that day.

 

I raised this issue with their call centre in India - what a nightmare! eventually after a frustrating 30 minutes of time wasting someone who understood me took up my complaint and eventually called me back and explained to me that the money clearing in the account did not clear until 9am that morning but bill payments were scheduled to go out at 1 minute past mid night, therefore they said that I did not have funds at a minute past midnight. But surely in my eyes a day is 24 hours so cheques clearing and BACS payments should all clear at a minute past midnight.

 

This posses another problem, that, has this happened before and have we been charged for these quirks in their system. I know myself that Abbey have charged me on many occassions ££££ssss of bank charges and apart from them overcharging have they been grabbing extra charges due to this particular quirk. I have been given £10 so far for this - but watch this space as I fully intend to recover all that is owed to me.

 

My only concern on the bigger issue, is that from reading some of your postings Abbey have closed account! can they do this! Has anybody checked the terms and conditions for them closing accounts! is it legal!

 

Another question is has any one tried issuing a Statutory demand for the money in connection with claims for recovering these bank charges which I believe could be another avenue. Has anyone tried this route.

 

Finally, when one tries to recover the bank charges do you recover the whole amount or in accordance with OFT - I believe they say £12 is an acceptable amount

 

I look forward to receiving any feed back as I am just at the beginning

of recovering what is mine!!!!

Regards

Denise

[TUTTSI]

Abbey Another Quirk Discovered!

Hi Guys

Have just joined this forum and I wanted to share with you all another one of Abbey's quirks. As well as asking for your help!!

 

A few weeks ago I made a bill paypayment to leave my account on the same day I knew I had a cheque clearing, also 2 bacs payments were also due in on that day as cleared funds. 2 days later I receive a letter from their operations department to say that I had insufficient funds to make the bill payment. Although on this occassion they did not charge me. This was I thought to be impossible since I had enough cleared funds on that day.

 

I raised this issue with their call centre in India - what a nightmare! eventually after a frustrating 30 minutes of time wasting someone who understood me took up my complaint and eventually called me back and explained to me that the money clearing in the account did not clear until 9am that morning but bill payments were scheduled to go out at 1 minute past mid night, therefore they said that I did not have funds at a minute past midnight. But surely in my eyes a day is 24 hours so cheques clearing and BACS payments should also clear at a minute past midnight.

 

This posses another problem, has this happened before and have we been charged for these quirks in their system. I know myself that Abbey have charged me on many occassions ££££ssss of bank charges and apart from them overcharging have they been grabbing extra charges due to this particular quirk. I have been given £10 so far for this - but watch this space as I fully intend to recover all that is owed to me.

 

My only concern on the bigger issue, is that from reading some of your postings Abbey have closed account! can they do this! Has anybody checked the terms and conditions for them closing accounts! is it legal!

 

Finally, when one tries to recover the bank charges do you recover the whole amount plus interest or in accordance with OFT - I believe they say £12 is an acceptable amount the difference on each transaction.

 

I look forward to receiving any feed back as I am just at the beginning

of recovering what is rightfully mine!!!!

Regards

DS

[TUTTSI]

Abbey Another Quirk Discovered!

Hi Guys

Have just joined this forum and I wanted to share with you all another one of Abbey's quirks as well as getting your help!

 

I made a bill paypayment to leave my account on the same day as I knew I had a cheque clearing on that day and also 2 bacs payments were also due in on that day as cleared credits in my account. Two days later I receive a letter from their operations department to say that I had insufficient funds to make the bill payment. Although on this occassion they did not charge me. This was I thought was impossible since I had enough cleared funds on that day.

 

I raised this issue with their call centre in India - what a nightmare! eventually after a frustrating 30 minutes of time wasting someone who understood me took up my complaint and eventually called me back and explained to me that the money clearing in the account did not clear until 9am that morning but bill payments were scheduled to go out at 1 minute past mid night, therefore they said that I did not have funds at a minute past midnight. But surely in my eyes a day is 24 hours so cheques clearing and BACS payments should all clear at a minute past midnight.

 

This posses another problem, that, has this happened before and have we been charged for these quirks in their system. I know myself that Abbey have charged me on many occassions ££££ssss of bank charges and apart from them overcharging have they been grabbing extra charges due to this particular quirk. I have been given £10 so far for this - but watch this space as I fully intend to recover all that is owed to me.

