Debt advice - agreeing an affordable payment plan - now have a Claim form

[stevenuboat]

Hi All,

 

I have been reviewing a number of threads on this site to come up with a strategy to deal with the debt problem we have.

 

To summarise my wife has run up a number of unsecured debts without my knowledge which is now out of control (see below):

 

Sygma Bank £3670

Sygma bank (different account) £2379

Barclaycard (previously egg) £3314

Barclaycard £2802

Tesco £1871

TOTAL £14k

 

We have written to all creditors (recorded delivery) to ask for 28 days grace whilst we try to find a solution to our debt problem.

 

We followed this letter with a CCA request (also recorded delivery) and we have received responses from all.

 

We are going to post today our income and expenditure which details the nominal amount we can afford to pay monthly to each creditor (worked out on a pro rata basis).

 

Whilst sending all of the above letters my wife is still receiving constant phone calls (which we are ignoring) and demand letters. I

 

n most cases we are incurring additional late payment charges and default notice charges (all of the accounts now have a default).

 

I have a number of questions and I would appreciate advice on this forum to make sure we are dealing with the situation in the best way?

 

1. We have some equity in our house, therefore can the creditors make a claim on this even though the debts are unsecured,

only in my wife's name (mortgage is in both our names), and we are offering to pay what we can afford? THIS IS A BIG CONCERN FOR ME.

 

2. We can afford to pay less than £3 per month to each creditor (I am sure this will not be accepted)

and as read on other forums it is likely that the debts will be sold.

At what point will interest stop accruing?

 

3. Since my first letter asking for time whilst we try to resolve the problem,

can I ask the creditors to remove the charges which I deem to be unfair and unhelpful considering my situation?

 

4. My wife's credit rating will be damaged now because of recent defaults, will this also affect me even though I am not on any of the agreements?

Not that we are in a position to get credit in the foreseeable future, I may need to re-mortgage at some point and want to know if this will impact?

 

5. I have already had a doorstop visit, how can I stop this and ensure correspondence is only in writing?

 

6. Is it worth uploading the credit agreements for advice. I have read on some threads that some agreements are not enforceable?

This point really annoys me because the debt my wife has accumulated should not have been approved because she clearly could not afford it.

Some of the agreements do not have her signature, is this normal?

 

7. Even though the debts are in my wife's name only I have done a joint income and expenditure (for our benefit only not to be sent to creditors)

and the situation is the same, we cannot afford the repayments.

I am therefore confident if challenged on a joint basis in the courts I could show that we cannot afford the repayments.

 

Ultimately, I need the creditors to accept the lower token payments as this all we can afford.

I also need for charges to be removed and interest to stop, which I am assuming will happen shortly.

In the meantime I will try to find as much overtime as possible to save enough money to eventually pay the debts off completely -

if this is even possible?

 

If anyone could answer the questions/concerns I have raised I would be extremely grateful.

 

We are both very worried about the impact on our house as this is the only money/equity we have for our futures and potentially for our children when we go

- I want to protect this at all costs.

 

Thanks!

[PGH7447]

Hi and welcome to the CAG and yur first steps towards curbing the threat-o-grams and calls

 

Hi All,

 

I have been reviewing a number of threads on this site to come up with a strategy to deal with the debt problem we have. To summarise my wife has run up a number of unsecured debts without my knowledge which is now out of control (see below):

 

Sygma Bank £3670

Sygma bank (different account) £2379

Barclaycard (previously egg) £3314

Barclaycard £2802

Tesco £1871

TOTAL £14k

 

We have written to all creditors (recorded delivery) to ask for 28 days grace whilst we try to find a solution to our debt problem. We followed this letter with a CCJ request (also recorded delivery) and we have received responses from all. - Hope you mean CCA request

 

We are going to post today our income and expenditure which details the nominal amount we can afford to pay monthly to each creditor (worked out on a pro rata basis).

I would wait for the CCA requests to be honoured first and check that all is in order - some people say they dont need this info but it does show willing

Whilst sending all of the above letters my wife is still receiving constant phone calls (which we are ignoring) and demand letters. In most cases we are incurring additional late payment charges and default notice charges (all of the accounts now have a default). Look in the library for the telephone harrassment letter and send that in with your I&E sheet, why waste postage, and if you do answer the phone say in writing and put the phone down

I have a number of questions and I would appreciate advice on this forum to make sure we are dealing with the situation in the best way?

