Someone has used my name for a fine on the London tube

[Halflfe2]

Hello,

 

I have just registered,

 

I am very troubled

 

I received a letter this Friday just gone from the Courts stating that I own a very large sum of money because of a Fine that apparently happened in April

the person got fined on the London over ground.

 

The station they mentioned I have never been to or I do not recall ever being to.

 

I have never received any letters until now. Why now!!.

 

I called the courts and I asked them what this was about and that is when they mentioned the fine in April and also what station this all happened at.

 

They mentioned that there was a court case in June but I had never heard of this so how could I attend a case that I did not do.

 

Someone used my name but they gave an address that I have never lived at.

 

Though the road that the original person gave is a road I knew someone that lived there.

 

But I have not seen that person in over 5-6 years I do not even know if it was that person but why is this happening to me.

 

I have now been to the courts I declared a statutory declaration, I don't really know what is happening.

 

I have no proof that I was not at the station but do not they have CCTV so they can see it was not me.

 

I cannot remember what I was doing on that day when apparently this incident occurred.

 

I am going to talk to a free solicitor but really the London Over ground company are accusing me of this crime and I have not done anything wrong.

 

I do not intend to pay the overground that amount of money as this has nothing to do with me.

 

I want to talk to the Over ground company as they clearly have made a mistake.

 

I tried to talk to them today but they just said ring the court that has issued this.

 

I will try to ring the Over ground tomorrow I might have better chance of some kind to reach an understanding of some sort.

 

I feel if they continue after I am proven innocent

I want to sue them or claim compensation because now I have to wait a whole month to go back to court.

 

And I will now for the whole month have this court thoughts in my mind this is stress and I do not need this stress.

So I will go after them for they will be causing me grief.

 

I am also thinking what if this happens again,

how do I stop this happening again.

 

Can the police help.

 

But really I have never been in a situation like this so I do not know really how to proceed.

 

Can someone advise how to handle this please

 

This is so wrong on so many levels this system is broken as it clearly leads to situations like this.

 

Thank you

 

Kind regards

[renegadeimp]

Youve already done the right thing. What you need to do is show them that you have never lived at that address, and the fact that someone has given you the wrong name. You could go to the police, because it can be classed as identity theft.

[firstclassx]

What you going to sue them for? If someone gave your name, address, postcode etc, this is, at the time, verified via various means, the only person you could sue is this mystery person. Fortunately, a description of the passenger is written down, so you should look nothing like that person.

 

This smells so fishy to me, because you get plenty of "reminder" letters before a summons, then lots of court letters, not just one out of the blue for a fine demand!

 

When do you have your new hearing?

 

What "understanding" do you want to reach with London Overground? An out of court settlement or....?

Edited September 21, 2012 by firstclassx

[Halflfe2]

- firstClassx

 

Please read,

 

I never received any letters until the 14th of September how could I of possibly known about what has happened. They were sending letters to an address that I have never lived at using my name what part of this do you not understand. The person who got caught used my name an address I have never lived at does this make sense to you. Because it makes so much sense to me that I have to go to court so please unless you can advise do not comment.

 

I will sue or ask for compensation from the London over ground because they are causing me stress, they are causing me to lose focus, to lose time. To make me concentrate on things that I SHOULD NOT BE CONCENTRATING ON!!! do you understand this. I will now for the whole month have these thoughts in my head. They will pay, someone will pay and that someone is not me.

 

I tried to ask the London overground could I send you pictures to them this is a mistake, to talk to them, even the officer who dealt with this matter but they do not want to listen to me, as this case apparently has gone too far since April. Though I have only found out about last week how can this be.

 

The mystery person, you sound so sceptical that this is some joke I have decided to play, please do not take this tone with me.

 

The thing that makes no sense is they are wasting my time, their time and wasting more importantly taxes payers money.

[firstclassx]

If you proceed in an obnoxious manner, I will not help you. I see cases like this every single day, and very, very few end successfully for the defendant, (i.e. you). I am very sceptical, because so very few people are prosecuted "by mistake".

