Mr Lender Possible Fraud ?

[melowyelow]

I currently have a loan from MR lender

Anyway that aside i was recently made redundant

Rang emailed the Nat West to cancel CPA

Cancelled my bank card

Told Mr Lender I had been made redundant they of course asked for £75 to set up a repayment plan which i refused

Mr lender has still managed to take 1 payment of £75 and another payment of £145, may i add my bank was already overdrawn before Mr lenders payments, these show up on my statment as POS / Debit card transactions

The Bank account i have with Nat West has NO overdraft on it and is £252 overdrawn

Where do i go from here?

Thanks in advance for any info

[renegadeimp]

What did your bank say? If you instructed them, then they must refund the amounts AND any charges accrued on the account. I would issue a full complaint with the bank. OFT and FSA and demand to speak to a senior manager.

 

With something like this, NEVER speak to the pointless front desk reps.

[melowyelow]

The bank said there is no point as they will re-do the cpa or set up a DD so it was decided to cancel the card to stop the CPA 's this ovbiously hasnt worked

looking back i should have spoke to somone higher up although the 1st person i spoke to was usless i asked to speak to a supervisor

what i dont get is the card couldnt be used sureley so how come thay have got the money ?

 

i have just sent Mr lender an email that says

 

"Hi Zoe

 

Can you please advise what the £75 and £145 payments were for having stated on various e-mails to Mr. Lender whishing to cancel CPA and had been made redundant

 

I had canceld CPA under regulation 55 of the Payment Services Regulations 2009

 

I expect a reply forthwith so I can take this further with either Nat west or yourselves

 

 

 

 

STRICTLY WRITING ONLY NO PHONE CALLS

[melowyelow]

Any letter ideas templates legislation to throw at them would be good

i have another account on here and ive helped lots of people TBH im ashamed of myself

om ok with debht HCEO/ Bailiff issues but PDL's arent my neck of the woods

Again any help would be most appreciated

[melowyelow]

Also sent this to nat west about 2 weeks ago but never had confimation it had been done

Cancellation of Continuous Payment Authority

Dear Sir / Madam

My payday loan with Mr Lender are being paid using a continuous payment authority. i wish to cancel all CPAauthority with immediate effect under the regulation 55 of the PaymentServices Regulations 2009.

Consent and withdrawal of consent

55.—(1) A payment transaction is to be regarded as havingbeen authorised by the payer for the purposes of this Part only if the payerhas given its consent to—

(a)the execution ofthe payment transaction; or .

(b)the execution of a series of payment transactions ofwhich that payment transaction forms part. .

(2) Such consent—

(a)may be given before or, if agreed between the payer andits payment service provider, after the execution of the payment transaction;and .

(b)must be given in the form, and in accordance with theprocedure, agreed between the payer and its payment service provider. .

(3) The payer may withdraw its consent to a paymenttransaction at any time before the point at which the payment order can nolonger be revoked under regulation 67.

(4) Subject toregulation 67(3) to (5), the payer may withdraw its consent to the execution ofa series of payment transactions at any time with the effect that any futurepayment transactions are not regarded as authorised for the purposes of thisPart.

Any CPA’s taken in the after the 11th of March 2013 willmean they are unauthorised under reg.55(3) and 55(4)of the Payment ServicesRegulations 2009 Will make me entitled to a refund under regulation 61of thepayment services regulations 2009

Legislation Below

Payment service provider’s liability for unauthorisedpayment transactions

61. Subject toregulations 59 and 60, where an executed payment transaction was not authorisedin accordance with regulation 55, the payment service provider mustimmediately—

(a)refund the amountof the unauthorised payment transaction to the payer; and .

(b)where applicable, restore the debited payment account tothe state it would have been in had the unauthorised payment transaction nottaken place.

Please send me confirmation you have done this.

Never replied

[melowyelow]

Any letter ideas templates legislation to throw at them would be good

i have another account on here and ive helped lots of people TBH im ashamed of myself

om ok with debht HCEO/ bailiff issues but PDL's arent my neck of the woods

Again any help would be most appreciated

[dx100uk]

We have been telling people to put a letter into their bank instructing them not to make any payments under any circumstances to these companie

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/visa-debit-chargeback/- it works!

 

banks MUST follow written intructions from their customers !

This fsa guide has now been updated:

 

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/consumer_...ghts_guide.pdf

 

Here's the text:

 

Cancelling a regular

card payment:

 

When you give your credit or debit card details to a company and authorise them to take regular payments from your account,

such as for a gym membership or magazine subscription,

it is known as a ‘recurring transaction’ or ‘continuous payment authority’.

These are often confused with direct debits, but do not offer the same guarantee if the amount or date of the payment changes.

In most cases, regular payments can be cancelled by telling the company taking the payments.

.

However,

you have the right to cancel them directly with your bank or card issuer by telling it that you have stopped permission for the payments.

Your bank or card issuer must then stop them – it has no right to insist that you agree this first with the company taking the payments.

Be aware, though, that you will still be responsible for paying any money that you owe.

