Dizzy Blonde needs advice

[SharpmanTF1]

Don't know if this is in right place ... could mod move to correct place.

 

Ok,

Long Story Short.....

 

Whilst my daughter was out with her "friends" in a "friends" car.

They parked up in Tescos carpark, she and another were left in the vehicle whilst the rest went into tescos for a bit of retail therapy.

 

whilst sitting in the vehicle listening to the music .... now here's where things get stupid....

 

the party had been out for a visit to the local drinking hole. my Daughter had 2 glasses of wine (you can probably guess what's coming .....)

 

The conversation got around to .... shall I turn the car around. the other person said, enthusiastically yeah I dare you.....

 

During this maneuver my daughter turned to soon and came into contact with the vehicle next to her. (this vehicle happened to belong the the person who was egging her on to move the car.... )

 

In a panic she tried to move the vehicle but could not as it kept stalling.

So, she got out of the vehicle and went to the driver of the vehicle, who was not the owner to fes up to what she had done.

 

The driver, who is a pretty good friend got into the vehicle and removed it from the other vehicle. in doing this has caused more damage than the initial contact. The wing mirror had been damaged in the extraction. ( which wasn't damaged in the initial collision.)

 

Ok, Now the preverbial brown stuff has hit the fan.

 

My daughter is not denying that she had done wrong, she regrets the entire incident and knows she was stupid to do it.

 

She has said straight away that she will pay for the damages. But as she is a single mum and does not earn a great deal she would only be able to pay in installments.

 

She was harrased by the driver (the idiot who egged her on and was sat in the passenger seat and probably had a good idea that they were too close)

She gave him £150 in cash - he visited her at work and was harrassing her. And has also ordered and paid for a new mirror for his vehicle. Which is being fitted for him.

 

Here comes the fun .... not ... stuff.

 

car A = Driven car

Car B = Crashed into car.

 

Driver of Car B is now harrasing her for more money, the cost of damages has change 3 times. there have been no evidence of damage caused in the way of garage reports or photographic evidence, he refuses to provide.

 

Owner of car A, understandably is a bit miffed. Has taken his car to a garage to have damages assesed. and photographs taken.

 

from the photographs there is quite substantial scratches on the passenger side. from what my daughter has described of the incident I do not believe that the damage report portrays the damage that would have been sustained from the initial contact. I feel that some of it was caused by the extraction.

 

Also, instead of going for repairs to said damage the guy is haveing the whole door replaced along with all the electrics that go with it.

 

The owner has refused to accept payments by installments and insists all in one go.

 

The garage bill will come to £1800 pounds. it doesn't take the brains of an archbishop to know that something is not quite right.

 

The thing is, she is now getting harassment and threats from both parties.

 

She knows she has acted irresponsibly, and feels totally embarrassed by the whole incident.

 

She wanted to get the police involved from the time the incident happened, but for some strange reason nobody else did. Both vehicles were removed from the scene quite smartish.....

 

I have a copy of the garage report and some photos of the aleged damage to CAR A

 

are there any garage aficionados out there who could have a peak and give their opinion on report to photos if this is over kill.

[rebel11]

Hi Sharpman

 

As harrassment is taking place, it might be a good idea to report the matter to the police. Inform the other parties of the intention to do so.

It sounds like they are taking your daughter for a ride. If your daughter

refuses to pay, they would have to take her to the small claims court,

but there reluctance to contact the police at the time would count against them. Thats why I feel contacting the poilce might be advisable.

 

Other's will be along to provide better advice.

[andydd]

Do the normal laws applying to roads apply to (private) car parks, regarding insurance, driving licences, drink drive limits, etc ?

 

Andy

Edited June 20, 2010 by andydd

[mandyjayne]

i think andydd is correct here, normal public highway laws do not apply in a private car park.

 

as rebel has said report harrassment to the police, if she has already given £150 in cash he cannot come back for more. My hubby has just skimmed over the law for me, he is a police officer, he is watching footie at the mo so cant get much sense out of him, i will find out more and post for you, should you need it!

 

MJ:)

[unclebulgaria67]

Exactly the same rules apply in a car park such as is provided by Tesco, as do on a public highway. Because the car park is open to the Public, same rules apply. It is only on private land, owned by a private individual or some common land, that some road traffic acts do not apply.

 

In regard to the silly chain of events, this is a private matter between the two parties. You can't go back and suggest that any laws were broken, apart from your daughter may not have been Insured to drive the car, she tried to turnaround. I suppose the Police if they were informed could look into the Insurance situation and charge your daughter for driving the car without Insurance.

 

In respect of the damage the car owner should have taken this to an independent garage to get a quote and then talked to your daughter about how they were going to deal with it. Because the car owner has not acted correctly, I think they have screwed up their chances of using the courts, as they would have to explain what has gone on. As has been said, if the car owner accepted £150 to pay for the damage, they cannot come back later asking for more.

