help needed please, insurance not paying out for full repair of car

[Dereham]

Hello we are new to this forum.

 

we are very boring people and have never made an insurance claim in 30 years of driving.

 

On the 4th April a council van reversed back into our 9 year old VW that is still regularly serviced by VW dealers.

 

We have looked after her from 2 years old and it is in extremely good condition.

 

The Council Van Driver admitted liability straight away and gave me his insurance details which were the Zurich.

I notified my insurance company LV.

 

The shunt had caused only minor front bodywork damage of a creased bumper and wobbly headlamp

but I immediately noticed a whining noise (very noticeable on gear-changing) from the front

and also the strong smell of exhaust fumes when starting the car.

There was also fluid dripping from the near-side wheel arch.

 

The local VW garage told me to ‘phone the VW body shop and they would take care of everything.

 

The VW body shop filled out the request forms to the accident management company so we could be supplied with hire vehicle a few days later.

The car was ready after a week but the mechanical issues were not addressed because they felt they were not caused by the accident.

The hire vehicle went back because as far as the accident management company was concerned the claim was complete.

 

We ended up driving the vehicle home with exhaust fumes bellowing out of the front wheel arch and the whining noise,

– we really should not have driven it home as we felt the car was not safe.

We made sure we put an addendum on the docket saying that we had collected the car not repaired.

 

The VW Dealer said they could only get authorisation to mend the bumper at a cost of £700.

They said the Assessor had not been shown the car or done a ‘manual assessment’ and only pictures had been emailed to them.

We continued with our complaint and

 

a few days later VW collected the vehicle on a recovery truck.

They said they had replaced a couple of pipes at the front of the vehicle and replaced the bonnet catch again as it had not been fitted correctly.

 

After looking at the vehicle again they said that the exhaust had split and so have contacted the assessment company again to see what they could do.

 

A man from the company came out to look at it this time as we had threatened to take this out into the media.

 

Many emails had been sent by this time including a complaint letter to the franchise VW Company.

The Assessor is still refusing to budge on his decision and this is still going on.

He is putting the mechanical issues down to ‘wear and tear’.

Our car is sitting in the VW Dealer’s car park.

The VW Dealer has said they cannot do anything more now.

The accident management company say that the Assessor is one of the independent companies they use.

 

We are still waiting for a reply from the accident management company on how to proceed.

Everyone is passing the buck and nobody is taking any responsibility.

 

As it is our first insurance claim we are unsure what to do next.

The system seems quite complex.

 

we don't know who is lining who's pocket or if money is trying to be saved somewhere.

The fact is that our car is sick and in our opinion is unsafe to drive.

Even VW refused to comment if our car was safe.

 

The CEO of the assessment company has said as far as he is concerned it is restored to pre-incident condition.

The fact is that it is not: our car was in perfect working order and now we have no transport.

Any ideas how we can proceed?

 

 

[unclebulgaria67]

You should never have gone through an accident management company. Most are awful and rely on providing expensive hire cars, which often an at fault third party Insurers refuse to pay the full cost. The VW garage have stitched you up here, as they no doubt have earned a commission by passing you to this accident management company. The VW garage are obviously not willing to assist, for fear of upsetting the company they earned a commission from.

 

What you should have done is to have gone directly through the third parties Insurers Zurich. You could have got the car assessed and had the car repaired so it was back in proper working order. Or you could have got LV to handle the claim and they would have claimed back from Zurich.

 

The way to resolve this now is to get another independent engineers inspection and for any additional repairs done. You will need to find out whether Zurich would be happy for this, as the accident management company will have told Zurich that the damage was limited to abc, when actually there is other damage. You presumably have evidence of regular servicing, so if the car is not running properly now after the accident, there could be other damage which has not been picked up. AA and RAC I believe offer engineers inspections.

