HSBC Credit card PPI claim

[Thisthose33]

Hi there, I am new to this site, so I am not sure if i'm posting in the correct place or not. I was just wondering if anyone thought I had a leg to stand on with my PPI claim.

 

I have a credit card with HSBC and am ashamed to say that I didn't realise that I was paying PPI on it - I still am paying it. I've completed the questionnaire and posted it off to HSBC saying that I couldn't have been informed about it as I would have never taken it out and asked them to cancel it, but I was wondering do you think I have any case?

 

Or will they just say I should've checked it? I can't remember when I had the credit card first, but i've definitely had it for the 6 years that I keep hearing mentioned and the balance has been up as high as £8k, so i've definitely paid quite a lot in PPI.

 

I've had my first letter back from HSBC acknowledging receipt of it, but just wondering if anyone else had any any similar experience! I'd be grateful for any feedback! Thanks

Edited August 9, 2012 by citizenB
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[citizenB]

Hello,

 

You are in the correct forums

 

Have a read of the following links - when you sent in your request for refund, did you submit a spread sheet as well as hte FOS claim form ?

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?330996-Latest-Spreadsheets-PPI-Claims-and-Charges-Claims-Dec-2011

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?111-Payment-Protection-Insurance-(PPI)

[Thisthose33]

Thanks for replying. I have read some of the threads, but getting a little overwhelmed and confused by it all!I didn't submit a spreadsheet as I don't have all of the statements, so I don't know how much I have paid, or the balance on the card etc. The only ones I have are those online (i think it's the last 6 months worth). Do you think it may be a hopeless case?

[citizenB]

I think you just need to wait and see what they say. If their initial response is rejection, doesnt mean to say that you have to accept that decision at all. IF they do say no then you can challenge their reasons.

 

For instance, why would you not have taken out PPI ? Was it because you had other means of repaying the account if you were unwell - did you have a previous medical condition that would have prevented you claiming in most instances - were you self employed - uenmployed - retired ? There is a list of reasons for mis selling somewhere.. I will have a look and see if I can find it

 

The reason we suggest you send Subject Access Request to the bank first, is to obtain the statements - then you can complete the spread sheet. This is just to ensure that you have some idea of what to expect in the cheque

 

Trust in the banks has diminished considerably.. so it is always nice to double check things now

 

Just out of interest, how old is the account ? It is likely you would only receive 6 years worth of statements from HSBC as they appear to routinely destroy anything over 6 years !

[Thisthose33]

Thanks again for replying. I have no idea how old the account is, so resigned to the fact that if I get anything it would only be 6 years worth. For some reason I can't really remember applying for the card, but I have a feeling I did it by post - would that have ever happened? It's a 'gold' card and I seem to think I was 'upgraded' to it. Again though, would that have happened?I've been in full time employment with since I was 19 so that's the earliest I would have had the card (1998), and have sick cover etc with my job, so I would never have taken the PPI as I would have had 6 months full pay and 6 months half pay if I was ever ill and unable to work.Like you say, I guess I just have to wait and see. I just wondered if the fact that I was still paying the PPI (stupidly I admit) meant that it could be more straightforward case as they can't dispute it??Thanks!

[citizenB]

Strangely enough, it could be that you never did apply for the card. Midland/HSBC around 1998 were a little foolish and sent quite a few people Credit cards without ever having a formal agreement in place I know, I was one of them. So if you never did apply for the card/sign an agreement, then it is quite possible you didnt apply for the PPI !

 

There was also a time when not only HSBC, but other card providers as well, had a system whereby when you telephoned to activate the card.. or thought that is what you were doing.. you were signed up to PPI.. so you could have been caught in that. Unless you have data from HSBC, eg copy of an agreement (or not) or other proof that you did agree to the PPI then IMHO, they should simply repay you.

 

They could claim that you must have noticed it on the statements. Agreed, but then you could perhaps have assumed its appearance was mandatory .. !! There is no question you are paying it.. but if it is of no use to you and you dont/never wanted it. Then you should be refunded and the PPI cancelled

[Thisthose33]

Fingers crossed then! Thank you citizen B, you've been very helpful. I'll keep you posted on the outcome, which I presume will be in about 8 weeks time, as I had the response letter on Monday!Cheers!

[citizenB]

Yes, please keep us updated

[ims21]

Hi

 

Responding to your PM but I see CB has given you the best advice so nothing more to add at the moment.

 

ims

[Thisthose33]

Hi

 

Responding to your PM but I see CB has given you the best advice so nothing more to add at the moment.

 

ims

 

Yes thank you both very much! Much appreciated!

