Tax credit fraud want to confess

[bmjt]

hi ev1

hope someome can please help me, back ground i was working full time at a very good job well paid about £25k i feel pregnant had my son who i love dearly in 2007 wilst i was on maternity leave i started claiming wtc and ctc with was around the £100 make a week, i looked in to childcare cost for my son found a nursery and got help with the cost around a £100 a week when i went back to work i only went back 3 days as it is very long hour sometimes 60 plus, now this is when i get stupid i was paying £125 nursery fees, when i went back to work got my first wage it was half i used to get a shock to the system stupidly i got behind on a few bills, this is when i started using some of the childcare cost to pay other things i no so silly but it seemed so easy but i new it was wrong as time went on it just got harder and harder to stop things, i finaly stop claiming all benefits in oct 09 when my partner moved in with me he knows nothing about this im now on maternity leave again from work and due to give birth in 5 weeks the stress i have been under due to my stupidity i haven't had a good nights sleep in months. i feel so guilty and have wanted to confess but am so scared of what will happen the amount is around £7k not sure think it's less, i want to pay back every pennie but don't know how to go about doing this or who to call please can someone help.

[ErikaPNP]

Is it the childcare element of working tax credit, and you were claiming for more than you were actually paying to the childcare provider?

 

If this is the case, contact tax credit on 0845 300 3900 (8am to 8pm) and explain that you were claiming more than you ought to have claimed for that period. They will take you through the process from there. They will likely send you a schedule for repayment of what was overpaid. Make sure that you tell them that for some of the time your son was actually in childcare and you were paying for this, so that they understand that you did not claim all of the childcare costs fraudulently.

 

Tax credits and Social security both deal with these types of cases very differently. I'll amend the title of your thread.

[bmjt]

Thanks erika just don't no what to do, do u think I could face prison I'm so scared but need to get this sorted, I'm worried I'll lose my job too thank you for any advice really need it x

[ErikaPNP]

If it had been a Social Security benefit then prosecution would be inevitable for 7K of fraud. But it's tax credit, not social security.

 

Tax credit use civil rather than criminal investigation wherever possible. I can't say whether or not they will want to prosecute; only they can answer that question. Whether you would be sent to prison would depend on a court, and again is only a possibility if they decide to prosecute.

 

But with Tax credit, they do appear to be more accomodating when a person ownes up of their own free will and co-operates fully in providing all information HMRC ask for to work out the overpayment (known as a full disclosure). In most cases I have come across where a person owns up without any prompting, they guide the person through the process, work out the overpayment and send out a payment schedule.

 

They only tend to use criminal investigation in serious cases like those below:

 

 

• In cases of organised criminal gangs attacking the tax system or systematic frauds where losses represents a serious threat to the tax base, including conspiracy;
  
• Where an individual holds a position of trust or responsibility;
  
• Where materially false statements are made or materially false documents are provided in the course of a civil investigation;
  
• Where, pursuing an avoidance scheme, reliance is placed on a false or altered document or such reliance or material facts are misrepresented to enhance the credibility of a scheme;
  
• Where deliberate concealment, deception, conspiracy or corruption is suspected;
  
• In cases involving the use of false or forged documents;
  
• In cases involving importation or exportation breaching prohibitions and restrictions;
  
• In cases involving money laundering with particular focus on advisors, accountants, solicitors and others acting in a ‘professional’ capacity who provide the means to put tainted money out of reach of law enforcement;
  
• Where the perpetrator has committed previous offences / there is a repeated course of unlawful conduct or previous civil action;
  
• In cases involving theft, or the misuse or un lawful destruction of HMRC documents;
  
• Where there is evidence of assault on, threats to, or the impersonation of HMRC officials;
  
• Where there is a link to suspected wider criminality, whether domestic or international, involving offences not under the administration of HMRC.
  

Like I said, far different to Social Security fraud cases.

[bmjt]

Thank u again this will sound very dumb of me but what is the difference between social security fraud and tax credit fraud do u think I should get a solicitor now or wait and see what happens x

[antone]

Thank u again this will sound very dumb of me but what is the difference between social security fraud and tax credit fraud do u think I should get a solicitor now or wait and see what happens x

 

Social security benefits are paid by the DWP (Department for Work and Pensions). These would include Income Support, Jobseeker's Allowance, Disability Living Allowance and several others.

 

Tax Credits are paid by HMRC (Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs, or what used to be known as the Inland Revenue). They pay Working Tax Credit, Child Tax Credit and also Child Benefit.