 

Aren't you the one contacting London Overground? How have London Overground causes you stress? They successfully prosecuted you, in court, which meant 3 other magistrates' also agreed with their version of events.

 

If you're truthful, London Overground have:

 

1) Never written to you

2) Never spoken to you

3) Never had dealings with you

 

The only person to blame is the person who used your name. Unless you know who that is then I suggest you concentrate on winning your case, rather than who you are going to sue.

 

If you are innocent, then when it goes to court you will be found not guilty, and can ask for reasonable costs.

 

If the description they have in their witness statements matches with how you look, then the court will convict you and you will be the one who has to pay.

 

So, please, stop ranting and raving, and explain the case. What offences are involved, when/where did this happen, when is your new court date etc? Have you ever had dealings with London overground? Have you ever had a Penalty Fare? Do you use the train? Do you have an alibi? etc etc.

 

Finally, the question you have to answer is how as the court linked you with this case? They don't just pick a random person with the same name and demand money.

 

When you let the forum know the answers, tailored advice can be given.

 

 

If you are guilty, then please tell us and we can help.

If you genuinely are not guilty, then you need to contact a solicitor because your chances of being convicted a second time are very high.

 

NB: STOP CONTACTING LONDON OVERGROUND FOR THE TIME BEING. THEY CANNOT (AND WON'T WANT TO) HELP YOU. They will be in court to prosecute you at this new hearing. You can challenge their evidence then.

Edited September 22, 2012 by firstclassx

[Halflfe2]

Like I have stated I have never had any previous letters from London over ground or from the courts. I RECIEVED A LETTER FROM THE COURTS ON FRIDAY THE 14th of September regarding all of this, is this so difficult for you to understand. You are ignorant.

 

London Over have never written to me before

I have never spoke to London Over ground regarding anything with this

They have never had dealings with me.

 

Yes when we arrive they will see that I do not match who they original described down. They cannot convict me because I have never been to that station, there is no reason for me to have ever gone to that station.

 

Well I am thinking compensation from them because I offered to talk to them but they did not. Which now I have to wait a month for this to occur this will cause to always concentrate on them do you understand this even if I am innocent I will still think constantly about all this.

 

I want to talk to them for them to see me once they see me they can see I am not the person they have describe but no they want money.... it is a joke

 

I have never even been to that station.

 

I came on here wanting to know procedures but all I have assessed is nothing apart from Identity theft. Which I have already gone to the police to talk about this but they can do nothing until this case is complete.

Edited September 22, 2012 by ims21
We will not allow personal abuse

[firstclassx]

Sort yourself out then. I'm not prepared to assist you.

 

You aren't getting the answers you want because you aren't answering the questions I ask.

 

As for identify theft? Sure. I can call myself Tony Blair if I wanted to. Just because I give that name to somebody else, doesn't mean I've stolen his identity!

[ims21]

Halflfe2

 

If you answer the questions that have been put to you then it will make things easier for the guys to help you.

 

It would also be useful if you could set out the events that have happened to date in a clear style - perhaps bullet points.

 

If you calm down a bit and refrain from the abuse you may well get the help that you need.

 

I am no expert in this field but others are and they may well be able to help you if you help them.

 

Thanks

[Halflfe2]

What questions do you want to ask?

 

This is a public forum and I am not prepared to give details.

[Halflfe2]

The court case is over a month from now.

 

But details like names I cannot post on here.

[ims21]

No one will ask you to post names on here.

 

So let's take it a step at a time.....you say that there is a court case in a months time.

 

So this letter you received from the courts (which you mention in post #1) is this a court summons?

[Halflfe2]

Hello ims21,

 

The first letter I received was on the 14th of september

 

It is a further steps notice letter from the Courts mentioning various things that this letter could be about with the large amount that they say I own them.

[ims21]

Ok

 

Next thing...you have been to the court and filed a Statutory Declaration. Is that correct? If so, on what date did you file the declaration please and what did you say in it?

