Preparing for the dreaded ESA changeover

[reallymadwoman]

Due to start in my area in February.

 

Currently I get long term IB, high care and low mobility DLA, so I'm exempt from medicals. My DLA is due for renewal in February (before recent changes, it would almost certainly have then been awarded for life) so the forms should be here sometime next month, and I'm anticipating that DWP may do the medical for ESA at the same time. On the other hand, I may be lucky and get the DLA claim renewed first.

 

I should get the 15 points necessary to get ESA, but I doubt I'll end up in the support group even though it's patently obvious to anyone who knows me that I cannot work. However, on the basis that thorough preparation is never a waste of time I'm starting now and keeping a diary of events in case it might help someone else through the process.

 

My first step has been to dig out the copies I kept of the last DLA renewal form. Unfortunately, I didn't keep a copy of the first form and since I've never had to appeal I don't have copies of any medical evidence that was submitted for that one. They didn't ask for any evidence for the renewal, just took my word for it that I wasn't any better.

 

However, all is not lost. This link Data Protection - DWP takes you to the form to send to DWP for a subject access request, for which they don't charge. I'm hoping they've kept all my paperwork and they can send me copies.

 

The reason I'm asking for copies of medical evidence is that I'm now fairly stable so only see my (new) GP if there's a specific problem and only see the consultant once a year for a review, so it won't be easy to get medical evidence from someone who knows me well. Since my conditions do not get better (unless ATOS believe in miracles, which wouldn't entirely surprise me) I'm hoping that even old medical evidence will carry some weight.

 

DWP's paperwork should be here mid September, when I can consider the next step, which might involve making a nuisance of myself at the GP so he could give me some evidence.

[deathbycrayons]

I can't be of much help, but just wanted to say that I'm in a similar situation with regards to only seeing my GP occasionally now. I'm very worried about this changeover but hopefully we'll get what is right for us and nothing will change. Good luck to you.

[reallymadwoman]

I think there must be a lot of people with long term conditions which are relatively stable who don't bother their GP over every little thing - I rarely bother even for flare ups since I'm now so used to managing them and have the necessary drugs available.

However, we may be doing ourselves a disservice since what can my new GP write if asked for a report? He can list conditions and the drugs I take (at least he'll know how often I get repeat prescriptions!) but that's about it. If we know we're going to need evidence, then perhaps we'd better start complaining more and managing less! I used to get support from occupational health who were ideal for supporting DLA applications, but they've now done all they can to help and I stopped seeing them 2 years ago.

 

Conclusion - getting on with things as best you can may give the impression you no longer need help!

[stalin's dead]

I have epilepsy and when i have fits I see little point in telling my GP., What can he do? Nothing. I take my anti-convulsants yet my epilepsy continues.

 

I failed my ESA medical this morning and now have appealed.

 

I think the DWP/ATOS are more interested in 'recorded episodes' but i could be telling lies to my GP. How would he know anyway? The doc only knows what i tell him

 

it seems ATOS/DWP are removing people from ESA whether they like it or not and in the face of medical evidence

[reallymadwoman]

Well the Data Protection Act request to the DWP seemed like a good idea. The only problem is that their 40 days were up today and I've heard nothing, so it's a chasing letter next.

 

I haven't had the renewal forms for my DLA either, which is a bit unusual. I wouldn't have submitted them until January anyway since I will not qualify for any more DLA so there's no point giving them any opportunity to reduce it before I absolutely have to.

[sj01]

They have to comply to your request. Report the DWP to the Information Cmmissioners Office.

There is a complaint form on the web site for the ICO.

[reallymadwoman]

I sent them a reminder this afternoon, by hand via my daughter, so I suppose I ought to give them the 14 days I said I would first.

[loopinlouie]

I am another epileptic who doesnt go to doccies and report every fit, more paranoid they would worry about me being a single mum. I told kids recently unless not breathing, dont call for help and just let me sleep and we get along. Since they messed up my meds by twice in last 18 months not increasing my meds in line with epilepsy nurses letters I decided not to bother going to hospital check up last time. It was getting embaressing, is medication working? NO We will increase dose and see how you are in six months. Doccies dont increase dose inline with hospital letters and six months later nurse asks is medication working? NO still on old dose, why etc...... I will sort it out she says. Year later still on old dose.