 

1. We have some equity in our house, therefore can the creditors make a claim on this even though the debts are unsecured, only in my wife's name (mortgage is in both our names), and we are offering to pay what we can afford? THIS IS A BIG CONCERN FOR ME. - long way off, and not worth worrying about at the moment

 

2. We can afford to pay less than £3 per month to each creditor (I am sure this will not be accepted) and as read on other forums it is likely that the debts will be sold. At what point will interest stop accruing? - £1 a month is more than enough if that is all you can afford, ensure that you state quite clearly that if they accept the offer all charges and interest is stopped - you can also claim back charges etc

 

3. Since my first letter asking for time whilst we try to resolve the problem, can I ask the creditors to remove the charges which I deem to be unfair and unhelpful considering my situation? - Yes

4. My wife's credit rating will be damaged now because of recent defaults, will this also affect me even though I am not on any of the agreements? Not that we are in a position to get credit in the foreseeable future, I may need to re-mortgage at some point and want to know if this will impact? - no, unless you are linked on the in some way, you can check this by checking your CRA files with experien etc

 

5. I have already had a doorstop visit, how can I stop this and ensure correspondence is only in writing? - send the doorstep letter - found in the library and if someone turns up tell them to leave, you have no need to "entertain" any doorstep creep

 

6. Is it worth uploading the credit agreements for advice. I have read on some threads that some agreements are not enforceable? This point really annoys me because the debt my wife has accumulated should not have been approved because she clearly could not afford it. Some of the agreements do not have her signature, is this normal? - Yes please upload removing any personal identifying details including bar codes - on the topic of agreements any PPI? Also if you feel the credit was provided without due diligence then use this arguamnet in your letters

 

7. Even though the debts are in my wife's name only I have done a joint income and expenditure (for our benefit only not to be sent to creditors) and the situation is the same, we cannot afford the repayments. I am therefore confident if challenged on a joint basis in the courts I could show that we cannot afford the repayments. - her debts her income, no need for them to know your income

 

Ultimately, I need the creditors to accept the lower token payments as this all we can afford. I also need for charges to be removed and interest to stop, which I am assuming will happen shortly. In the meantime I will try to find as much overtime as possible to save enough money to eventually pay the debts off completely - if this is even possible? - they will huff and puff BUT you can only pay what yu can afford, tough, they wont like it and probably will sell the debts PDQ to that other fine industry the debt Collector

If anyone could answer the questions/concerns I have raised I would be extremely grateful. We are both very worried about the impact on our house as this is the only money/equity we have for our futures and potentially for our children when we go - I want to protect this at all costs.

 

Thanks!

 

Again Welcome

[PGH7447]

another thought, you state above that there are 2 accounts with sygma bank, are these credit cards or loans? if credit cards how did she get 2?

[stevenuboat]

Hi PGH7447,

 

Thanks for your response, much appreciated:

 

I did mean CCA request - too many acronyms!!

 

Regarding uploading the CCAs, do mean upload them to the agreements and PPI sections of this site?

 

I will definitely use the due diligence argument in my letters.

 

From what I can make out the Sygma agreements relate to store cards (MK One and Silver) but I will check with my wife this evening.

Is it wring for a lender to have approve 2 agreements?

 

Good idea I will send the harassment letter with the income and expenditure, definitely no need to waste postage!

 

Will specify that the payment offer is subject to all interest being stopped.

 

At what point should I request for charges to be refunded, should I also say that my repayment offer is subject to interest being stopped and unfair charges being removed?

 

The credit report clearly shows that the agreements in question are only in my wife's name. The only joint agreement is the mortgage.

 

Do I send the doorstep letter to both the creditor and the company they use to physically knock the door?

 

I will keep my income separate, but I have it in case at some point it goes in front of a judge and they need to decide whether the repayments are reasonable considering our joint income (again this is me worrying again about the impact on the equity in our home).

 

Sorry for more questions.......

 

 

THANKS!