[Dereham]

Thank you unclebulgaria67, VW have looked after us for years, and actually we have never had a problem with the car or the service but since this accident problem VW don't seem to want to know us. At the start they said we didn't have to do anything - they were supurb in filling out the forms and sending them away. They said they would look after the claim from start to finish but now it has gone pear shaped they don't seem to want to comment on anything. In fact they are brushing us off. Quite gutting really being very long term customers. Its not the cars fault but its putting us off a VW in the future. The receptionist at VW said that it was a new instruction that all there accident jobs should be directed through this particular accident management company now they had been taken over by the new franchise. Something has to be done as our car has been there for the best part of 3 weeks. Its like the whole system is in gridlock. We did get the feeling that the VW and the accident management company were in cahoots, we also feel that it was strange that the assessor is looking at photos behind a computer elsewhere. Apparently he never came out to see the car in the first place. How the hell can you make any kind of assessment behind a screen. Maybee the assessors are in with the accident management company as well ? It looks like we have been taken hook line and sinker into possibly a corrupt system or am I getting carried away.

I will give the Zurich a call and let you know how we get on with this mess - any more suggestions are welcome - thank you all for taking the time to read.

[BanditQueen]

You are actually partly at fault here. You should never have accepted that the car was repaired and should not have driven it home. You will now have a difficult case proving that the car did not have other faults. The car should have been properly assessed visually by a qualified assessor from your insurance company. You should have also used one of their approved repairers and submitted three estimates. You should also have read your insurance documents to see what you are covered for carefully. The other driver may have admitted fault but that is nothing. It is between your insurance and theirs to determine fault. In the case that it is clear cut: as it was here that they reversed into your car; then your insurance should have recovered everything from his company and paid out to you in full. You should have also claimed for out of pocket expenses and the hire car; and you did not have to use the company hire car. You are entitled to have the gararge povide a hire car or provide one yourself or through the insurance company. If the gararge has done work not to do with the accident did you know and authorise this in advance? You should not have authorised extra work without being certain it was needed or that it was seperate from the accident. You should only have authorised what you knew was from the accident and you should have had an independent assessment made from the insurance company visually to make sure that nothing was done without it being authorised. You should also not have driven an unsafe car and actually you committed a criminal offense if you knowingly drove an unsafe car on the road as you could have killed someone or yourself. You are very lucky to have got away with this. You should have left the car where it was until everything had been fixed and the repairs all sorted and guaranteed. If there was some other problem with the car that was not the result of the accident, then I am sorry to say your insurance company are quite right not to pay for it. If, however, you feel that you have been poorly treated and have been through the company's complaints procedure as far as you can go; you have one more avenue left to you. You can complain to the Financial Insurance Ombudsman. They are independent and they will look again at the claim and the loss. They will look at the other parts of the claim and if either the gararge or the company acted incorrectly or inapproprately. They will also look at the situation with the extra repairs and if you have a case here as well. They will not take any direct action against the garage but they can advise you what to do about this. They will decide if the insurance company are wrong and should pay for everything. They may order a fresh assessment but you will need to tell them the truth: that is you drove the car home before all the work had been completed and about the engine problems on the way home and the smoke. The gararge may be responsible for this and may have to put it right or another one put it right and the first one pay for it. You have to tell them everything and please do not tell them you are the victims of a corrupt and evil system: they will not take your case seriously if you do. I know you are angry here; but you are also very fortunate: the car is a piece of metal and no one was hurt in the accident; so do not get carried away over this. You must remain calm and outline in order everything that has happened and then they will take it from there. If they need any other information or documents they will ask for them. Follow their procedure and be patient. It can take several weeks for them to investigate and for them to work things out with the company and the insurance and the third parties involved before making a decision. You may have further redress against the gararge. Are they to blame for the other damage? Your car was not in a dangerous state blowing smoke before the accident or when you took it to them so what has happened while it was in their hands? Ask the AA to do a full inspection of the engine and of the work that the gararge carried out. They know what to look for and can ask questions you may not know about. You are not a car expert or an insurance expert so this is bound to be a shock for you. But be realistic: you are not the victim of a corrupt system; just one that has not done its work correctly or been fair in dealing with you. It happens all the time and yes it needs to be made simpler and easier and reformed but until we do this in Parliament insurance companies and claim assessors will continue to get it wrong and mess our lives up. But I repeat: none of you have been hurt; you have suffered financial loss and inconvenience and nothing more; it can be fixed but it takes time. You may not get all of your money back or your car; you may have to write it off and get a new one with the financial settlement: that is something that you may be asked about if the car is beyond reasonable repair. If the car was in good shape and maintained as you say then you have a better and more substantial case against the gararge. Find out who is the owner: complain; then who is the parent company and ECO complain; if not then find out the party who governs gararges who do not do a good job and you can complain to them in the same way you have the insurance ombudsman. This has been a trying time I am sure but take your time over the letters to the insurance guru and to the gararge and get a third party to help write the letters if you do not have time or are unsure. Get some intervention from an MP or advice like the CAB or other party to help you to write the letter or contact them on the phone. They are there to help. Do not claim conspiracy theories: believe me keep it simple and straight forward and honest. It may take time, but in the end it may be worth it. If you get nowhere: then Don't Get Done Get Dom. Write to the programme. You never know Dom Littlewood may be able to sort them out on the BBC.