 

My only concern on the bigger issue, is that from reading some of your postings Abbey have closed accounts! can they do this! Has anybody checked the terms and conditions for them closing accounts! is it legal!

 

Finally, when one tries to recover the bank charges do you recover the whole amount or the amounts over and above that the OFT have said what is acceptable I beleve that they say £12 is an acceptable amount

 

I look forward to receiving any feed back as I am just at the beginning

of recovering what is rightfully mine!!!!

Regards

Denise

[TUTTSI]

You go get them!

Thankx for your help, I will take it all on board and I will get them!

[TUTTSI]

Claim the whole amount. The £12 is a red herring. OFT considered any fee over this would be unreasonable but DIDN'T say £12 was reasonable!

Please ensure you read ALL the FAQ section.

The debit credit timing is another of the banks little tricks they play with your money. Total sham really given that its all done electronically.

 

Thanx for your help, I will take what you have said on board and I will go and get my money BACK!

[TUTTSI]

I everyone Abbey have just written to me on this quirk of theirs and have agreed a further £25 in full and final settlement, they have already paid me £10 because I did have funds in my account and they did not honour the bill payment.

They say that you must have cleared funds in your account not just anticipated cleared funds. In my case I not only had an actual cheque clearing on that very day but also to BACS payments which were cleared funds. The moral was that they did the bill payment at 1 minute past midnight and the funds were not credited in my account until 9am that morning and by this time they had rejected my payment out which was important to me to be paid on time. This of course is nothing to what is coming their way my claim will be Bank Charges and interest will be far in excess of £5K so watch this space as soon as I have opened another bank account.

So everyone, keep up the pressure and get back what is rightfully yours.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Just checked with my bank and they have refunded £30, £5 more than they said and bearing in mind they had already paid me £10 I am now £40 better off.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Thanx Chilli

[TUTTSI]

Hi All

It is now time to claim back my charges and interest from this shower. My actual charges over a six period comes to £4869.50, I calculated contractual interest at the vaying rates in accordance with what they have charged me and over a six year period is £1883.75 based on simple interest calculations. I would love to compound these figures as I am sure they would come to at least 5 x as much but after much deliberation I no not how!

My only dilema is, do I make this claim in one go and if so would it be in small claims using the MCOL, and if it is fast tracked what does this mean!ie do I have to fill a N! form or do I split it and claim first part and win before claiming the second part of the claim.

I am ready to send my pre-lim letter to Abbey and before I do I would appreciate some clarification on this point as I do not want to make a complete mess of it.

Thanks

DS

[TUTTSI]

Thanks for your help, could you email me Vamps number 2 spreadsheet, to see if I can get my head road it.

Many thanks

DS

[TUTTSI]

Has anyone any advice on my thread 1 please.....

[TUTTSI]

Hi All

I wrote a final letter before action last week giving them a further 7 days only, that is up tomorrow, they have now had almost 5 weeks.

 

A letter received today, states that they are still looking into my complaint and they thanked me for my continued patience ( patience I have not).

 

So, my question is do I issue a N1 claim as I think one cannot do it on a MCOL as the claim is over £5K and should just I go ahead and issue the claim as that is going to take at least a further 3 months for them to get to court stage etc. Then they will have plenty of time then to sort out my repayment!!.

 

Any suggestions please.

Thanks

 

DS

[TUTTSI]

the letter you recieved is standard drag it out stuff (you may even find in another 2 weeks you get another letter with a GOGW in it but dont hold your breath and be sitting when u recieve it (through fear of falling over laughing) see my thread for further info .

 

follow your own timelines if you said you will file if no settlement then proceed as such remember this is your claim not theirs

also after you file when they offer figures to settle do not ofrget to mention you have filed at court and as such now are seeking reimbursement for this as well

 

I downloaded the N1 and filed at my local court so i knew everything had been sent that was required

the problem i think i have sen with using mcol is that you have to forward copies of your schedule of charges and space on the form is limited

 

Thanks for that, it was always my intention to go to court and not wait as I have done with the other claims, but was not sure if I could do a MCOL for over £5K.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Well what a carry on, Abbey have today made me a GOGW £383.00 againts nearly £7K, they are having a laugh. Well not for long County Court Claim here I come and a very polite letter back to Abbey saying thankyou but no thankyou. ( I will accept it on a partial settlement)

Anyway what does this figure represent and why would they want to pay me anything if their charges were lawfull, it is a total mystery to me.

