Enforcement Officer Home visit for LTD company debts - urgent advice please

[littlemonstersmum]

This is all totally new to me so some advice would be greatly appreciated. My husband is director of a business that has not traded since January 2010. We are waiting for it to be struck off by companies house so at the moment it is still showing as existing. We cannot afford to liquidate or appoint administrators so are somewhat in limbo.

 

The company is LTD and the registered office is away from our home address. A CCJ has been issued to one of the creditors and as it has not been paid they have taken it to the next stage which i think is an attempt to enforce the judgement. We had a visit from an enforcement officer at 8am this morning to our home address. We did not open the door or sign any paperwork. My husband did unfortunately admit verbally to being the owner of the company and gave his mobile number to the enforcement officer.

 

The guy eventually left after giving some verbal threats that this must be sorted out etc etc and posted the letter below through our letterbox. The debt they are now claiming is around £1300 and the value of the items he has listed (from looking over the garden fence) is next to nothing. The trailer is old and only has one wheel, the swing is a play item belonging to our 4 year old son, the wheel barrows are ancient and both have flat tyres, the bbq may have a small value but nothing great and the 'summer house' we think is the log cabin at the end of our garden. This does have a value but is several years old and would take considerable effort to move. The cabin is currently used by my brother in law and nothing that is inside belongs to us.

 

From what i can make out from other posts these guys cannot gain entry to our house but they can break into outbuildings/sheds etc. We do have a shed and the cabin. There is nothing of value in the shed and as i say anything in the cabin is not ours although i don't suppose this would make any difference to an enforcement officer trying to get in.

 

I need to contact Andrew Wilson and Co today and ask why they have sent someone to a residential address regarding a business debt but i would prefer to do this by email if possible so at least i have a record of any contact made. I just need confirmation that i am correct that they can't take anything from a personal address and also some advice on what to put.

 

All help and advice will be gratefully received!

 

 

Andrew Wilson & Co Writ Number: ####

 

 

HIGH COURT FORM NO 55

notice of seizure

 

In The High Court Of Justice

Queens Bench Division

SALFORD DISTRICT REGISTRY

High Court Claim Number: #####

county court claim Number:#####

 

Sent from the ####### county court

 

Defendant: ########### LTD

 

Address of Premises: ##########

 

This Notice has been left at this address by ##########

an enforcement officer from Andrew Wilson & Co The Sherilfs Office High

Court Enforcement Officers of 26 Missouri Avenue Salford Manchester M50

2NP who are authorised to enforce writs of execution from the High Court.

 

TAKE NOTICE THAT:

 

1. A formal seizure of the goods at this address has been made under a Writ of Execution directed to an Enforcement Officer by the High Court. The

Enforcement Officer accordingly has conduct of the execution.

 

2. The goods seized are now in the custody of the Enforcement Officer, as an

Officer of the Court, and must not be removed, sold or otherwise disposed of.

This will remain the position until the sLIm due under the execution has been

paid in full. The only exceptions are goods of the type referred to in

Paragraph 9 of schedule 7 of Section 99 of the Courts Act 2003. (This

Section is set out below). Enclosed with this NOTICE is a WALKING

POSSESSION AGREEMENT in thn form prescribed by law You must read

this agreement and sign it to acknowledge the seizure and hand it to the

Enforcement Officer attending your premises or return it to this Office. Failure

to sign the Walking Possession Agreement may result in the removal of the

goods seized without further notice pending disposal by public auction.

 

3. The judgment debt and costs of execution due under the Writ are:-

 

Judgment Debt: £***

Judgment Costs: £****

Costs of Execution: £****

Assessed Solicitor Costs

*interest to date: £*****

HCEO fees: £****

Total outstanding: £****

 

*Interest is payable from the appropriate date (which varies according to the

size of the judgment debt and where it originated). Officer's fees and interest

will continue to accrue daily until the judgment debt is paid in full.

 

4. Payment must be made to this office in CASH or by BANK DRAFT. Payment

by cheque may be accepted if the Enforcement Officer agrees but may be

subject to such charges (if any) as are made by his bankers for special

clearance.

Please note that it is essential that Writ number ###### is written on the

back of all cheques or bank drafts and quoted in any bank transfers so

that these payments can be identified. All cheques and drafts must be

made payable to Andrew Wilson & Co and sent to the contact address

below.

 

5. If payment is not made and the execution proceeds, the Enforcement Officers

or their agents will attend and remove the goods seized for sale by public

auction or as the Court may direct.

 

6. If any of the goods seized are not your property, you must tell the owner

about the seizure and he must write to the High Court Enforcement Officers

claiming the goods at the contact address below.

 

7. If any of the goods seized are the subject of a hire purchase or any similar

agreement, you must send full details in writing to the High Court

Enforcement Officers at the contact address below.

