ATOS Medical/Filed Appeal/Tribunal Heard Without Me Knowing

[LyricalWarrior]

Hi,

 

I'm new to the forum, but have been reading a few posts on here and finally decided to see if anyone can help me with the issue I am facing right now.

 

I attended my second ATOS medical last year after winning my last appeal, knowing that I'd done everything I could, I knew (like the time before) that the person assessing my illness had it in for me from the start of the interview. She hardly spoke to me, never looked at me and didn't pay attention to the fact that I was shaking within the interview. Needless to say, I appealed the decision like I did the last time and knew that it was going to be a long wait. Oh, this was just before Christmas as well. So I had no money whatsoever over the Christmas period and had to wait roughly six or so weeks to receive something after they had processed my appeal.

 

Anyway onto my appeal, I waited and waited for a letter to arrive to tell me when my hearing was going to be, even phoning them a couple of times to ask if they had any idea of when I should hear something back. I was fobbed off continuously and told that it could take anything up to a year, I already knew this from before. So I waited for a letter to arrive, fast forward a couple of weeks or so since I phoned them to ask when my appeal was going to be and I receive three of the notorious brown envelopes in the post. I open them to find out that not only has my tribunal been heard without me knowing, they have stopped my benefits, which I rely on by being unwell.

 

I hadn't received any letters from them regarding my tribunal, so I had absolutely NO idea when the tribunal was taking place. I did receive some help filling in some papers after my money was stopped before Christmas, so the people who helped me received copies of the letters for the tribunal, but I hadn't seen any of these letters that they had filed when I saw them yesterday to discuss why my benefits had been cancelled. The first time I saw said letters were when the worker pulled them from their file. I was shocked.

 

Does anyone have any ideas on what I could do please? As you can understand, I am desperate right now, I have no money whatsoever and bills to pay through having hardly any funds for months. I've been in tears for most of the day.

[antone]

Are you saying that you have received information from HM Tribunals Service suggesting that a hearing has been held in your absence and has found against you? That would be very unusual. HMCTS is usually pretty fair about these sorts of things.

[Feebee_71]

It sounds as though the notifications and all letters regarding the OP's tribunal were sent to the people who assisted them with filling in the forms rather than to the OP the self.

 

Feebee_71

[Invalidation]

It sounds as though the notifications and all letters regarding the OP's tribunal were sent to the people who assisted them with filling in the forms rather than to the OP the self.

 

Feebee_71

 

Thats how I read it too.

 

 

Who were the 'Workers' who helped with your appeal and who received the documents, thats what you should be looking at.

 

I would speak to the DWP and try and explain what happened.

[LyricalWarrior]

Are you saying that you have received information from HM Tribunals Service suggesting that a hearing has been held in your absence and has found against you? That would be very unusual. HMCTS is usually pretty fair about these sorts of things.

 

That is exactly what I'm saying.

 

It sounds as though the notifications and all letters regarding the OP's tribunal were sent to the people who assisted them with filling in the forms rather than to the OP the self.

 

Feebee_71

 

That is exactly it, the people who helped me fill in the forms had all of the letters that I should have received, but didn't.

 

Thats how I read it too.

 

 

Who were the 'Workers' who helped with your appeal and who received the documents, thats what you should be looking at.

 

I would speak to the DWP and try and explain what happened.

 

I saw Worker's Rights who are usually pretty good with these kind of things, but when I explained to the woman what happened, she didn't look that bothered. It was a revelation to see all of the paper work that I had not received. In fact, it just made me angrier and even more upset about the situation.

[**Margaret**]

:LyricalWarrior:

 

Right, first things first! To get some money you need to make a brand new claim for employment n support allowance, like yesterday! You can reclaim from six months after the date of the disallowance notice, if your doctor's prepared to write Med 3 (unfit) notes.

 

The number for telephone claims is 08000 556688. Takes up to an hour for them to ask for all the info, which they turn into a statement and send back to the claimant with a request for checking and Med 3, proof of income/savings, etcetera.