 

Good luck.

[unclebulgaria67]

Thank you unclebulgaria67, VW have looked after us for years, and actually we have never had a problem with the car or the service but since this accident problem VW don't seem to want to know us. At the start they said we didn't have to do anything - they were supurb in filling out the forms and sending them away. They said they would look after the claim from start to finish but now it has gone pear shaped they don't seem to want to comment on anything. In fact they are brushing us off. Quite gutting really being very long term customers. Its not the cars fault but its putting us off a VW in the future. The receptionist at VW said that it was a new instruction that all there accident jobs should be directed through this particular accident management company now they had been taken over by the new franchise. Something has to be done as our car has been there for the best part of 3 weeks. Its like the whole system is in gridlock. We did get the feeling that the VW and the accident management company were in cahoots, we also feel that it was strange that the assessor is looking at photos behind a computer elsewhere. Apparently he never came out to see the car in the first place. How the hell can you make any kind of assessment behind a screen. Maybee the assessors are in with the accident management company as well ? It looks like we have been taken hook line and sinker into possibly a corrupt system or am I getting carried away.

I will give the Zurich a call and let you know how we get on with this mess - any more suggestions are welcome - thank you all for taking the time to read.

 

Can I say this to you gently. Please do not think that any large business is really out there to help you. They are there to maximise the profit they can make from customers, in any way that they can.

 

It is not the staff working on the frontline, who just do what their bosses tell them. It is the directors of these businesses who do deals with other companies, to share the profits they can make, while they minimise the costs. I suspect that there was no independent inspection as such. It was conversations between the VW garage and someone sat in the Accident Management companies office. A mistake appears to have been made, that damage was not picked up, so was not included in the estimate for repair.

 

It could be that the additional repair costs would now have meant that the car was a write off. Insurers quite often write off a car if the repair costs come to about 60% of the cars market value. This may be the complication, that Zurich won't pay anything additional, because the total amount would be beyond what they would pay as a repair. This may be why the VW garage and this accident management company don't want to help any further.

 

Speak to Zurich and see what they say. They may not be helpful. You could speak to your own Insurers LV about the situation as you did notify them of the accident. But as you have gone down the accident management route where you will claim against Zurich, LV may not want to get involved now.

 

Getting an independent engineers report done is the next step for you and once you have the report, you can take it forward with the accident management company and Zurich.

[SuperVillain]

Lots of insurance companies do desktop inspections to authorise repairs. They rely on the details sent to them by the body shop, who have seen and inspected the vehicle. To do so again would be a duplication of work. It seems to me the body shop didn't inspect the underbelly of the car in the first place.