 

If the owner of the damaged car wants additional work, why don't they go through their Insurers if they have comp cover. If they have 3rd party, then they claim against the other cars Insurance. Obviously it may not be wise to give the exact details to Insurers, as detailed in your post. Normally I would suggest you have to be 100% honest with any Insurance claim, but in this situation, why complicate matters. The Insurers might not want to be involved if the parties have tried to resolve this between them.

[rebel11]

He's a sensible chap, it's in our DNA:D

 

i think andydd is correct here, normal public highway laws do not apply in a private car park.

 

as rebel has said report harrassment to the police, if she has already given £150 in cash he cannot come back for more. My hubby has just skimmed over the law for me, he is a police officer, he is watching footie at the mo so cant get much sense out of him, i will find out more and post for you, should you need it!

 

MJ:)

[mandyjayne]

Yes rebel...how funny:)

i may aswell ask my Yorkshire Terrier, i would prob get more response!

 

Brainwashed by the world cup! Well not just the world cup.. TV in general really:D

[SharpmanTF1]

ok, the preverbial brown stuff has hit the rotating thingy ...

 

had a very nice policeman knocking on the door asking for daughter ......

the owners of the car that she drove has put a report of TWOC (taken without consent) - she has to report to local police station to be arrested. (5 weeks after incident.)

 

I think this has gone a little to far.

My daughter has never denied that she has done wrong, and in hindesight she wishes she never did.

 

the damage, in my opinion from the description of the incident is far excessive.

 

the thing is that 4 witnesses have sprung out of thin air and say that she caused all the damage.

 

and i'm sure the guy who was sitting in the car with her is going to deny ever being in the car at the time. (because from what i can make out, that he is guilty of an offence as well. knowing full well that she did not have permission to drive it.)

 

She's in a right state. and from the punishments allowed for TWOC i don't blame her.

 

Just seems a bit eccesive for moving a car a couple of feet.

 

Obviously she's going to need a solicitor - any body had experience with duty solicitors?

 

(I had one for an rta and he was not worth the effort of attending.)

 

She's never denied causing the damage. she's told them she will pay for damages, be it in small instalments (single parent not on a great deal of dosh, all her money goes on the littl'n)

[SharpmanTF1]

ok,

gone in, arrested, charged with aggravated twoc.

 

duty solicitor was a waste of space - arrived late, daughter was taken away before he arrived to have the discussion prior to being questioned. when he was in there he never said a word, even though my daughter felt she was being harassed by the questioning officer.

 

released, on bale. has to report back on 11 august. told to produce the cost of car repairs by then.

 

asked solicitor if money was obtained would the chrges be dropped. (police officer implied that the injured party did not want a conviction but just wanted his car repaired.

 

but officer again implied that it was going in front of cps for conviction of agravated twoc.

 

all solicitor said was ask the police man. what the hell are solicitors for.

I suppose because she isn't within the police station his duties no longer apply.

 

contacted station in question ...... officer will not be on until tonite at 10 pm for his shift ..... ring at 2230 ...... officer is on leave til tuesday .....

 

getting run around here. anybody would think my daughter was a hardened serial criminal - because that's the way she was treated when she went down to the station. al she did was carry out a prank that went wrong.

[dragonkeeper]

I am in no way clued up on the finer points of TWOC, but i am sure vehicle owner's insurance would like to no why keys where left in the ignition without the owner being present. Not sure on legal stance about keys.

Might be worth asking, nothing lost but might show chink in the case against your daughter.

 

regards

 

dk

[Ganymede]

I am in no way clued up on the finer points of TWOC, but i am sure vehicle owner's insurance would like to no why keys where left in the ignition without the owner being present. Not sure on legal stance about keys.

Might be worth asking, nothing lost but might show chink in the case against your daughter.

 

regards

 

dk

 

 

The keys issue will not affect the criminal case, it could only really affect the owners i nsurance policy.

 

At the end of the day your daughter did a stupid thing and you need to see a criminal solicitor ASAP!

[unclebulgaria67]

The keys being left in the car could been seen as consent to have some control over the car. This might not extend to actually driving the car, but it would indicate that this is not a case of TWOC, but a civil matter between the two parties.

 

As last person suggested, if your daughter sees a solicitor that deals with road traffic offence issues, they can probably advise on this.

 

If your daughter lives at home, check your Home Insurance, to see if you have any legal cover or a helpline that would offer any help for this situation. Always worth checking.

[Ganymede]

The keys being left in the car could been seen as consent to have some control over the car. This might not extend to actually driving the car, but it would indicate that this is not a case of TWOC, but a civil matter between the two parties.

 

As last person suggested, if your daughter sees a solicitor that deals with road traffic offence issues, they can probably advise on this.

 

If your daughter lives at home, check your Home Insurance, to see if you have any legal cover or a helpline that would offer any help for this situation. Always worth checking.

 

 

I suppose, however the taking of a vehicle must be without consent of the owner and it is no answer to a charge that the owner would have given consent if ask.

 

On the other hand a person does not commit an offence by anything done in the belief that he has lawful authority to do it, or that he would have the owner's consent if the owner knew of his doing it and the circumstances of it.