.

see: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?336569-How-to-remove-a-lender-s-continuous-payment-authority(2-Viewing)-nbsp

.

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/consumerinformation/product_news/banking/know_your_rights/solving/index.shtml

dx

[matt v atos]

I would refer back to post # 2 !

[matt v atos]

I would refer back to post # 2 !

 

Sorry DX posts crossed.

[lilyx0xmunster]

interesting i am currently fighting with these guys too for a friend in a similar way because of her loss of employment.. will watch this post and see what you get x good luck i'm lucky if i get a response lol

[Guest]

I think Mr Lender can still get at your account even with a new card, because they take your account number and sort code when you apply, which doesn't change with a new card. I think direct debits and charges are made on the bank account and not the card.

[dx100uk]

I think Mr Lender can still get at your account even with a new card, because they take your account number and sort code when you apply, which doesn't change with a new card. I think direct debits and charges are made on the bank account and not the card.

 

no ..

 

dx

[Guest]

no ..

 

dx

 

Are you sure? I know quickquid and poundstopocket take payments by direct debit and as far as I know if I get a new card all my direct debits remain on the account, unless I cancel them.

[dx100uk]

who said DD's were cancelled by changing your card....??

[Guest]

I'm trying to help the opening poster by pointing out a way in which this company could have taken a payment even though the card has been cancelled. No one has said DD's were cancelled by changing your card, but no one has mentioned the possibility that payments could have been made in this way, and I dont know 100% that they do remain on a cancelled card?

[dx100uk]

well then why speculate?

 

you just add to the confusion.....

 

the details of what to actually do are in post 7

 

the OP sadly started on the wrong foot.

 

many banks give out crap that they cant cancel CPA etc

nor do chargebacks...they are WRONG!!

 

- The FSA website clearly states "The bank must make the refund immediately".

.

- The FSA website clearly states "Your bank must only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if it can prove you authorised the transaction – though your bank cannot simply say that use of your password, card and PIN conclusively proves you authorised a payment".

.

- The FSA website clearly states "Your bank must only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if it can prove you are at fault because you acted fraudulently or, because you deliberately, or with gross negligence, failed to protect the details of your card, PIN or password in a way that allowed the transaction."

.

- The FSA website makes no mention of a 15 day wait due to having an "existing relationship" with the retailer/payee.

 

http://www.bacs.co.uk/bacs/businesses/directdebit/collecting/pages/customersrights.aspx

.

[Guest]

Why speculate? Melowyelow is asking how they could have got the money when the card was cancelled.

 

Post 7 says CPA's are often confused with direct debits, which suggests they're different things and cancelling a CPA may not cancel a direct debit. I've had over 10 payday loans and nearly all use CPA to recover money but some, quickquid for one, also set up a direct debit. When I log in to my online banking account and go to direct debits only quickquid out of all the other payday loans is there. It is easier to cancel if you know it's there, but cancelling a card and withdrawing CPA (depending on how its worded) may not cancel it.

[matttye]

We have been telling people to put a letter into their bank instructing them not to make any payments under any circumstances to these companie

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/visa-debit-chargeback/- it works!

 

banks MUST follow written intructions from their customers !

This fsa guide has now been updated:

 

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/consumer_...ghts_guide.pdf

 

Here's the text:

 

Cancelling a regular

card payment:

 

When you give your credit or debit card details to a company and authorise them to take regular payments from your account,

such as for a gym membership or magazine subscription,

it is known as a ‘recurring transaction’ or ‘continuous payment authority’.

These are often confused with direct debits, but do not offer the same guarantee if the amount or date of the payment changes.

In most cases, regular payments can be cancelled by telling the company taking the payments.

.

However,

you have the right to cancel them directly with your bank or card issuer by telling it that you have stopped permission for the payments.

Your bank or card issuer must then stop them – it has no right to insist that you agree this first with the company taking the payments.

Be aware, though, that you will still be responsible for paying any money that you owe.

.

see: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?336569-How-to-remove-a-lender-s-continuous-payment-authority(2-Viewing)-nbsp

.

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/consumerinformation/product_news/banking/know_your_rights/solving/index.shtml

dx

 

A visa debit chargeback is all well and good but these can take time while an investigation takes place.

 

if you have already explicitly told your bank NOT to release payments and they ignored you, a full complaint to your bank and to the OFT should be made as the law under Payment services regulations 2009 entitles you to an IMMEDIATE refund. You shouldn't have to wait for an investigation to ensue based on the banks error.

 

I think you need to keep asking your call to be escalated if you phone the bank because customer service staff probably won't have the authority to refund you.

[dx100uk]

no under the rules of chargeback

they should refund

then investigate.

 

The FSA website clearly states "The bank must make the refund immediately".

.

- The FSA website clearly states "Your bank must only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if it can prove you authorised the transaction – though your bank cannot simply say that use of your password, card and PIN conclusively proves you authorised a payment".

.

- The FSA website clearly states "Your bank must only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if it can prove you are at fault because you acted fraudulently or, because you deliberately, or with gross negligence, failed to protect the details of your card, PIN or password in a way that allowed the transaction."