 

So the question is did they know about the leaks/exhaust when they did their inspection. When the body shop notified the accident management company did you point out everything that was wrong with the car? Do you know if it was recorded in their instructions?

 

£700 isn't a vast amount in terms of repairs. You said VW did some additional repairs after the vehicle was returned but I guess this didn't solve the problem. Have they told you how much the exhaust repairs will cost? Parts alone would probably be another £2-300 with labour on top.

 

At the end of the day the comments above are correct. The Accident Management company are relying on a recovery from the other side and they will be the ones paying out VW for any repairs in the meantime. They aren't going to authorise repairs they might not get paid back because it's doubtful whether they are accident related. .

 

Playing devils advocate I'd say this. The collision damaged the bumper also damaged some pipes at the front of the vehicle. This could explain the exhaust smell in the car and the leak. These pipes and the bumper have been replaced. Have you driven the car since these were replaced to know if the leak and smell have stopped? The exhaust was subject to wear and tear damage pre-incident. When was the last service before the collision? The discovery of the exhaust split is why the garage won't release the vehicle.

 

It's a causation issue the other side might raise. Can a van reversing (presumably at low speed) into your front bumper also crack your exhaust? The assessor seems to think not... and if I was on the other side I'd certainly question it. Furthermore I think VW will be unlikely to offer an opinion on whether the damage is accident related, for fear of damaging relations with their AM Company.

 

With regards to the assessor I think he will continue to not budge on the decision. Their reports are to a standard that can be offered as expert evidence in Court and are signed with a statement of truth.

 

I'd agree with UB's suggestion of trying the third party insurers then your own if that fails. Your own insurers should deal with the repairs regardless but it is likely you will have to pay the excess unless their inspection shows the damage to be accident related.

[Dereham]

Thank you for your constructive comments.

Today I phoned the Council who reversed into my car and gave me the Zurich claim number and contact details. I called the Zurich but the lady told me that I should go back to the accident management company and take it up with them. They said it all pivots on my initial decision and that was to go through the VW garage – which then in turn pushed me through to the accident management company.

I then phoned the VW garage and spoke to the floor manager. They said they had replaced 2 vacuum pipes not under authorisation from the insurance free of charge as a ‘gesture of good will’?? The other faults are still there and they were not present before the shunt. I presume the pipes were directly related to the accident. He said no one had been out to look at the vehicle and do a physical assessment from the independent company used by the accident management company. The assessment was carried out by images. He was very matter of fact and did not want to comment on anything. I get the feeling that VW assess the vehicle and then just pass on images and then it’s Ok’d through the independent assessment company but I am not sure.

I asked the VW floor manager if he would mind the AA to come into the garage to do an inspection. He said no. I also asked him if we would be charged for storage of our vehicle as this situation was going nowhere fast. He said we can collect it tomorrow if we wanted to. I said I would get back to him.

I cannot seem to get any worthwhile response out of the accident management company as they say they are beheld to the assessment company and cannot make any bearing on there decision. I think we are caught in a trap here.

Please can you advise: Do we leave the vehicle at VW unrepaired or do we get it collected on a recovery truck at our own expense and bought home – then get an AA inspection and take it from there back to the accident management company? I think they are hoping that we will just go away and never come back; I tell you what, we feel like doing that at the moment!