 

My attitude till recently was to live and let lie as I cant deal with the hastle, but maybe due to esa change over I should keep visising doccies say hey I am still fitting seriously and why are my meds not sorted, politely of course. It would at least be on my record also and maybe we like me should all be visiting our doccies and updating them xxxx

 

I fully expect to fail the test especially reading higher comment who also has epilepsy. Probably consider me sparked out on floor and available for work. To be honest as sympathetic as my last employer was at first, it soon changed as I couldnt be relied on for shifts, they would ring why was I not at work and either me or ex answer she has just recovered from fit and the last answer was 'she sounds peed'

 

I had bit all the way through my tongue. From that point I felt uncomfy in work and others didnt want me working near them arguing I made mistakes as my memory was failing. Sad but at least we all can sound off and be prepared for this unjust change over and all go to appeal xxxx:-)

 

ps. really mad woman, diary is an excellent idea, we should all do it. I know i will get some points for mental health also, but to be honest again I have missed appts due to them giving me new person everytime and fed up of repeating myself, no doubt atos take it as dont need help now, hhmm not fair xx

Edited September 9, 2010 by loopinlouie

[reallymadwoman]

I think we should all keep a diary - one of the things they ask in the medical is about a typical day, what you do, where you go etc and even something like saying you watch TV can be used to 'prove' you can concentrate and sit comfortably etc. I've also started going to the GP over every new symptom ....

[loopinlouie]

Problem with wind and I will be there hovering around his office:madgrin:

 

Seriously though as much as I hate going and I recently got offended by reception as well looks like I should go xx

 

I do like these smilies xx

[ANDYANDFLO]

You are all probably right. I had to claim ESA last October but alas I failed the medical. It seems that over 80% of all applicants do not get beyond 'GO' & collect the money!

What you are saying about not bothering your doctor with every ailment, twinge, cough & pain is very true. I 'ducked' out of the docs in 2004, because I had had enough. I also gave up my 'lifetime' care & mobility claim just to feel 'normal'.

 

I then had to go back into the system for something else, and even now, I don't go back when I should. What is the point, I have everything at home I need, medication wise so look after myself. I do go to see the Consultants only because they keep on wanting to open me up again to take something else out!

 

So I was having a hell of a job getting the evidence together for the ESA appeal. How can you get a medical opinion if you don't report each and every problem?

 

I have had so many people trying to help me, most of the charities you can think of and more besides, that it became a full time job, something that I wasn't fit or able to continue with. Unfortunately the last straw was to be told that the appeal hearing wasn't going to be heard until at least March 2011. I appealed in January 2010!! I just gave up after that, and claimed JSA even though I know and all of my medical team know, that that is not an option. Still, I can put my files away now (all 12 of them!).

It is a fact that if you don't have a consistent and complete medical record you are lost before you start. I have also recently tried to get my DLA back, but that was scuppered - so another one bites the dust.

[reallymadwoman]

I've had all my info from DWP, but there's next to no medical evidence. They have one report from occupation health from 6 years ago, which really said very little, and that's it. Both renewals since have gone through based on my evidence alone. Am I just lucky, or has someone with a brain realised that I'm not actually going to get better so why waste time getting medical reports?

 

I've also had the renewal forms for DLA. From past experience I'll get a reminder in about a month (still 3 months before the current award expires) but I'm not going to submit them for another two months after that. So long as the form arrives before the renewal date there won't be any break in payment (assuming DLA is still awarded), but if it's less than a month before I am of course running the risk that payments will be delayed whilst it goes through.

 

I'm also waiting to hear what effect this new universal benefit will have on the ESA changeover. If they plan to bring it in fairly quickly, then there can't be much point changing everyone over to ESA now only to have to change them over again in a year or two.

[notlim]

Hi. I live North of Inverness and i have just received a IB50 from Atos although the DWP advised me a couple years ago that i did not need to fill in any more forms or have Medicals as my Conditions are Degenerate and i already meet all the requirements for IB. They also wrote that they may write to my Doctor again if my Incapacity changes.