 

8. If any of the goods seized are not liable to seizure by virtue of Paragraph 9 of

schedule 7 of Section 99 of the Courts Act 2003 (set out below) this Office

must be sent full details in writing within 5 days of the seizure or within such

greater period as the Court may, on your application, allow.

 

9. You must inform this office if another Bailiff seizes, levies on or distrains the

goods to pay another debt and you must inform that Bailiff of this seizure.

 

10. You must also inform this Office of any Petition in Bankruptcy or application to liquidate a limited company that may be, have been or is subsequently served on you.

 

11. The goods seized are all those referred to at 2 above but in case there is any doubt, the following items have been levied on today and ARE INCLUDED IN THE SEIZURE:

 

1 x trailer

1 x garden swing

2 x wheel barrow

1 x bbq

1 x summer house

 

Dated: _____________________

Signed: _____

Contact details:

Andrew Wilson & Co

The Sheriffs Office

26 Missouri Avenue

Salford

Manchester

M50 2NP

Tel: 01619251800

Fax: 01619251801

Website:

 

Paragraph 9 of Schedule 7 of Section 99 of the Courts Act 2003 provides as follows:

9 (1) This paragraph applies where an enforcement officer or other person who is under a

duty to execute the writ is executing it.

(2) The officer may, by virtue of the writ, seize-

. (a) Any goods of the eX6cutrc\n debtor that are not exempt goods, and

(b) Any money, bank notes, bills of exchange, promissory notes, bonds,

specialties or securities for money belonging to the execution debtor.

(3) "Exempt goods" means-

(a) such tools, books, vehicles and other items of equipment as are necessary

to the execution debtor for use personally by him in his employment,

business or vocation;

(b) such clothing, bedding, furniture, household equipment and provisions as

are necessary for satisfying the basic domestic needs of the execution

debtor and his family.

[HadEnough]

I'm no expert but I'd say that the WPO is invalid as it includes a childs swing;).

Again as far as i understand that makes the whole order invalid so they can't charge you for it?

As always I'm happy to be corrected by those in the know;).

[High Court Enforcer]

I'm no expert but I'd say that the WPO is invalid as it includes a childs swing;).

Again as far as i understand that makes the whole order invalid so they can't charge you for it?

As always I'm happy to be corrected by those in the know;).

 

That's not true. Just because one item may not be eligable for removal, doesnt mean the other assets arent seized.

 

There is nothing wrong with attending a residential address for a Ltd Co debt. But it is only goods of the company that are liable for removal.

[HadEnough]

Ok thanx, one more thing learned today

[littlemonstersmum]

Thank you.

 

There is nothing that belonged to the company left either at our home or the now empty business premises. There has been nothing left of the company for months now.

 

So am i right in saying that i can tell the enforcement officers they cannot take anything from our home?

 

I really don't want them turning up again especially when the kids are around.

[Ledburyrfc]

Was the debt against the company or did your husband give some Director guarantees? If it is against the Limited company then they cannot touch your possessions. This is limited liability.

 

Hope this helps.

[littlemonstersmum]

My husband never gave any kind of guarantee and was actually told by the supplier concerned that they would only let us have a pro-forma account. So his company should have paid for goods up front but they were sent them out anyway. He doesn't even remember applying for a credit account so therefore it is possible that the debt is not even enforceable.

 

All i am concerned about however is making sure the bailiffs cannot take any of our personal possessions when the debt is related to a limited company.

 

Now i just need some advice on how to contact the HCEO (or whatever it is they are called) to ensure they don't come back. I think they are just showing threatening behaviour and clutching at straws to try and get their money back.

[ploddertom]

Everything you have so far is sound but I would err on the side of caution. A lot of firms issuing credit for goods provided now put in the small print that if you are a Ltd Co then the person signing the agreement agrees to give a personal guarantee should any of this go astray. Be worth reading to make sure.

 

Once certain you need to inform the HCEO that there are no effects at your home that belong to the Ltd Co and therefore he will be denied any future right of access.

 

PT

[littlemonstersmum]

Thanks PT.

 

Finding the original account form could be interesting.... I may just see if i can get hold of a new one somehow and see what their terms and conditions are. It is unlikely to have changed in the last six months. Obviously if there is some form of director guarantee then they could theoretically chase my husband but none of the paperwork (that we've seen) was addressed to him directly, all just to the company name.

 

There is definitely nothing left of the company by way of assets of any description so i think they can't take anything from the house. Does a personal guarantee mean that they can actually take personal effects if there is nothing left belonging to the company?

 

Do you suggest i write to the HCEO or call them then follow up with a letter? I was going to write as the 'innocent wife' stating that they had visitied a residential premises for a business debt (which it appears they can do) AND also state that there is nothing to do with the business here. I can direct them back to the business address but i imagine they have already been there and as far as i know the building is still standing empty.