[Hammy1962]

You are actually partly at fault here. You should never have accepted that the car was repaired and should not have driven it home. You will now have a difficult case proving that the car did not have other faults. The car should have been properly assessed visually by a qualified assessor from your insurance company. You should have also used one of their approved repairers and submitted three estimates. You should also have read your insurance documents to see what you are covered for carefully. The other driver may have admitted fault but that is nothing. It is between your insurance and theirs to determine fault. In the case that it is clear cut: as it was here that they reversed into your car; then your insurance should have recovered everything from his company and paid out to you in full. You should have also claimed for out of pocket expenses and the hire car; and you did not have to use the company hire car. You are entitled to have the gararge povide a hire car or provide one yourself or through the insurance company. If the gararge has done work not to do with the accident did you know and authorise this in advance? You should not have authorised extra work without being certain it was needed or that it was seperate from the accident. You should only have authorised what you knew was from the accident and you should have had an independent assessment made from the insurance company visually to make sure that nothing was done without it being authorised. You should also not have driven an unsafe car and actually you committed a criminal offense if you knowingly drove an unsafe car on the road as you could have killed someone or yourself. You are very lucky to have got away with this. You should have left the car where it was until everything had been fixed and the repairs all sorted and guaranteed. If there was some other problem with the car that was not the result of the accident, then I am sorry to say your insurance company are quite right not to pay for it. If, however, you feel that you have been poorly treated and have been through the company's complaints procedure as far as you can go; you have one more avenue left to you. You can complain to the Financial Insurance Ombudsman. They are independent and they will look again at the claim and the loss. They will look at the other parts of the claim and if either the gararge or the company acted incorrectly or inapproprately. They will also look at the situation with the extra repairs and if you have a case here as well. They will not take any direct action against the garage but they can advise you what to do about this. They will decide if the insurance company are wrong and should pay for everything. They may order a fresh assessment but you will need to tell them the truth: that is you drove the car home before all the work had been completed and about the engine problems on the way home and the smoke. The gararge may be responsible for this and may have to put it right or another one put it right and the first one pay for it. You have to tell them everything and please do not tell them you are the victims of a corrupt and evil system: they will not take your case seriously if you do. I know you are angry here; but you are also very fortunate: the car is a piece of metal and no one was hurt in the accident; so do not get carried away over this. You must remain calm and outline in order everything that has happened and then they will take it from there. If they need any other information or documents they will ask for them. Follow their procedure and be patient. It can take several weeks for them to investigate and for them to work things out with the company and the insurance and the third parties involved before making a decision. You may have further redress against the gararge. Are they to blame for the other damage? Your car was not in a dangerous state blowing smoke before the accident or when you took it to them so what has happened while it was in their hands? Ask the AA to do a full inspection of the engine and of the work that the gararge carried out. They know what to look for and can ask questions you may not know about. You are not a car expert or an insurance expert so this is bound to be a shock for you. But be realistic: you are not the victim of a corrupt system; just one that has not done its work correctly or been fair in dealing with you. It happens all the time and yes it needs to be made simpler and easier and reformed but until we do this in Parliament insurance companies and claim assessors will continue to get it wrong and mess our lives up. But I repeat: none of you have been hurt; you have suffered financial loss and inconvenience and nothing more; it can be fixed but it takes time. You may not get all of your money back or your car; you may have to write it off and get a new one with the financial settlement: that is something that you may be asked about if the car is beyond reasonable repair. If the car was in good shape and maintained as you say then you have a better and more substantial case against the gararge. Find out who is the owner: complain; then who is the parent company and ECO complain; if not then find out the party who governs gararges who do not do a good job and you can complain to them in the same way you have the insurance ombudsman. This has been a trying time I am sure but take your time over the letters to the insurance guru and to the gararge and get a third party to help write the letters if you do not have time or are unsure. Get some intervention from an MP or advice like the CAB or other party to help you to write the letter or contact them on the phone. They are there to help. Do not claim conspiracy theories: believe me keep it simple and straight forward and honest. It may take time, but in the end it may be worth it. If you get nowhere: then Don't Get Done Get Dom. Write to the programme. You never know Dom Littlewood may be able to sort them out on the BBC.

 

Good luck.

 

OMG - Wall of Text.

 

H

[unclebulgaria67]

Depends on how quickly AA will inspect the car, as to what you do. If VW are not charging for storage, then I would get AA to go to the garage, as getting the car back to your home will be expensive, plus then once the car is out of the VW garages sight, they will probably ignore you forever.