Last time they sent my Doctor an IB133 to complete to determine that my condition had not improved and that i was still exempt from the PCA which is the reason i was sent the letter to tell me i did not need to send any more forms or have medicals. This has been Standard Practice since October 2008 i believe. I have checked with my Doctor's Practice and they have not received an IB113.

I am also 64 years old and will be at Pension age (if i live) in 10 months time. I receive my Pension Application form in May.

Could anyone tell me if this document- employment_and_support_allowance_regs.pdf from the DWP

is up to date as it states that

existing incapacity benefits claimants (those on incapacity benefit, severe disablement allowance and income support on disability grounds) will be reassessed under the employment and support allowance (ESA) Work Capability Assessment (WCA) instead of the Personal Capability Assessment.

I also states that..

"People who reach State Pension Age during the migration period 2010-2013/14 will not be migrated to avoid having to change benefits twice in a short period."

 

The disabilityalliance.org website says the same thing and adds

IB migration trials are due to start in Aberdeen and Burnley from October 2010 using a sample of 1,700 claimants. DA's understanding is that these will be handled clerically, which means that DWP computer software will not be used or tested until full migration starts.

I don't understand why i have been sent this IB50. It has not been sent by the DWP. It has been sent by Atos with instructions to send it back "Only" to them. (NOT the DWP)

I have just been awarded DLA by the DWP and receive Pension Credit from the Pension Service which is a part of the DWP. I am classed as Pensioner-Single by Housing Benefit.

I don't know what to do or who i should talk to but as i said, i am not in Aberdeen or Burnley so i am not part of a Trial.

When are "People who reach State Pension Age during the migration period 2010-2013/14" NOT "People who reach State Pension Age during the migration period 2010-2013/14" ???

ps. I could type a post as long as this, from my bed, maybe three times a week as long as i time it for the hour in between the doses of painkillers.

Maybe i am capable of working in an imaginary job ? Would i have to notify Atos if i die ?

[whatsupdoc]

Hi im not up on benefits just cant keep up with the Changes. Its true that if you reach retirement age between 2010/2014 you will not be migrated to ESA but to Pension.

I see you claim Pension Credit and in that respect you do not need to attend Work Foused Interviews. Also but im not sure medicals are Voluntary for someone like yourself? You can give up IB and claim it as Pension Credit but i dont know how that works its something i want to do myself. Ive turned Sixty earlier this year and went from Income Support to Pension credit..

Wish you luck. If i get further info i will let you know?

whatsupdoc

[reallymadwoman]

What rate of DLA do you get, for care and mobility?

 

Are you effectively housebound?

 

Are you still claiming Incapacity Benefit?

[notlim]

What rate of DLA do you get, for care and mobility?

 

Are you effectively housebound?

 

Are you still claiming Incapacity Benefit?

 

Hello reallymadwoman

 

Thank you for answering.

1) I receive middle rate care and lower rate mobility.

2) Yes. I only go out to go to a Doctor or Dentist but someone has to collect me and help me into and out of the vehicle and Surgery's.

2) Yes i still am claiming and receive Incapacity Benefit. My claim was automatically carried on from April this year (I have the Standard letter telling me my the new rates for this year and to notify them if my circumstances change etc, and no one has written to me to tell me any different. I would have thought that if i was due to be reassesses my Doctor would have received a IB113 before the start of this years claims ??

The DWP will have all the information of my Conditions which are "Degenerate". Maybe these ATOS people believe in "Regeneration". Maybe they can give me a Bionic Spine and Heart and Legs ?

[notlim]

Hi im not up on benefits just cant keep up with the Changes. Its true that if you reach retirement age between 2010/2014 you will not be migrated to ESA but to Pension.

I see you claim Pension Credit and in that respect you do not need to attend Work Foused Interviews. Also but im not sure medicals are Voluntary for someone like yourself? You can give up IB and claim it as Pension Credit but i dont know how that works its something i want to do myself. Ive turned Sixty earlier this year and went from Income Support to Pension credit..

Wish you luck. If i get further info i will let you know?

whatsupdoc

 

Thanks whatsupdoc.

[reallymadwoman]

So far as I can tell, you are not exempt from medicals which is why you have received an IB50. You will have to complete it and return it and you may have to have a medical, but get a letter from your doctor to make them come to you.