[Thisthose33]

Yes, please keep us updated

 

Hi there, I had my response 2 weeks ago, but have been on holiday. In summary the letter says:-'I regret that I am unable to support your complaint....our records show that in November 2004, you applied for a HSBC credit card. This card was protected by the optional cardholder repayment protector, which is designed to repay 10% of your outstanding credit card balance for a maximum of 12 months etc etc. At the time you purchased the cardholder repayment protector it was HSBCs process to provide you with a product information pack and a policy document etc'....it goes onto say I had 30 days to cancel it. I don't remember any of this!'Regrettably, due to the passing of time, the original application and credit agreement form have not been located by the branch. However, I can confirm that it is not bank procedure to issue insurance without the appropriate documentation being completed.'I guess I don't have any proof that they did mis-sel and they don't have any proof that they didn't. They say I could've cancelled the policy at any time and that was my responsibilty. Is this it for me now, or can I do anything else do you think?Thanks in anticipation!

[ims21]

They seem to suggest that the insurance was automatically included and it was the responsibility of the customer to opt out.

 

That is a no no.

 

I would write back and tell them so. In addition you can refer them to the FSA handbook which says that giving the option to cancel is, in itself, not sufficient reason to not uphold a claim.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?305682-FSA-Handbook

 

If they don't have copies of the documents how do they know what went on?

 

I would say this may be looking better for you.

[Thisthose33]

Oh that's good news. Thanks for your quick response. I am a bit concerned that their response was negative as my original application wasn't very strong. Is there somewhere I can find some wording to make my application a bit better?

[Thisthose33]

Also, sorry I forgot to say they've given me details of the ombudsman...should i reply to HSBC, or go direct to them?Thanks

[ims21]

If it were me I would challenge HSBC first.

[Thisthose33]

Thanks IMS. If I draft something, could I be really cheeky and ask you just to take a look at it for me?Many thanks

[ims21]

Yes (or someone will)...I'll be off to work shortly.

[Thisthose33]

Great thanks - I need all the help I can get.Thanks very much, have a good day in work!

[Thisthose33]

They seem to suggest that the insurance was automatically included and it was the responsibility of the customer to opt out.

 

That is a no no.

 

I would write back and tell them so. In addition you can refer them to the FSA handbook which says that giving the option to cancel is, in itself, not sufficient reason to not uphold a claim.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?305682-FSA-Handbook

 

If they don't have copies of the documents how do they know what went on?

 

I would say this may be looking better for you.

 

Can anyone tell me where in this document it says that giving the option to cancel is not sufficient reason to not updhold a claim? I want to quote the exact paragraph in my response but can't seem to find where it says this bit! Thanks!

[ims21]

Appendix 1

 

3.3.5 G The firm should not reject a complainant’s account of events solely on the basis

that the complainant signed documentation relevant to the purchase of the policy.

 

3.3.6 G The firm should not reject a complaint because the complainant failed to exercise

the right to cancel the policy.

 

 

You may also find that there are other useful bits in that Appendix which may be of use to you

[Thisthose33]

Blimey, your amazing! I have been scouring that document for ages now! Thank you!

[ims21]

 

Yes it is a bit of a read isn't it?

 

Mind you, there is an awful lot of useful stuff in there

[Thisthose33]

Yes it is very useful. Thanks.I have also just seen the following thread...BANKS are giving incorrect advice on PPI and the following statement'You must put them to strict proof that the records do not exist if they state they do not. This means you must insist they produce evidence of destruction of the documents certified by a registered data controller within their organisation as is required under the Civil Evidence Act 1995. This acts requires banks and other institutions to keep auditable records on documentation they hold and includes certification of destruction.'Do you think I should ask HSBC to do this?

[ims21]

Yes you can have a go.

 

They will baulk and you may not get it but part of the "game" is to make a pest of yourself to let them know that you are not just going to go away.

[Thisthose33]

Well lets give it a shot. i can be a right pain when I want to. I am struggling with this letter though, would you mind taking a look at my very rough draft..... Thanks!Dear Sir, Thankyou for your letter dated 26th September 2012. I am disappointed with your response for the reasons outlined below.Firstly, your letter suggests that the optional cardholder repayment protector was automatically included with the credit card and that it was my responsibility to cancel the policy within 30 days. I would like to refer you to Appendix 1 of the FSA handbook entitled ‘The assessment and redress of Payment Protection Insurance complaints, which states the following:3.3.5 G The firm should not reject a complainant’s account of events solely on the basis that the complainant signed documentation relevant to the purchase of the policy.3.3.6 G The firm should not reject a complaint because the complainant failed to exercise the right to cancel the policy. If my records have been destroyed then I ask for you to provide me with evidence of destruction of the documents certified by a registered data controller, as required under the Civil Evidence Act 1995. Secondly, if you do not have the paperwork expressing that I signed up for PPI insurance, then how can you be sure that I applied for it?I look forward to hearing from you and your reconsideration of this matter.