[Halflfe2]

I signed it on the 20th of September.

 

4.I found out about the case....

 

I was sent a letter and recieved the letter for court on Friday the 14th of September for the amount £----

 

This is what I put on the declaration

[ims21]

OK so from what I have gleaned from this is the following..

 

1-> Some offence/contravention was committed by a person who was not you.

 

2-> That person gave your name but an address that you have never lived at.

 

3-> A court hearing took place which was not attended by yourself because you had received no papers/summons/correspondence.

 

4-> At that court hearing the court found against you. This was back in April time (approx)

 

5-> Sometime later you found out about this by way of a letter to you at your correct address.

 

6-> You have filed a Statutory declaration with the courts.

 

7-> you have received notification of a court date in about a month's time.

 

 

If this is it in a nutshell then I would suggest that the forthcoming hearing is to have the case heard again and this is as a result of your Statutory Declaration. This is where you will get the opportunity to put your side of things and prove that it was not you that was involved in all of this.

 

In order to do this you will need to gather various bits of evidence such as proof of your address and the length of time you have resided there and that you are not in any way connected to the address to which the original documents were sent.

 

In addition you will need to be able to show to a good degree of certainty that you were not at the particular station at the time the offence was committed. If you can show that you were elsewhere then that would be good. Check your diary, were you at work, did you have any appointments on that day etc. etc.

 

Gather as much evidence for all of this as you can to prove that this was not you.

 

As I said, I am not an expert in transport but this seems to be the current situation as I can make it out.

 

Others will no doubt comment if I have missed something and put me right if I have gone off on the wrong angle.

[firstclassx]

The above post is correct.

 

IMO the only way the OP will be found "not guilty" is if (s)he provides verifiable evidence that they were elsewhere at the time.

 

To the OP: If you are guilty and have tried to hide, please tell the forum. We can help you if this is the case. If you are guilty and lies etc get found out, you will face Perjury/Perverting the course of justice charges which would make the matter serious enough for prison sentences. I am in no way saying or suggesting you are guilty, but if you are, the forum can help.

Edited September 22, 2012 by firstclassx

[ims21]

Thank you firstclassx

 

Good to know I wasn't way off-beam.

 

Thanks too for the additional edit...I forgot to mention the possible perjury for false information in a Statutory Declaration and it is good to include the point for the sake of completeness.

 

Again to Halflfe2, No One Is Suggesting That You Have Done This...we just want you to be aware of everything.

[Old-CodJA]

IMO the only way the OP will be found "not guilty" is if (s)he provides verifiable evidence that they were elsewhere at the time.

 

My opinion is slightly different.

 

If the OP has made a Statutory Declaration and this has been accepted by the Court, there is no conviction in place. The earlier conviction is 'Null & Void'

 

This means that TfL have to start again and may lay the same information without time constraint.

 

Whatever the case, when that new hearing takes place it is up to the prosecution to prove to the satisfaction of the Court that the OP was the traveller concerned.

 

The OP may state that: it is many months ago, they had not received any correspondence and that they cannot remember where they were on that day. They may say that they are certain that they did not travel on that journey and were never issued any form of unpaid fare notice or were not made the subject of any other report.

 

It is up to the prosecutor to prove otherwise to the satisfaction of the Court. If the Prosecutor has strong evidence such as a retained invalid ticket or photocard, a signature or other means of identity that was verified at the time, or other good evidence the OP will probably be convicted.

 

Now I'm not saying the the OP isn't being unnecessarily aggressive in the previous posts, nor that they may not still be found guilty, but it is not unheard of for a few cases to result in 'victim of impostor', which is why it's always so important to look at all the evidence from both sides before jumping to any conclusions. Perhaps it's worth looking at from a different perspective?