[loan_ranger]

Hi notlim, to put your mind at ease, even if you fail the PCA, or, if you should go onto JSA for another reason, you can claim pension credit due to your age instead of JSA and with pension credit you'll receive a top-up to bring your income up to £132.60 if you are single. The qualifying age for men is the same as a woman born the same year. Many "jobseekers" over the age of 60 have moved from JSA to pension credit often on advice from JCP that they will be better off and also won't have to be actively seeking work under a jobseeker's agreement (which is true). N.B. The pension age is gradually being raised between now and 2020. State Pension age calculator

The increased income probably means that your HB will be reduced by 65% of all income above the HB personal allowances + disability premium figure, therefore you'll only be 35p in the pound better off as a consequence, I could be wrong about this so try the figures using an on-line calculator or check with your local councils HB section.

Check your eligibility for housing benefit

 

Find your local authority

 

To check your eligibility for housing benefit you first need to identify the appropriate local authority. Please choose from the options below, enter your details and click 'Go'. This service is only available in England.

(direct.gov) Do it online

 

 

 

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Get benefit advice, for you/your family or for someone else. Simply answer questions anonymously online about your savings, income and outgoings.

 

DWP and HMRC benefits

Alternative "benefits search" c/o "Turn to us"

Edited October 18, 2010 by loan_ranger
inserted link to State Pension age calculator

[reallymadwoman]

Thanks for the clarification loan_ranger.

 

Since you're here, could you have a go at answering a question for me. Assuming my DLA claim is successfully renewed and I am awarded ESA after the changeover, can I export either or both to France if I go to live there?

 

Since the chances of me being in the support group for ESA are zero, how on earth would I carry out 'work related activities' from France, assuming that it can be exported?

[loan_ranger]

Re. DLA, I'm fairly certain that this can be "exported", re. ESA I don't know how this will work out but I saw this on the CAB site

Benefits abroad

 

If you are getting a benefit for sickness or disability and you want to know what will happen to your benefit if you go abroad, you can ring the Benefits Enquiry Line.

If you move to another European Economic Area (EEA) country or Switzerland, you may be able to carry on getting the care component of Disability Living Allowance, Attendance Allowance or Carer's Allowance. Also if you are living in one of these countries, you may be able to claim one of these benefits for the first time. This is called exporting the benefit. If you are interested in doing this, you should contact a member of the exportability team at the Department for Work and Pensions.

You can get more information about claiming these benefits if you are moving or living abroad on the Directgov website at: www.direct.gov.uk.

The website will tell you how to contact the exportability team.

EEA countries are the European Union countries and Liechtenstein, Iceland and Norway.

To find out which countries are in the European Union, go to The European Union.

If you are considering going abroad, you can also consult an experienced adviser, for example, at a Citizens Advice Bureau. To search for details of your nearest CAB, including those that can give advice by email, click on nearest CAB.

Edited October 18, 2010 by loan_ranger
inserted DLA link to CAB advice guide

[reallymadwoman]

Thanks for that. I have a suspicion that I can keep the DLA but I'll lose the IB/ESA. It may not be a problem for quite a while yet though.

[loan_ranger]

Thanks for that. I have a suspicion that I can keep the DLA but I'll lose the IB/ESA. It may not be a problem for quite a while yet though.

Re. IB/ESA abroad, the best person to ask is cloe who lives in Spain if we want to get a handle on the practicalities. She has some seriously high powered lawyers on-board and has been (by her advocates) advised to keep quiet (to prevent prejudice undermining the judicial process) Her I.B. was refused but is probably going to be restored, so I.B. looks safe, ESA is still an unknown.

Maybe you'll have to apply for the French version out of work sickness/disability benefit?

[ErikaPNP]

The care component of DLA can continue to be received in France, but not the mobility component.

 

IB and contributory based ESA can also be received abroad, but income related ESA cannot.

[reallymadwoman]

Thank you Erika - it seems I may be OK after all. It's quite important, since if I take my 'disability' benefits with me, I automatically qualify for free medical insurance in France, if not, the cheapest I have been quoted is £150 a month.

 

It does seem a bit odd that you can export DLA care but not mobility.