 

Although both are government departments, they operate independently and take different approaches when it comes to dealing with overpayments and fraud.

[ErikaPNP]

It's entirely up to you whether or not to use a solicitor. Personally I wouldn't for now, not until I found out whether they were going the civil route or the criminal route. If they go down the criminal route, yes get a solicitor. If they go down the civil route, see what the overpayment is, and you work with them to arrange a payment plan. You don't need a solicitor for a payment plan - but you should make sure the repayments are affordable (CAB/Welfare Rights/National Debtline can help with this).

 

Antone has given a description of the difference between SS and HMRC - spot on

[bmjt]

Thank you both for taking the time to reply, I know no one can say what the outcome will be but from ur experience any guesses what will happen I just want to get this sorted my health is suffering due to my being an ideot, I feel so ashamed by my actions

[ErikaPNP]

In my experience of people commiting this type of tax credit fraud, following full (voluntary) disclosure, tax credit work out the overpayment and send out a payment schedule. No further action except a note on your tax credit record that you have committed fraud before.

[bmjt]

Again thanx for taking the time to reply the number u gave in ur first reply if I call that on Monday morning how do I go about telling them do I say that have committed fraud? Do I need all the payment info such as how much has been payed to the childcare coz I don't know how much will they check? Also I received a tax credit annual review for for last year as everyone has but have not sent this off as I didn't want to implicate myself further I just want to tell the truth, u also said I could talk to cab this is very hard to do where I live as there always so busy is there someone els I can talk to about this just need to be sure I do this right and as soon as possible

[ErikaPNP]

That number is the generic helpline number. They will take the information from you that you have been claiming what you shouldn't have and refer it to the compliance department who will write to you asking for disclosure.

 

Tell them (on the telephone) what you actually paid each week to your childcare provider, and for approximately how long you claimed more than you should have.

 

When compliance write to you they will likely ask you to provide receipts for the childcare that you did pay. They may or they may not do this - they may accept what you tell them if you are absolutely sure of the payments and the time period you misclaimed for.

 

If they do request this information and you don't have receipts but have other proof of payment - for example, I don't pay cash, I pay by standing order so I'd send my bank statement to show the payments made to my childcare provider. They might also ask for your childcare contract. If you do not have proof of your payments or a contract, you can contact your childcare provider at that time to obtain this information and forward it on, or, they can contact the provider to get the information. They will need this information in order to calculate the overpayment.

 

I wish you had told me yesterday that you hadn't sent the renewal.

 

In regard to your annual renewal, the time limit for getting this in ends today (you can renew by phone). If you don't renew by today, your claim will stop immediately and you will have to repay the entire award, not just the childcare costs you misclaimed. It is imperitive that you renew on time otherwise you will end up repaying everything from April 09.

The helpine is open seven days a week from 8am to 8pm.

 

So you can contact them today.

 

Talking to the CAB I recommended specifially for the repayment plan if there are problems paying the amount back at what tax credit state they want, to work out what you can reasonably afford. Tax credit will send you a payment schedule telling you what to pay and how often. If you can't afford they amount they want and need to lower the repayments, they can also work this out for you - in which case they will send you an income and expenditure form.The national debtline and other agencies can help with this free of charge, or you can do it yourself to work out how much you can pay. This will come much later, once they have got all the information and worked out the overpayment.

 

If you do happen to live in Scotland anywhere near me, I can be there with you when you phone, if you like, to support you and help you with any questions they may ask.

[bmjt]

I don't live near you wish I did for the support. I'll call them today just trying to get up the nerves to do it, I don't have anything with regards to how much I have paid to the childcare I paid on my debit card, do i tell them how much i think i've been overpaid its just a guess, do i tell them i've been overpaid or that i've committed frand,I'm so scared

[ErikaPNP]

Tell them that you are calling to renew your claim. That you realise the time limit is today but you didn't update them when your circumstances changed in regard to childcare and as a result you have been overpaid, and the stress of knowing this has prevented you from contacting them sooner as you were afraid of repercussions.

 

They will ask for how long. Tell them when your childcare and the costs reduced, and what they reduced to.

 

Compliance will be in touch with you (most likely in writing) in due course. As you have paid by debit card you should be able to provide bank statements if they do request them. Your bank will send these to you for a fee, if you don't keep them. If you have online banking you may be able to get the historic statements online and print them off yourself.

 

My bank charged me £5 for a years worth of statements.