 

Alternatively, specially if you prefer paper, you can complete an ESA1 claim form, available from a jobcentre or at;

 

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/esa1-print.pdf

 

Target time for processing a new claim is ten to fifteen days from when Jobcentreplus receive everything they've asked for.

 

For whatever reason you've received appalling service from your advice agency. Tentatively, cos although I know the theory I've never done it in practice, I'm going to suggest you may be able to get the adverse tribunal decision set aside. Retrieve the paperwork from the advice agency and have a look at exactly what you authorised them to do. Did you arrange that all the correspondence was sent to them? Who completed the hearing enquiry form?

 

There's an example of a hearing enquiry form at;

 

http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/tribunals/social-security-and-child-support/forms-and-how-to-appeal/TCEEnquiryFormAppellant_05_04_10.pdf

 

And potential reasons for a set aside are listed at part 3 of section five in;

 

http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/tribunals/social-security-and-child-support/forms-and-how-to-appeal/HTA_English_Final_rev.pdf

 

Should you decide to try for a set aside you need to write (within one month of the tribunal decision) to the Administrative Support Centre which covers your area. Their address'll be on the paperwork.

 

Another contributor to CAG has far more experience of set asides than me, and may be able to offer further advice.

 

In the meantime, get that new claim sent off.

 

Sincerely, Margaret.

Edited June 14, 2013 by **Margaret**

[estellyn]

Has a decision been made, or has the appeal stopped due to non receipt of the enquiry form?

 

On the enquiry form you would be asked whether you want an oral or paper hearing, so was this filled in and if so by whom. If there has been an error then as Margaret says you can ask for a set aside - but I'd need to know more about the exact circumstances.

[LyricalWarrior]

Right, first things first! To get some money you need to make a brand new claim for employment n support allowance, like yesterday! You can reclaim from six months after the date of the disallowance notice, if your doctor's prepared to write Med 3 (unfit) notes.

 

The number for telephone claims is 08000 556688. Takes up to an hour for them to ask for all the info, which they turn into a statement and send back to the claimant with a request for checking and Med 3, proof of income/savings, etcetera.

 

Target time for processing a new claim is ten to fifteen days from when Jobcentreplus receive everything they've asked for

 

I have had to file a new claim, as I don't have any money at the moment and being genuinely unwell, I do rely on the help they're supposed to give people who are entitled to it.

 

Did you arrange that all the correspondence was sent to them? Who completed the hearing enquiry form?

 

As far as I am aware of, I only signed for them to receive copies of the paperwork that I was supposed to be sent. I didn't receive any forms from the tribunal people, but when I visited Worker's Rights, they had copies of everything. Stuff that I'd never even seen before.

 

Should you decide to try for a set aside you need to write (within one month of the tribunal decision) to the Administrative Support Centre which covers your area. Their address'll be on the paperwork.

 

I don't have any paperwork from them, only a letter from the DWP telling me a tribunal has already gone ahead and decided against me.

 

The letter I received from the DWP was dated from the 7th of this month, but I only received it yesterday. The tribunal was heard on the 13th of last month. It's all just very baffling and is upsetting me more and more.

 

Has a decision been made, or has the appeal stopped due to non receipt of the enquiry form?

 

On the enquiry form you would be asked whether you want an oral or paper hearing, so was this filled in and if so by whom. If there has been an error then as Margaret says you can ask for a set aside - but I'd need to know more about the exact circumstances.

 

The decision has been made at tribunal and went in the DWP's favour. I haven't received any paperwork, despite constantly phoning them to ask when my tribunal was. They told me it wasn't yet, then I get a letter (my first in months) to tell me that my money has been stopped because the tribunal has already happened.

 

I haven't received any letters from the tribunal people, so I had no idea that a tribunal was even taking place yet.

 

I attended Worker's Rights to find out that they had copies of everything that I should have received. The person that dealt with me didn't seem to know what to do with me. The majority of the letters she has in that file I have never seen before, so I was very confused how all of this could have happened.