[PGH7447]

Hi PGH7447,

 

Thanks for your response, much appreciated:

 

I did mean CCA request - too many acronyms!!

 

Regarding uploading the CCAs, do mean upload them to the agreements and PPI sections of this site? (just upload the agreements to this thread then we can check they are all correct and proper), I will definitely use the due diligence argument in my letters. From what I can make out the Sygma agreements relate to store cards (MK One and Silver) but I will check with my wife this evening. Is it wring for a lender to have approve 2 agreements? it depends on what they are related to, but if store cards probably not

 

Good idea I will send the harassment letter with the income and expenditure, definitely no need to waste postage! and the doorstep letter, also keep a copy by the front door and hand it to any creep that shows up

 

Will specify that the payment offer is subject to all interest being stopped.

 

At what point should I request for charges to be refunded, should I also say that my repayment offer is subject to interest being stopped and unfair charges being removed? you will probably need to send a sar to each company to demand all statements etc to work out all charges, but lets see what the agreements look like first

 

The credit report clearly shows that the agreements in question are only in my wife's name. The only joint agreement is the mortgage.

 

Do I send the doorstep letter to both the creditor and the company they use to physically knock the door? yes

I will keep my income separate, but I have it in case at some point it goes in front of a judge ( a long way off before you ever get in court) and they need to decide whether the repayments are reasonable considering our joint income (again this is me worrying again about the impact on the equity in our home).

 

Sorry for more questions.......

 

 

THANKS!

 

good luck

[Jam_Buttie]

Debt total under £15,000.

 

Debt Relief Order perhaps?

[stevenuboat]

Hi Jam_Buttie,

 

I didn't think a debt relief order would be an option because my wife is on the mortgage and therefore owns an asset?

 

Thanks.

[stevenuboat]

Thanks again PGH7447, I will upload the agreements as discussed over the next couple of days as well as following through with your other suggestions.

[stevenuboat]

First agreement excluding personal information - Barclaycard.

 

Comments - it looks like 2 pages of standard T&Cs no real particulars and no signature? Does this constitute a CCA?

Edited October 11, 2012 by stevenuboat

[stevenuboat]

Barclaycard (previously Egg card).

 

Comments - unlike previous barclaycard agreement this is more substantial (20 pages), but also looks like standard T&Cs. Particulars are on the the top of the T&Cs. No signature and no facility for it?

[stevenuboat]

Sygma MK1 Credit card.

 

Comments - Page 1 is blank Page 2 (Agreement particulars) has been filled in by someone else not my wifes handwriting and address spelt incorrectly. Other pages are standard T&Cs with no signatures, there is a facility to sign but it is blank?

[stevenuboat]

Sygma Silver credit card.

 

Comments - as mentioned on previous comment the same lender has issued 2 separate credit cards (is this normal)? Page 1 has all particulars (name, salary, signature, address, dob, property status, marital status, employment status and bank details. The information has not been checked which leads to my frustration and earlier comments regarding due diligence. For example (income, sole ownership of house are false). Page 2 T&Cs and Page 3 is blank copy of page 1 but with handwritten address at the top )not wife's handwriting and all other particulars are blank. The interest rates are different compared to the first page??

[stevenuboat]

I am still waiting for the Tesco CCA (requested on the 22nd september). I will upload as soon as I get them.

[PGH7447]

First agreement excluding personal information - Barclaycard.

 

Comments - it looks like 2 pages of standard T&Cs no real particulars and no signature? Does this constitute a CCA?

 

These are T&Cs only, did your wife take this out on line? or by completing an application form, if the later send the in dispute letter staing that this does not provide any evidence of an agreement, in that it does not show any personal info except her name which in reality could be added by anybody at anytime

[PGH7447]

Barclaycard (previously Egg card).

 

Comments - unlike previous barclaycard agreement this is more substantial (20 pages), but also looks like standard T&Cs. Particulars are on the the top of the T&Cs. No signature and no facility for it?

 

same as previous post - did she re-sign when barclayshark took over from egg? if not then she needs the egg agreement

[PGH7447]

Sygma Silver credit card.