DS

[TUTTSI]

I am sure your right Advoc8, but it is just such a weird amount.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Perhaps they have a dodgy calculator, the same one that that works out the ridiculous charges that they have imposed on us. I am sure they missed off a 0 perhaps it should have been £3K and not £300....

[TUTTSI]

Well there a surprise, I checked my bank account account today and found loads of £30 etc refunds that actually total £385 and not £383 as per their letter. I told you it is a dodgy calculator!!

So I guess I am doing the rejection letter, but accepting this on account. Now the refunds on my statement do not state they are GOGW, just merely misc fee refunds. I will deduct these now from my spreadsheet and advise them that I still want paying in full, I will give them a further 7 days to respond before filing a Court Claim. Still not sure whether a N! or a MCOL. So I have a week to research this.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Letter of rejection now done and ready for posting on Monday allowing them 14 days to pay up. I did the rejection letter 4 from the Template liabrary and modified it slightly.

 

Abbey National PLC

Banking Specialist Team

PO Box 5885

Milton Keynes

MK10 1FA 17th March 2007

Ref: xxxxxx

BY CERTIFICATE OF POSTING

Response to settlement offer.

 

Dear xxxxxxx

Re: Account number xxxxxxxxxxx

Thank you for your letter dated 13th March 2007.

 

I respectfully decline your offer of settlement and request, one final time, that you return to me all charges & interest imposed on this account, totalling £6415.28, as per the attached revised schedule, which reflects the goodwill refund of £385 now credited to the above account as referred to in your latest letter. Please note that interest continues to accrue on my claim until settled in full.

 

In order to avoid Litigation against you, I am prepared to accept the sum offered as partial settlement on the clear understanding that the remainder is paid within the next 14 days. Failure to comply with this request will result in legal action against you for full recovery, as detailed in my Letter Before Action.

 

I await hearing from you.

 

Yours sincerely

[TUTTSI]

Hi K,

We sure are at the same point and sueing seems to be the only way they will listen. Still a mystery how they decide on the GOGW. Good Luck with your claim , let me know how you get on.

DS

[TUTTSI]

I received another letter from Abbey today, they seem to be unaware that someone else had already written to me with GOGW, they are saying that they know how important is that they resolve my complaint quickly.... hold on... then they say they will come to me within 4 weeks.

So perhaps I will get another GOGW.....

DS

[TUTTSI]

I have heard nothing further from Abbey, so it is my intention over the next couple of days to start to fill out the N1 form, shame I cannot do a MCOL because then it is there for Tueday. I am not sure if you can do a MCOL for over £6K, not sure of the proceedure. No

really sure what extra I would put on a N1 form that I would not have put on the MCOL. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Hi Advoc - I have already made several claims but they were all under £3K so far, this is my big one so I want it to be right, The only thing is what more info do I need to put on a N1 claim form which is not covered on the MCOL, as this seemed to cover it all or am I missing the point somewhere!!

Thanks, any help will be gratefully appreciated.

DS

[TUTTSI]

Thanks Advok8

I thought that might be the case, so I will attempt the MCOL this afternoon. They have had enough time to review the situation.

Regards

DS

[TUTTSI]

Hi All

I have given this some more thought and reckon that I should let Abbey know what they should expect when we go to court so here is the letter which I intend to send tomorrow.

 

Mr Richard Harris

Head of Complaints

Abbey National PLC

PO Box 5129

Milton Keynes

MK9 2YN 6th April 2007

Ref: xxxxxxxxx

BY SPECIAL DELIVERY OPEN LETTER

Dear Mr Harris

Re: Account number xxxxxxxxxx

Thank you for your letter dated 15th March 2007.

 

I note the contents of your letter and in case you have been misguided on this issue, my correspondence is based on a Claim against the Bank not a Complaint.

1. I wrote on 12th February 2007 outlining my Claim in relation to bank charges on the above numbered account.

2. I wrote on 11th March a Final Letter before Action.

3. Your colleague Mrs Jan Teal from Banking Specialist Team

replied on 13th March with a gesture of goodwill refund of £385.