 

I am writing to the tribunal people, but as I said earlier the letter that said my money has been cancelled is dated as the 7th of this month, yet I received it yesterday. The letter at the Worker's Rights place said that my tribunal was on the 13th of last month. This all seems to have been mishandled somewhere without my knowledge. Yesterdays letters were the first I have received in months, despite me contacting them to ask them what's going on.

[estellyn]

OK. You first need to get copies of all of the papers in the Welfare rights file that you should have received. Is there a copy of the enquiry form from for the Tribunal service - the one that asks if you want a paper or Oral hearing? If there is, who the hell filled it in and get their head on a block (metaphophorically speaking - in other words put in a complaint about them signing the form on your behalf and not consulting you).

 

In the meantime you need to do three things:

 

1: Ask for a statement of Reasons for the Tribunal's decision, you're possibly a tad late, (so post it Monday if possible) depending on when they consider you notified - but explain that you haven't received notification and though your rep has received some paperwork, they have not been adequately representing you and that you are in the process of putting in a complaint. (if a rep receives notification of a Tribunal decision, contact should be made with the appellant in good time that a statement of reasons can be requested if desired, or a set aside requested if there are any irregularities)

 

2: Also put in a request for a set aside (in a separate letter and envelope), on the grounds of a breach of natural justice. Explain that you received no paperwork, were not given the choice of an oral or paper hearing, and a paper hearing was heard in your absence, when you would have chosen to attend an oral hearing and had further evidence to present. Also explain that you are curretly investigating your rep's role in all this, as they appear to have received copies of some paperwork, and had not informed you, and you are checking if an enquiry form was completed by the rep without consulting you.

 

3: If you haven't already done so, make a new claim.

 

It is important to remember that your rep could be completely innocent in all this. As a rep, the paperwork we receive is simply copies of what has (or should have been) sent out to the appellant. But errors do get made, and I did have a case that was heard in a paper hearing, where no enquiry form was sent out - the decision in that case was set aside. But I've also had enquiry forms sent with my copy of the appeal pack, rather than the appellant's - and if this happens a rep should always consult the appellant - and I always got them to sign the form, unless there were extenuating circumstances.

[**Margaret**]

:estellyn:

 

Thanx for sharing your experience of set aside. Guessed the important bit would be the enquiry form but I'd no idea how tribunal judges view (apparently) poor representation. In my postcode area, welfare rights advice for disability benefits became extinct when Government introduced something called employment n support allowance.

 

Thanx again, Margaret.

Edited June 17, 2013 by **Margaret**

[estellyn]

:estellyn:

 

Thanx for sharing your experience of set aside. Guessed the important bit would be the enquiry form but I'd no idea how tribunal judges view (apparently) poor representation. In my postcode area, welfare rights advice for disability benefits became extinct when Government introduced something called employment n support allowance.

 

Thanx again, Margaret.

 

Yes, in this case the enquiry form is the thing to look at - if there is an issue with it, for instance it wasn't sent out or was completed without the appellant's knowledge by the rep, then a set aside should be a simple thing to get. Though I have had circumstances where after a decision not in their favour, an appellant will swear blind they wanted an oral hearing, and forgot about filling in the form saying they wanted a paper hearing.

 

With the mandatory reconsideration being brought in, the enquiry form will be a thing of the past as it has been amalgamated into the new application for appeal that is made directly to The Tribunal service, following the mandatory reconsideration decision.

 

Just in case the OP is unsure, this is what the enquiry form looks like:

 

http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/forms/tribunals/sscs/TCEEnquiryFormAppellant.pdf

 

 

And yes, welfare rights help and representation has become harder to get in a lot of areas, and who knows what will happen come October when the last of the legal aid money is withdrawn. I don't know what other funding is out there, but if there isn't much then there'll be a lot of redundant welfare rights workers, and loads more people turning to the internet for help.