 

Thanks for your help so far.

[ploddertom]

 

There is definitely nothing left of the company by way of assets of any description so i think they can't take anything from the house. Does a personal guarantee mean that they can actually take personal effects if there is nothing left belonging to the company?

 

Yes

 

Do you suggest i write to the HCEO or call them then follow up with a letter? I was going to write as the 'innocent wife' stating that they had visitied a residential premises for a business debt (which it appears they can do) AND also state that there is nothing to do with the business here. I can direct them back to the business address but i imagine they have already been there and as far as i know the building is still standing empty.

 

Thanks for your help so far.

 

Write to them rather than use the phone as all these types of folks have selective memory problems when it comes to verbal communications - unless you can record the call. A quick way is to email and follow up with a hard copy in the post preferably sent Signed For. If necessary it may pay to a Statutory Declaration to the effect that all goods on the residential premises are just that and there are no items belonging to the Ltd Co. Cost for doing that is approx £/£10 at a Solicitor or Commissioner for Oaths.

 

PT

[littlemonstersmum]

Ok i should have done something about this but i didn't. Have been waiting for the bailiff to turn up again and this morning he did. I am pregnant and my baby is due in 4 weeks so sorting this out has not been on the top of my priority list.

 

Today he turned up and parked his vehicle so as to block my brother in law's car. It currently only has 3 wheels on it so wasn't going anywhere!!

 

Anyway, the letter he left was in an envelope that has 'removal now booked' written on the front. Inside is a one page letter stating 'formal notice' at the top. Still no mention of my husband's name just his old company.

 

Letter states that he has the power to seize goods up to the value of the judgement + fees. It says he has attended today with a vehicle with the intention of removing goods and chattels. 'I will attend again at this address at any time and remove goods even in your absence'

 

He did complete a walking possession order when last here but it was shoved through the letter box and has not been signed by anyone at our address. The items he levied on are pretty much impossible to move (log cabin - he called it a summer house), kids swing/slide set (concreted in ground), or have next to zero value trailer with only one wheel, a bbq and two ancient wheelbarrows. I'm not sure that the possession order is valid as it wasn't signed by anyone apart from the bailiff. On top of this the items levied are personal and the notice related to a business debt.

 

I have since discovered that the non-payment of goods the CCJ was issued for were never formally received by my husbands business. They were signed for by an ex-employee who was walking from the car park. Could have been anyone. We also have written confirmation (email) from the company concerned that they would not despatch anything without up front payment. This was never made so surely goods should not have been sent. I'm not sure that this has any relevance now but i do know we are not in a position to clear the debt and only know about the CCJ from the visit to our home by the HCEO.

 

What i need to know is: Can the guy come back and just take goods? What he does attempt to take (if he can!) won't cover the cost of the debt so can he levy more items?

 

The final paragraph states 'if you fail to make payment and there are not enough goods to sell to cover your debt, a return will be made to this writ which will enable the claimant to take insolvency proceedings and other proceedings against you and your property' Is this an idle threat or a reality? My husband is not bothered about someone making him bankrupt and the same goes for his company which is in the process of being struck off by companies house. We can't afford to to either ourselves so it would actually be a blessing. A worry would however be our home which we have just saved from repossession although there is still an outright possession order on it so if were to default on our mortgage again we would lose that too.

 

One last question... i know full well this man will turn up again but does anyone have any idea how long it will be? It is about 3 weeks from his last visit. I expect next time it will be more quickly!

 

So many questions again!! All advice will be gratefully received and i will of course provide clarification if anything i have written is not clear!

[Fair-Parking]

Was the limited company registered at your home address? Did it trade from there? Who are the directors? The CCJ - who was named as the respondent on the Court Order?

[Vicki202]

the fact that hes done a levi on goods and posted it thro you door im asuming means he has not been inside of your property ?

[littlemonstersmum]

Fair-parking - the LTD company was not registered at our home address. It might have been in the early days but not for at least 2 years. Again not traded from the home for same amount of time. Nothing left at home belongs to the business. We were not aware of the CCJ until we started getting 'ambulance chasers' calling us offering their services to overturn the CCJ. Haven't actually seen the judgement but the HCEO paperwork is addressed to the company name.

 

Vicki202 - no he has not been inside our property or into our back garden. He simply walked over the front garden to knock on the front door. The goods he has levied on are what he could see in the back garden over the fence. The trailer is in the front but it really is scrap!! The first time he came my husband spoke to him through an upstairs window. This time i didn't answer at all.