 

Once compliance have the information they need, they will work out the overpayment and send you a payment schedule.

 

When you call, this is the helpline. They will only take details from you. They do not make the decisions in regard to overpayment and should be relatively ok to talk to, they shouldn't ask why you did what you did or anything like that.

 

I have to nip out for a bit with my children, but I'll be back later on if you need to talk any further. In the meantime, there are others here who will support you.

[ErikaPNP]

I meant to say, I'll be back 6pm at the latest. If you want to tell me what time you plan calling, I will be with you online (since I can't be there personally) when you call, if you like.

 

Catch up with you later on

 

Erika.

[bmjt]

Im working up the nerve to do it, I'm so scared if it wasn't for my son and the baby due in 5 weeks I think I would have done something stupid to myself I can't believe just how much I have let myself and my family down, I'm 30 yes old and have been getting chest pains because of what I have done, thank you for helping me I'll let u no how I get on after I call them, just wish I new what I was doing or saying as it very vage on the time scale and I don't have proof of how much I have paid and how much I could owe

[Mr lex]

Hi bmjt,

 

You have not let your family down, you were just trying to do the best by them, like all mums do. OK it was a mistake and we all make them. You will not have to say how much you think you have overclaimed now, that will come later, the most important thing now is to keep within the time limits.

Please pick up the phone and start to put this right, they wont bite

 

Lex

[bmjt]

thank erika and mr lex

gonna call them soon, do u have any idea how long these things go on for just feell like my life is on hold got my baby due on the 3rd sep i should be over joyed but can't with the worry of what i've done, i have been looking on this site for a few months trying to read other peoples storys that are in the same kind of trouble not never seem to be an outcome i.e if they had to repay it back and prosicution, just want my life back

[Mr lex]

I'm sure Erika can suggest a timetable, but it will veary from area to area.

When you ring them, all you are doing is telling them there's a problem. Thats good for your case, they havn't found you out !!

Please ring them and start to free yourself from the worry, their only people after all.

 

Regards,

 

Lex

[joeblogs]

Hello bmjt, please try not to worry too much, you have your health to think about. Dont make a 'big issue' about it when you call, stay calm and explain to them what Erika has advised. The sooner you do this the sooner you will feel better and I bet the outcome will be in your favour, I do hope so. I am keeping my fingers crossed for you and hoping you get peace of mind.

[bmjt]

on the phone keep trying but the line is busy with people trying to renew, is there another number i can call to sort this out want to get it over with wilst i have the nerve

[Mr lex]

Keep trying bmjt !!

[bmjt]

i keep trying whats the worst that'll happen if i call them 1st thing monday? or is there another number i can call

[scaredtodeath]

The worst that will happen is you'll miss the renewal date and have to repay everything from last year!! You need to keep holding as it's likely to be very busy. Do the renewal today!! at least. I've been where you are now. Mine was DWP fraud and I got prosecuted. It's the worst thing ever to have happened to me. From what Erika has said though it's unlikely you will be prosecuted so you need to hold onto that and think of your child and new baby. x

Edited July 31, 2010 by scaredtodeath

[ErikaPNP]

Try this number: 02890 538192. This is a landline number and is supposed to be used for calling from overseas only but if you explain the issue straight away and also tell them that you can't get though on the 0845 number they might take the call, or have someone call you back.

 

If you leave it until Monday, you will have missed the deadline for renewal. This means that you will likely be liable to repay the entire award you received from April 2009. Failure to renew on time may also lead to a further investigation of your claim which could uncover the fraud.

 

Remember also that you can be charged a penalty for failing to report a change in circumstances or giving incorrect information. Not all people are charged a penalty and if they are going to place a penalty on you, they will consider reducing it, taking into account:

 

• how helpful you've been
  
• if you've freely given them information to work out how much tax credits they should have paid you
  
• the amount of tax credits you over-claimed
  
• if they've charged you a penalty before
  

If you leave it and do not inform them, the fraud can be uncovered at any point. I've seen cases investigated years after the event. If this does happen, and you never inform them then prosecution is more likely.

 

As things stand at the moment, if you come forward now, it's much less likely that they will prosecute.

 

Never mind other cases on the forum - most other cases on here relate to Social Security (DWP) fraud with criminal prosecution. Tax credit tend to be far more lenient with civil recovery always being used as a first option where possible.

[bmjt]

Tryed calling land line number too can't get through omg what an ideot I've been this is going to make everything a hole lot worse what can I do it's hopeless