.

- The FSA website makes no mention of a 15 day wait due to having an "existing relationship" with the retailer/payee.

 

http://www.bacs.co.uk/bacs/businesse...ersrights.aspx

.

 

always escalate if the current telephone jockey refuses

 

all banks are duty bound to chargeback.

 

dx

Edited June 30, 2013 by citizenB

[matttye]

no under the rules of chargeback

they should refund

then investigate.

 

The FSA website clearly states "The bank must make the refund immediately".

.

- The FSA website clearly states "Your bank must only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if it can prove you authorised the transaction – though your bank cannot simply say that use of your password, card and PIN conclusively proves you authorised a payment".

.

- The FSA website clearly states "Your bank must only refuse a refund for an unauthorised transaction if it can prove you are at fault because you acted fraudulently or, because you deliberately, or with gross negligence, failed to protect the details of your card, PIN or password in a way that allowed the transaction."

.

- The FSA website makes no mention of a 15 day wait due to having an "existing relationship" with the retailer/payee.

 

http://www.bacs.co.uk/bacs/businesse...ersrights.aspx

.

 

always escalate if the current telephone jockey refuses

 

all banks are duty bound to chargeback.

 

dx

 

Sorry I was going by what it says on the Whatconsumer site you linked:

 

"Invoking the chargeback procedure

 

If you suspect your card has been used fraudulently, if the goods and services you bought with your card are faulty or if they do not materialise, then you should contact the bank who has provided you with your Visa debit card within 120 days, requesting they initiate the chargeback process. It does not mean you will automatically and immediately get your money back. It will initially become a ‘dispute’ in which the claim will be fully investigated by both banks before any money is returned."

 

Is that incorrect or is the site correct and the Visa debit chargeback scheme incompatible with the law?

Edited June 30, 2013 by citizenB

[renegadeimp]

There are 2 schemes. One is for regular disputes. The other is for when banks openly and willingly break the law.

[melowyelow]

Thanks for all your help so far .....

Sent this email on the 29th of march so far no replies anything i need to add ??

 

 

From:

XXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Sent:

29 March 2013 01:27:55

To:

zoew@mrlender.co.uk

Cc:

complaints@mrlender.co.uk; complaint.info@financial-ombudsman.org.uk; sarah@mrlender.co.uk; rollover_payment@mrlender.co.uk; rolloverdesk@mrlender.co.uk; alan@mrlender.co.uk; carrie@mrlender.co.uk; lawrence@mrlender.co.uk

Hi Zoe

 

Can you please advise what the £75 and £145 payments were for having stated onvarious e-mails to Mr. Lender whishing to cancel CPA and had been maderedundant

 

I had canceld CPA under regulation 55 of the Payment Services Regulations 2009

 

I expect a reply forthwith so I can take this further with either Nat west oryourselves

 

 

 

 

 

STRICTLY WRITING ONLY NO PHONE CALLS

[biggeorge]

You want to send a letter to your bank regarding this matter, If you cancelled the CPA then you should be entitled to your money back.

I would point out to the bank that they are in breech of banking regulations since they still allowed payments to go out after you cancelled the CPA.

 

The good point in your favor is by the sounds of it the bank have given you an overdraft, Immediately get any income moved to another account (bank account different bank) so this overdraft does not get eaten up by any income going in. Once you point out to the bank that they have paid the CPA without authority and using their own money as you don't have any overdraft setup up and never agreed to any overdraft been setup.

 

Tell the bank you want the funds refunded and your account back to the state it was in when you cancelled the CPA and that includes any bank charges they have applied since they paid out to these people, Give them 7 days or you will make a formal complaint to the FOS.

I would also point out to the bank that you never agreed to any overdraft so any payments made will be the banks money as you will not be depositing any income until this matter is sorted out.

You will amazed at how quick they reply when you point out they have paid your bills with their own money.

 

 

It can be done as I had a nice refund of £522 that Natwest were claiming from me all for a charge of £7 that took me over my overdraft.

Account is now clear of all these charges but still made a complaint to the FOS as my compensation hasn't been p aid although Natwest totally agreed with my complaint, They must have missed out the bit where I asked for £500 in compensation for the months of problems they caused me.

 

George

 

Get your income secured today to stop these parasites.

[melowyelow]

Thanks BigGeorge

 

Just an update

 

sent today from Mr Lender

 

Dear xxxxxx

Thank you for your email.

We can confirm on the 18thmarch an email was sent to you asking you to confirm your mother’s maiden name and password on the account in order to remove your card details.

As this information was not confirmed we were unable to remove the card details.

Should you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact us.

Kind Regards,

Sarah

Customer Services

[melowyelow]

Heres what i sent back

 

Dear Sarah

 

 

I think you need to look at the FSA website nor do I have to give any name / mothers name ect

 

 

 

 

 

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/consumerinformation/product_news/banking/know_your_rights/payments

 

 

 

 

 

Again i will ask for an explanation of what the 2 payments were for i will also be requesting a chargeback from the Nat West