Edited June 17, 2013 by estellyn

[**Margaret**]

:LyricalWarrior:

 

Back to #8. 'I don't have any paperwork from them'

 

Which is why we've advised you to get copies of all the paperwork, that you'd not seen until last week, from the advice agency. Some of it'll be from the Tribunals Service, and there should be the original document you signed to authorise the agency to act for you.

 

Paperwork from the Tribunals Service will have the correct address for you to write to. Also, it'll show a tribunal reference number which, if quoted on forms and letters, acts as a unique identification number for your case.

 

I can understand how let down you feel with all this. Best to deal with it in small chunks. Start by looking at the hearing enquiry form (assuming there is one) and your agreement with the agency. Then get a letter sent off as soon as poss. In due course your request for set aside gets considered by a first tier tribunal judge.

 

Good luck, fingers crossed for you, Margaret.

[LyricalWarrior]

Thank you for all of the information you provided.

 

I contacted the Tribunals Service and sent a letter to them requesting a set aside, I have also found out that the advisor at the Worker's Rights centre has sent a letter as well. Although she has been very irritable with me, I'm not sure why, I've heard her mutter under her breath to other people about me. Once this is sorted, I will try and see another person regarding this as I've found her whole approach to be unprofessional.

 

I do feel let down with it, you are right. I have obtained copies of the forms I didn't receive and my MP is also getting involved. I had to make a new claim last week and obtain a new medical note, but I haven't heard anything back from the DWP yet regarding getting some money. I still have no money to my name.

[LyricalWarrior]

On the subject of the enquiry form, I didn't receive anything like that and it looks like the people who are representing me didn't either. Although it states on my appeal form, after it was hear, that contact was made and I haven't been involved in this appeal process since last year when my money was first stopped, despite having phoned the DWP multiple times and not receiving any forms to make contact with them. It is all very confusing.

[**Margaret**]

:LyricalWarrior:

 

You've got the first chunk under control. Hard to say when you'll hear anything cos the Tribunals Service has as many backlogs as the rest of the system. To avoid a repeat performance I'd phone the Tribunals Admin Centre every month or so to check progress.

 

From what you've written so far, there's more questions than answers. Why the lack of contact from the advice agency? Possible errors from the Tribunals Service? Possible confusion over who to phone? Unless they send a presenting officer to an employment n support tribunal hearing (very rare nowadays), once they've sent out appeal bundles Work n Pensions forget about appeals until there's a decision and should've redirected you to your rep or Tribunals Admin.

 

In my personal opinion, your priority should be to get the adverse decision set aside, but there's routes of complaint for all of the above if you want them. Takes between ten and fifteen working days, from when Jobcentreplus've all the info they need, to get a new claim for employment n support into payment.

 

Best wishes, Margaret.

[estellyn]

It is also important to put in a letter of complaint to the welfare rights agency, and ask for your case to be investigated as to why this happened. Any response you get can be sent as evidence for the set aside.

 

Remember you also need to cover yourself by asking the Tribunal Service for a statement of reasons for the decision too, in case the set aside request is not granted.

[LyricalWarrior]

Sorry for the late reply, I've been sorting all of this out for months.

 

I found out from my MP that the Tribunal Service had the wrong address on file. I don't know why, especially as I had contacted them prior to this happening.

 

Anyway, I'm still waiting on an outcome.

[LyricalWarrior]

I'm asking this out of curiosity...

 

What happens to a new claim and medical results if you're last appeal is set aside and you go on to win it, please?

 

It's all very confusing.

[estellyn]

Unless things have changed, the previous decision is only valid until the new decision.

 

So for instance, if you were put in the support group as a result of the appeal, then that would apply until the decision is made following the next assessment.

[LyricalWarrior]

Unless things have changed, the previous decision is only valid until the new decision.

 

So for instance, if you were put in the support group as a result of the appeal, then that would apply until the decision is made following the next assessment.

 

Thank you.

 

Yes it is with two threads on the go

 

Well there's no need to be rude, I was only asking a question.