 

It is of course possible that the OP has now been traced to his correct address by the Court Enforcement Team only AFTER a case was proven in absence, but all previous letter were sent to a wrong address given by someone else and that is why the OP has never seen any of them. If the OP maintains a 'not-guilty' plea and there is no conclusive evidence tying the OP to the offence, a trial may be the only way of resolving the issue. If that hinges on positive identification by the member of staff making the report, many months after the original incident, a Court may not be inclined to convict.

Edited September 22, 2012 by Old-CodJA

[Halflfe2]

Okay I will comply

 

1-> Some offence/contravention was committed by a person who was not you.

 

Yes

 

2-> That person gave your name but an address that you have never lived at.

 

Yes

 

3-> A court hearing took place which was not attended by yourself because you had received no papers/summons/correspondence.

 

Yes

 

4-> At that court hearing the court found against you. This was back in April time (approx)

 

A court hearing took place in June but I could not have known of this because the address used was an address that has nothing to do with me

 

5-> Sometime later you found out about this by way of a letter to you at your correct address.

 

I found out about this in September, so.... something happened in April that has nothing to do with me I find out in September and I am in the wrong, this cannot be.

 

6-> You have filed a Statutory declaration with the courts.

 

Yes this week passed

 

7-> you have received notification of a court date in about a month's time.

 

Yes

 

Well I can prove I have been living at my current address before all this happened I have proof of that.

 

What I do not have is proof of where I was I cannot remember what I was doing. I am thinking to get my location of my phone on that day but even that will not prove anything. I do not have evidence of where I was or what I was doing. I cannot remember this.

 

I try my best not to lie. I consider lies to be a negative value in ones character. This all started last week it came out of nowhere this is insane.

 

How can I be found guilty unless I have memory deficiency if they show evidence of me at that station standing there, then I will pay them and at the same time send my self to a memory institution of some kind because I do not remember doing that. I would think I am crazy as I do not recall ever going to that station, I do not recall talking to an officer and giving that address. I would have needed to have known the address from the top of my head that this person had given, the address I do not know. And why would I give my real name but a fake address this is wrong.

 

But I have no proof of where I was, I know what I was doing the day before only because I saw a bank statement but nothing on that day, the day that this all supposedly took place on.

 

They have cameras there that must show who goes in and out of the station. I have never been to that station but they have the evidence, they must. This company is accusing me of something I did not do all because of my name.

 

I do not think this place is helping me it is making me confused.

 

This whole story of this letter is nonsense from the court I exist on this forum because of this letter that came to me on the 14th of September. I went to court for the first time because of this letter I saw people bow as they were leaving the court room for the first time because of this letter what nonsense why bow, are they bowing to justice? to some higher power? this is nonsense. It is just intimidation the whole purpose is of that. I now have to prove to this company and to the courts, to this system who I am, where I lived, what I was doing on that day I need evidence because the officer did not do his job on that day correctly. And someone used my name all this from someone using my name, this is wrong.

 

All I can say is,that this is a story that I wish I never knew of. Though it was thrust upon me and now I must follow a pointless chapter in the story. I ponder what I have learned or am about to learn, about this event in my life.

 

I am sorry if I seem angry but all I keep saying to my self why me I do not understand what has happened

[ims21]

I can understand why you are angry.

 

What I can say is that you are not the first person that this has happened to and you won't be the last.

 

Unfortunately you find yourself in a situation which requires you to go through a process to try and sort this out an that process must be followed.

 

There are now two very good people on this thread who can help you with this but please do not let your anger spill out at them. After all, they are trying to help you through this unfortunate mess so please take note of what they say.

 

Please please take my advice and certainly do not let your anger spill over to the court staff or the court itself...you must remain calm and professional at all times with them.

 

As I said, I am no transport or legal expert so I cannot advise you on the details of this but the guys here will help you if you let them.

 

Stay calm.

 

Regards

 

ims

[Old-CodJA]

None of this is pointless.

 

You do need to recognise that no matter how angry you may feel, the ONLY way that you will come out of this happy and satisfied is by recognising that you need to simply tell the truth without introducing irrelevant questions.

