incapacity benefit and pension credit.

[askboy]

Hi everyone.

this post is regarding the title. Having been in recepit of p/credit as of today,19/07/12 i have enquired as to if you can cancel i/benefit and receive p/credit in full. Yes you cancel i/benefit, but you are still liable for a medical test the same if you receive p/credit in full. The moral of this is it`s no short cut to avoid being selected for the ATOS medical. This dreadfull penny pinching goverment is against all law abiding citizens, penalising us for not being able to work at all.

They sit in their ivory towers, thinking of their fabulous pensions to come,whilst making us suffer to the point of desperation. Just hang on in there and accept the test and see what the outcome is. The goverment states that a single person over 60 should not be expected to live on less than £140.00 p/wk, some joke eh. Either way we should not be worse off whether it be incapacity or pension credit. One word of warning though,if you claim p/credit in full, you will not receive N I contributions at all.

 

Cheers, Askboy:|

[antone]

Welcome to CAG. I've moved your thread to the Benefits forum, where it is most likely to receive responses.

[debt4get]

i know this may be a stupid question but, why should you have to attend a medical if you are claiming pension credit instead of IB? pension credit is an age related allowance, therefore unless ATOS are somehow going to rearrange when you were actually born, then what the hell would be the point?

[hensteeth]

Hi everyone.

this post is regarding the title. Having been in recepit of p/credit as of today,19/07/12 i have enquired as to if you can cancel i/benefit and receive p/credit in full. Yes you cancel i/benefit, but you are still liable for a medical test the same if you receive p/credit in full. The moral of this is it`s no short cut to avoid being selected for the ATOS medical.

 

For a start you cannot claim two means tested benefits at the same time. I know that isn't the case with you but it is worth mentioning - mainly for those receiving IS/IB & Income Based ESA.

 

I have been having this argument with both the Pension Service and the DWP for some time. The final answer came by way of a letter from the Pension Service that anybody who is currently on IB/ESA can close down that claim and claim everything as Pension Credit. My problem was because no one would confirm that if the ESA, in my case, was closed down, would I fall foul of the benefit deprivation rules. The letter goes on to say that deprivation of a benefit does not apply if you swap and change to Pension credit. Once that IB/ESA claim is closed you will not be subject to any further ATOS assessments.

So whoever told you that load of rubbish had better read their own rule book again.

 

This dreadfull penny pinching goverment is against all law abiding citizens, penalising us for not being able to work at all.

They sit in their ivory towers, thinking of their fabulous pensions to come,whilst making us suffer to the point of desperation. Just hang on in there and accept the test and see what the outcome is. The goverment states that a single person over 60 should not be expected to live on less than £140.00 p/wk, some joke eh. Either way we should not be worse off whether it be incapacity or pension credit.

 

You will not be worse off! If you choose to stay on IB and then move over to ESA you will get a 'top up' by Pension Credit. If one goes down, the other goes up to keep you at the correct level of income.

 

One word of warning though,if you claim p/credit in full, you will not receive N I contributions at all.

 

Totally correct, but most people by the time they get to 61 already have the max contributions for the State Pension anyhow.

 

 

Cheers, Askboy:|

 

That is a subject that is very close to my heart. You are right, it seems that no one at the DWP wants anybody to cancel their IB/ESA/JSA. They will never advise you how to get an easier life for the same level of income.

Who wants to jump through the hoops of ESA/ESA when they have no intention of working again or are to ill to work?

 

If I was you just to satisfy your own mind, get hold of CAB and tell them the story as you have posted it on here. They will laugh and tell you that it is quite common for the DWP to not know their own rules and that you are quite entitled to put your feet up now and watch daytime telly without having to have any of their ridiculous medicals or comply with their equally ridiculous Jobseeker Agreements including having to go on these 'Workfare' schemes.

 

Get all of your money from Pension Credit and enjoy it.

 

On a personal note, I voluntarily apply for ESA and get a Pension Credit top up. Why? Because I think it is the right thing to do - to prove to them that I am unable to work even though I have no intention of doing so! I have already retired from the Civil Service 3 years ago and turned down the offer of part time working.

 

I'm 63 now and have just under two years to go before I am 65 and get kicked off ESA permanently (too old it seems!) So for the next two years I have every intention of making ATOS and the DWP's life as miserable and confusing as I can. If in the meantime I can get them to rack up £1,000's in admin costs and ensure that they comply with their regulations to the letter via my MP so much the better!

 

As you may gather I do have a personal problem with the DWP. They might have won a small battle at the start, 3 years ago, but by God, I'll win the damn war!

Edited July 19, 2012 by hensteeth

[jackieandwayne]

Good for you hensteeth. This Govt won;t be satisfied until every sick/disabled person in this country has been dealt with and treated like Boxer the horse.

[debt4get]

this is more confusing by the moment, so can someone please explain, i thought in order to claim pension credit, you had to be of retirement age. my wife was 60 last feb, i am 57 she is on IB i am on esa ©. now obviously instead of jumping through atos hoops it would be easier if she could claim for us both on pension credit, but i am told she is too young..

[Nystagmite]

It's gone up to 61 now.

[count orlok]

I was claiming IB and my wife retired from work. She started getting pension credit for the both of us. When the time cam for me to migrate to ESA I was going to stop claiming sickness benefit and just get a top up on pension credits.

 

I told the guy on the phone this was what i wanted to do but he tried to talk me out of it. I've paid enough stamps for a full pension. As it happened I got put in the support group, plus i have an underlying entitlement to carers allowance. If I fail the next ESA50 assessmsnt I shall not even bother with a WCA, I'll just go on carers allowance and get an increase in pension credit.