 

I would suggest making a formal complaint to VW UK's head office about the way you have been treated by this VW garage. You have been a loyal customer of this garage for years, but when you needed their help, they have treated you badly. Why was there no proper inspection of the damage to the car ? If you were unhappy that damage was not repaired, why has this VW garage not looked to help you more ?

[Dereham]

The floor manager of the VW body shop has told us he is not willing to let the AA into his shop for an inspection. The answer to your other question is that we made a formal written complaint to the CEO head of company 2 weeks ago but we had no reply even though we asked for an acknowledgement. We then e.mailed the head office with more complaints. We demanded an answer to if they had received and read our e.mails of complaint and letter of complaint to the CEO and if they didn't reply it would be taken into the media. They then replied shortly afterwards saying they had read the e.mails and then gave us the name of the Franchise director who the complaint had been passed on to. We are wasting our time with them I think.

If we do take the car away off the VW premises for an independent inspection have we got a chance of ever getting our car fixed through the insurance process?.

[unclebulgaria67]

The floor manager of the VW body shop has told us he is not willing to let the AA into his shop for an inspection. The answer to your other question is that we made a formal written complaint to the CEO head of company 2 weeks ago but we had no reply even though we asked for an acknowledgement. We then e.mailed the head office with more complaints. We demanded an answer to if they had received and read our e.mails of complaint and letter of complaint to the CEO and if they didn't reply it would be taken into the media. They then replied shortly afterwards saying they had read the e.mails and then gave us the name of the Franchise director who the complaint had been passed on to. We are wasting our time with them I think.

If we do take the car away off the VW premises for an independent inspection have we got a chance of ever getting our car fixed through the insurance process?.

 

This VW garage obviously believe that you are trying it on and there is nothing wrong with the car that is connected to this accident. If you have to get the car back for the AA inspection, then that is what you will have to do.

 

I would suggest that you are probably best to never deal with this garage again, but make sure VW UK head office is aware of your treatment by this dealer.

 

Head office address:

Volkswagen Customer Quality Yeomans Drive Blakelands Milton Keynes MK14 5AN

 

Volkswagen Customer Care Frontline – 0800 083 3914 (Open Mon-Fri 8.30-18.00)

[dacouc]

This VW garage obviously believe that you are trying it on and there is nothing wrong with the car that is connected to this accident. If you have to get the car back for the AA inspection, then that is what you will have to do.

 

I would suggest that you are probably best to never deal with this garage again, but make sure VW UK head office is aware of your treatment by this dealer.

 

Head office address:

Volkswagen Customer Quality Yeomans Drive Blakelands Milton Keynes MK14 5AN

 

Volkswagen Customer Care Frontline – 0800 083 3914 (Open Mon-Fri 8.30-18.00)

 

Also the OP will be interested to know as well as whatever profit the VW bodyshop made on the repairs, they would have also received about £250 commission from the hire company for passing you onto them

[BanditQueen]

The gararge seem as if they have something to hide. I can only suggest that you contact the franchise and the above people and that you go through the Insurance Ombudsman. They can advise with any further action and take up the case on your behalf. Have you also contacted your M.P? That is what they are there for to help with many situations especially if there is a legal question. You have every right to have the inspection of your car and there are officials that the gararge cannot refuse entry to. You need to get some proper advice and remember that going through a complaints procedure takes longer than 2 weeks frustrating as it may be. Log everything and keep a copy of everything. That will help with your case.

 

Good luck.

[SuperVillain]

The gararge seem as if they have something to hide.

 

It sounds like, as in my earlier post, the garage were advised of the exhaust smell and didn't inspect the underbelly of the car to investigate, at which point the split exhaust would have been apparent.

 

There's still a question as to whether it's accident related.

 

OP how much will the exhaust repair cost? Have you had a quote?