4. On 17th March I replied inter alia stating that: I am prepared to accept the sum offered as partial settlement on the clear understanding that the remainder is paid within the next 14 days. Failure to comply with this request will result in Legal action against you for full recovery, as detailed in my letter before action.

I am disappointed to have to advise you that I have not received a

reply to my letter of 17th March and I would advise you firstly that

the debt outlined in previous correspondence continues to accrue

with interest. The amount claimed as of today stands at £6442.94

with interest still accruing, and an updated schedule is enclosed for

your attention.

I enclose copies of my letters of 12th February, 11th and 17th March

2007 and also enclose a copy of your colleagues letter dated 13th

March 2007, for your attention.

No doubt you will realise that extensively in recent months there

has been much press comment in the media regarding banks and

penalty charges imposed on customers. You will no doubt also be

aware that the OFT have criticised banks too in the way in which

they are dealing with their customers and the hefty charges that

have been made. Many customers including myself have already

taken the banks to task and have issued claims against them and

have been successful in subsequent settlements prior to the Court

hearing date. Some Courts have issued directions stating that

proceedings ought to be settled by sensible negotiation or

mediation and that the Courts will take into account the failure to

follow such a course when dealing with the question of costs.

I would also state that the Courts now order upon its own initiative

the Defendant i.e the Bank, in these type of proceedings to state:-

1. Whether such charge is accepted to be a penalty and if not why not.

2. If such charge is alleged to be a pre-estimate of the Defendant’s

Loss incurred by the Claimant’s actions (whether or not such action is treated as a breach of contract between the parties) all facts and matters intended to be relied upon as showing that such was a proper estimate of such loss and all evidence to be adduced at trial as to what the true cost of dealing with the matter was.

3. If such charge is not alleged to be a pre-estimate of the Defendant’s loss incurred by the Claimant’s actions the facts and matters relied upon showing the basis upon which the charge was calculated and all evidence to be adduced at trial to show that the charge was fair and reasonable.

This letter is purely being sent to you in advance of any possible

impending Court proceedings in an attempt, as the Courts

have suggested, to settle this matter by sensible negotiation.

Therefore, before I take any further action for recovery, I am writing

to offer the Bank an opportunity to settle my claim in full without

recourse to those proceedings. If proceedings were to materialise

and proceed to a Court hearing then inevitably the Defendant would

be compelled to supply the information at points 1, 2 and 3 above,

to the Courts satisfaction, otherwise the Bank will not be successful

in defending this action, and I would ask the Courts to order

judgement with costs.

I would very much hope that you can deal with this matter to my

satisfaction as it would also save unnecessary Court fees and costs

which the Bank as Defendant would inevitably have to meet in the

event of proceedings being taken and which costs would not be

seen to be of benefit to the Bank’s Shareholders, should the bank

lose. Also, importantly as well, the Courts time in such an action

could be saved.

In view of my above comments, and if you are not able to also

respond to me satisfactorily to points 1, 2 and 3 above, I request

that you now expedite my claim as quickly as possible. I will allow a

further period of 14 days from 10th April for this matter to be settled

otherwise and without further recourse to the Bank, I shall

commence recovery proceedings.

I await hearing from you.

Yours sincerely

[TUTTSI]

Hi Advoc,

No I am happy to hear comments from any Cager who has an opinion on the above letter. It was not designed not to go to court but hopefully to speed things up. The Court system, where we live is almost at a standstill, my O/H has been waiting for his court date on his Barclay matter since early Feb, whenever he phones the court they say it is still with the Judge. They say they have a tremendous backlog and it is because the Banks are clogging up the system. I thought perhaps they should re-think their therory, because my claim is for £6k+ it may go to the next track up and I could get severe costs. If I show the courts that they did not give the info that would be needed at the next stage, who knows the judge may sling out their defence from the word go, as I would use this letter in court. It is only my opinion and others like you may disagree, but from the courts point of veiw I have asked the same questions that the courts would ask and we all know that they will not answer those golden questions. These questions are the questions which my court are asking the defendants to do well before any court date. If they do not comply, their defence stands struck out and Judgement given.

Thanks

DS