 

Comments - as mentioned on previous comment the same lender has issued 2 separate credit cards (is this normal)? Page 1 has all particulars (name, salary, signature, address, dob, property status, marital status, employment status and bank details. The information has not been checked which leads to my frustration and earlier comments regarding due diligence. For example (income, sole ownership of house are false). Page 2 T&Cs and Page 3 is blank copy of page 1 but with handwritten address at the top )not wife's handwriting and all other particulars are blank. The interest rates are different compared to the first page??

 

 

Which card was first? this one or the other, whichever this agreement looks valid - but I would question why a person would be allowed to take out 2 credit cards from the same provider

[PGH7447]

Sygma MK1 Credit card.

 

Comments - Page 1 is blank Page 2 (Agreement particulars) has been filled in by someone else not my wifes handwriting and address spelt incorrectly. Other pages are standard T&Cs with no signatures, there is a facility to sign but it is blank?

 

 

They have provided a copy only, which is what they are now allowed to do - thanks to the toothless OFT et-al. go down the due diligence route as outlined above.

 

Hopefully some other caggers will look in and offer some advice

[stevenuboat]

Hi PGH7447,

 

Thank you for checking the agreements. If they are allowed to provide a copy with no signature and handwritten name and address (not by my wife), how is the Sygma MK1 agreement different from the Barclaycard agreements, is it because the Barclaycard ones are just T&Cs?

 

So that I understand correctly they are allowed to basically provide a standard template agreement with no particulars (except a handwritten name and address by them not my wife) and no signatures? I dont understand how this is proof that my wife has actually signed an agreement? Do they no longer need to provide a copy of the agreement that was filled in and signed by the borrower?

 

We may have been a bit hasty as we sent off the harrassment letter along with the income and expenditure with offer of payment. Can we still send an in dispute letter if we have already sent an offer for payment?

 

Thanks,

 

James.

[PGH7447]

Yes there is nothing to stop you raising a dispute, although it maybe beneficial to await their response

 

If she applied for a card on line then there will be no signed agreement, has by ticking the box you have agreed to their terms, so was the barclays applied for online ?

[stevenuboat]

Hi,

 

I have received a CCJ letter today (i will post it up today but it looks genuine).

 

I am not sure how to proceed because we have tried to reason with the creditor:

 

1. sent letter asking for 28 days grace whilst looking for a solution to situation.

 

2. sent letter requesting CCA

 

3. letter letter with income and expenditure and with offer of payment

 

4. sent letter asking them to only contact me in writing.

 

I have had no response to the income and expenditure and offer of payment. All other creditors have responded and accepted, whereas Sygma (there are 2 accounts) have responded with a CCJ letter.

 

I am surprised because I have sent a number of letters explaining my situation and offering what I can afford to pay. All letters have been sent recorded delivery so I have proof that I have tried to reason with them and find a solution.

 

Will I need to go to court due to the CCJ - it gives me a number of options:

 

1. Ignore and a CCJ may be issued in my absence.

 

2. Agree with claim but ask for more time to pay.

 

3. Admit only part of the claim.

 

4. Disagree or want to make your own claim.

 

Advice would be much appreciated.

[PGH7447]

how do you mean CCJ letter, is it simply a letter from the dca or a claim from a court?

[stevenuboat]

Hi,

 

It looks quite official so I think it is from the court but hopefully you can tell me for sure?

 

I have attached and deleted personal information.

 

Thanks,

[PGH7447]

yep thats a court claim alright, you have to acknowledge this on line at MCOL

[stevenuboat]

Thought so. Can I disagree with the claim and base my defence on the basis that I have kept them up to date with my financial situation and also made them an offer of payment, which they have not responded to?

 

Once I acknowledge this on line what will be the next steps, I am assuming other people have been in this situation whereby the creditor is ignoring an offer of payment? I am really surprised it has got to this so quickly, particularly considering we have made on offer based in what we can afford?

 

I am trying to understand the possible outcomes and how court involvement will impact my approach thus far?

 

Should I open a new thread to get more opinions - as always any advice will be appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[PGH7447]

I will ask that this is moved to the legal forum, so that other more experienced caggers in legl matters can advise, however you must acknowledge the court c,aim within I believe 14 days and defend all.

 

I will be back later