 

I certainly don't want to be risking Universal Credit at my time (and condition) of life. From what I have read if you are one of the benefits that are changing (such as ESA WRAG after a year) you will no longer be entitled to PC as UC takes president; a couple on UC is entitled to less than a single person on PC.

 

I feel so sorry for the young in this country, I fear we are witnessing the end of the welfare state and the NHS.

Edited July 19, 2012 by count orlok

[debt4get]

thank you nys..

[hensteeth]

I was claiming IB and my wife retired from work. She started getting pension credit for the both of us. When the time cam for me to migrate to ESA I was going to stop claiming sickness benefit and just get a top up on pension credits.

 

I told the guy on the phone this was what i wanted to do but he tried to talk me out of it. I've paid enough stamps for a full pension. As it happened I got put in the support group, plus i have an underlying entitlement to carers allowance. If I fail the next ESA50 assessmsnt I shall not even bother with a WCA, I'll just go on carers allowance and get an increase in pension credit.

 

Yes they will try their hardest to keep you on ESA - they have more control of your life - they do it to those who are claiming JSA as well!

 

I certainly don't want to be risking Universal Credit at my time (and condition) of life. From what I have read if you are one of the benefits that are changing (such as ESA WRAG after a year) you will no longer be entitled to PC as UC takes president; a couple on UC is entitled to less than a single person on PC.

 

That is how I read it to. Those that are on PC already stay on it, those that aren't for whatever reason, they will be limited to UC. Yes the UC award will be less than the PC one with the same circumstances!

 

I feel so sorry for the young in this country, I fear we are witnessing the end of the welfare state and the NHS

 

So do I!! I would hate to be of 'working age' - currently below 61, and have all of this uncertainty around.

 

.

 

I made sure, like you are thinking, of getting onto Pension Credit before these changes come about.

 

They have already stitched me up with my forecasted State Pension.

 

Five years or so ago, I received a forecast of what my State Pension would be in 'today's' money - £212.34 a week.

This year I have had another forecast (because of the changes that were made to reduce the number of years required to get a full pension) it now shows £168.56 a week!!!

 

Why the drop I asked. I was told that in order to pay for the reduced number of years for some people, some people have had to take a reduction in their entitlement under the SERPS/2nd Pension entitlement. It has cost me £44 a week so that others could retire on a full pension with only 30 years of contributions! But I earned that extra pension because of the salary I was on - tough!!

 

Many more are in this boat and don't know about what has happened. They call it 're-distribution'!!!

[count orlok]

You're lucky, my forecast is only £114. Got another 12 years to go, wife is a little older than me, so if the unthinkable happens, with the bedroom tax and lose of DLA my income will drop so low I won't even have enough to pay utility bills let alone eat. The thought of what could happen is too bad to even contemplate. I've accepted I'll lose my DLA, at least my wife will keep hers. Plus I worry about the demise of the NHS; I need expensive heart surgery every couple of years to keep me alive so I am very very worried.

[debt4get]

same here, i too resigned to losing my dla, car etc, they are determined to literally starve us to death.. as i have said on other threads, i thank previous govt's for my dla, but if it goes, it goes, i no longer care much about myself, i worry for my kids and grandkids, who have to make their way in this uncaring us and them society. i have only 8 years to go to retirement, if i make it that far....

[count orlok]

Well I have been very thankfull for my DLA, got it when Major was in. Had a Rover 100, a Polo, a Golf, a Mazda 6 and now an Insignia (mind you I did run an S class Merc before). I don't use the car so much these days (partly on purpose so as not to rely on it), so i think I'll be OK staying in all the time, the lose of care allowance will be a bit worse, but i know I am a lot better off than many because of my wife's status.

 

Me thinks the UK car industry is going to be damaged as well, I don't think ex servicement (who will be exempt from PIP assessmsnts) and Pensioners (who will keep their DLA) will get enough cars to replace what the scheme buys now, to say nothing of the damage done when 500,000 cars are returned mid lease.

[Nystagmite]

Me thinks the UK car industry is going to be damaged as well, I don't think ex servicement (who will be exempt from PIP assessmsnts) and Pensioners (who will keep their DLA) will get enough cars to replace what the scheme buys now, to say nothing of the damage done when 500,000 cars are returned mid lease.

 

Which is going to mean that more people are unemployed and more will be claiming JSA.

[count orlok]

Which is going to mean that more people are unemployed and more will be claiming JSA.

 

That's just what we need, more scroungers living of the back of the tax payer

[debt4get]

That's just what we need, more scroungers living of the back of the tax payer

exactly...us over 55's scroungers are being inundated with job offers daily!!!!...NOT

[hensteeth]

No DLA award is safe! Those over 65 will eventually have to go over to PIP, either when they are migrated after the 16 - 65 bunch have had their re-assessments or when they notify any changes. Those under 16 will eventually be over 16.

 

I can even see Attendance Allowance going the same way as it does not make sense to have two similar benefits running side by side for years.

 

We have had a good run so far, but the time to re-assess abilities and the need for caring has to come about in the light of the new medication and treatments that are now available that weren't there when DLA/AA was first mooted!

[eliotnpt]

I thought I would add a bit at the bottom of this thread and bounce it back up because there does still seem to be problems with moving from ESA to Pension Credit. My own Pension Credit claim is going through and will be active from May based up on my birthday. No problem there at all. That gives me just a couple of weeks until I am 62 followed by another couple of weeks before PC entitlement takes place.

And what happens? I get an "invitation" to attend for yet another face-to-face assessment to see if I am capable of working (presently on ESA Support Group) and, no doubt, get me to register as unemployed for a 2 or 3 week period should I fail the assessment.

I have been told that the invitation will be delayed for a few weeks because they gave me an incorrect time slot but they have no intention of cancelling it.

Looks like someone is desperate to make a few last pounds before I disappear from ESA and move to PC.