 

Whether or not someone 'bows' to the Magistrates is not relevant in proving your case. It is an accepted protocol in recognising the authority of the Court.

 

No, the company does not need to show a photograph of you at the station or on the train to prove their case. In some cases people do give their real name and a false address in the hope that they will get away with it, but getting angry and unduly aggressive about the accusation when you are in front of the Magistrates will not help you one bit.

 

The prosecutor will need to put evidence to prove the case

[Halflfe2]

Thanks and sorry to everyone if I am angry I do not mean to be but I cannot help but feel anger right now at everything. I feel the world against me here.

 

In addition I am angry because I think it could all be cleared if I go and talk to the company and the officer but they say it has gone to far, I do not understand.

[Halflfe2]

Hello oldcodJA

 

I guess it happens, this happens to people.

 

The officer would have had to written down the offender did he not.

 

I do not know what to say, I did not do what they said I did. It is my word against theirs. All I know is I have never been to that station and there was no reason for me to ever be at that station but if they wish to say I was there and they said I gave that address to the officer on that day and this was in court and everyone agrees without proof that this is what happened. Then there is something seriously wrong there just because I cannot prove where I was. This justice system would have just failed justice there and then it cannot be like that.

[firstclassx]

My opinion is slightly different.

 

If the OP has made a Statutory Declaration and this has been accepted by the Court, there is no conviction in place. The earlier conviction is 'Null & Void'

 

This means that TfL have to start again and may lay the same information without time constraint.

 

Whatever the case, when that new hearing takes place it is up to the prosecution to prove to the satisfaction of the Court that the OP was the traveller concerned.

 

The OP may state that: it is many months ago, they had not received any correspondence and that they cannot remember where they were on that day. They may say that they are certain that they did not travel on that journey and were never issued any form of unpaid fare notice or were not made the subject of any other report.

 

It is up to the prosecutor to prove otherwise to the satisfaction of the Court. If the Prosecutor has strong evidence such as a retained invalid ticket or photocard, a signature or other means of identity that was verified at the time, or other good evidence the OP will probably be convicted.

 

Now I'm not saying the the OP isn't being unnecessarily aggressive in the previous posts, nor that they may not still be found guilty, but it is not unheard of for a few cases to result in 'victim of impostor', which is why it's always so important to look at all the evidence from both sides before jumping to any conclusions. Perhaps it's worth looking at from a different perspective?

 

It is of course possible that the OP has now been traced to his correct address by the Court Enforcement Team only AFTER a case was proven in absence, but all previous letter were sent to a wrong address given by someone else and that is why the OP has never seen any of them. If the OP maintains a 'not-guilty' plea and there is no conclusive evidence tying the OP to the offence, a trial may be the only way of resolving the issue. If that hinges on positive identification by the member of staff making the report, many months after the original incident, a Court may not be inclined to convict.

 

The theory here is indeed correct. However, I find that in reality, the Magistrates' (certainly in the areas I operate) tend to place great emphasis on the defendant proving their innocence, rather than looking at my evidence (which is known to be, and is, usually of a reliable and high quality). I find that this is especially true towards the end of the day.

 

So what I am saying is that , although it is up to the prosecution to prove the offence to the satisfaction of the Court, the court is satisfied fairly (or very) easily in my experience, which sometimes mean I get some convictions I wouldn't have expected when my evidence has an issue (e.g. something missing).

[Halflfe2]

There can be no invalid ticket there can be no photocard or signature because I was never there.

 

Does no one understand that?

 

Why cannot I edit my earlier posts?I find this odd

 

I will never pay this company any money ever, because this error was not done by me. It is as simple as that I was not there they have no case.

 

That is the plain truth, anyway please can I delete this whole thread

 

I thought this was a different place, as I have never been in this situation perhaps its my fault the way I first appeared here but please can the administration delete or lock this thread. I would prefer deletion as I do not want what I have said in the public domain.

 

Thank you

 

Kind regards