[Vicki202]

Ok the fact he has not been in your home is a good thing dont ever let him in the levy to me sounds as if its now invalid as he has placed on it something that does not belong to you it belongs to your child they are not allowed to take childrens toys if you husband has not traded at the home property for the 2 years that he states i would personally do this any mail you get with the company name on and your address do not open it write on this is a residential house/home not a company return to sender have place send these letters to the correct place only do it tho if it states the company name and your address but double check this with citizans advice just for your own mind frame so long as you dont let him in your home theres not alot this bailiff can do he can not break in just do not leave your windows and doors open even if you are at home if you are going to comunicate with them via phone which i would not recomend record it and if by post do it via recorded delivery

[littlemonstersmum]

Someone else mentioned them not being allowed to levy on children's toys. They thought this made the whole thing invalid but another CAGGER said he couldn't levy on the swing but the other items were valid.

 

I thought a walking possession order had to be signed by the owner of the goods. This certainly hasn't been signed.

 

The HCEO letters are delivered by hand and have no return address on the outside of them. Anything through the normal post could obviously be sent back marked return to sender but i am assuming original paperwork was sent to the registered office address which is now empty (as far as i know - it's been several months since we moved out).

 

There are no personal names on the paperwork we do have, just the company name.

 

We do have someone helping us with other debts at the CAB so i will contact her and ask for advice too.

[Vicki202]

Someone else mentioned them not being allowed to levy on children's toys. They thought this made the whole thing invalid but another CAGGER said he couldn't levy on the swing but the other items were valid.

 

I thought a walking possession order had to be signed by the owner of the goods. This certainly hasn't been signed.

 

The HCEO letters are delivered by hand and have no return address on the outside of them. Anything through the normal post could obviously be sent back marked return to sender but i am assuming original paperwork was sent to the registered office address which is now empty (as far as i know - it's been several months since we moved out).

 

There are no personal names on the paperwork we do have, just the company name.

 

We do have someone helping us with other debts at the CAB so i will contact her and ask for advice too.

 

Its invalid if it is all one one levy if it was separate to the other things on the list then the swing could be disregarded but the other things on separate sheet would stand

 

the walking possession does not have to be signed but you do have to be offered the chance to sign it and a copy to for it to be valid ive had this my self a couple of weeks ago where a bailiff refused to even show me the levy she had made never mind ask me to sign it or offer be a copy and i no now that that is invalid

 

if there's no personal names on those letters it could be that anyone could be opening them and so on so my advice would be to send them back as the company is not at your home address and if someone comes to you door explain that the company does not exist there as there is no names to the letters say you didn't no where they should be passed to or whom

[littlemonstersmum]

This is how the levy was listed:

 

11. The goods seized are all those referred to at 2 above but in case there is any doubt, the following items have been levied on today and ARE INCLUDED IN THE SEIZURE:

 

1 x trailer

1 x garden swing

2 x wheel barrow

1 x bbq

1 x summer house

 

Never seen anything like this before so i have no idea what is or isn't valid. The garden swing is my son's swing/slide combo so i do know this item at least is not valid.

 

I am concerned that he may turn up again and just take the goods he has levied. So we do need to make some form of contact to clarify to the HCEO that this is a home and not business premises.

[Vicki202]

It would seem to me to be invailid i am looking up the infor now for you but sure when they list a levy n it has all things in sight on it then its classed as invalid through a certain act of a certain year will find them for you if someone else does not first but should they turn back up and start snooping in your garden my advise would be the same as i have had with my invalid levy ring 999 and report burgelry in progress suspect on premises cab told me that so its from a good sorce i would say

[Vicki202]

Can i just ask who are they collecting on behalf of you can pm me the answer if you do not want to post here but it could help with things

[welsh1]

That's not true. Just because one item may not be eligable for removal, doesnt mean the other assets arent seized.

 

There is nothing wrong with attending a residential address for a Ltd Co debt. But it is only goods of the company that are liable for removal.

 

VICKI202,above is a quote from HCE,now he is not the most liked person on the forums,but he does give firm advice(when he gives it:rolleyes:).

 

Now i have read your posts with interest,and you are keen to help others with the knowledge you have gained recently,and i commend you for that,but please be careful with advice you give,it could be wrong and get the op into difficulty,in this post the op is dealing with a high court enforcement officer HCEO,they operate in a similar way to bailiffs,but have lots of different tricks up their sleeves,so the advice you have been given pertaining to your bailiff situation may not be the advice needed for this op.

I don't mean this post in a nasty way,i just want you to be aware that people rely on the advice given on here,so it should be the right advice.

Good luck,Welsh1.

[littlemonstersmum]

Only problem is we are not at home all the time!!

 

I am trying to spend time here getting ready before baby arrives but have to admit i find it quite scary to think they might just turn up at any time.

 

I have heard advice to call police before so that is what i would do if they did try to take the stuff.

 

Will PM you the company details just in case someone is lurking. Although if they are they'd work it out from the list of goods levied!!

Edited July 2, 2010 by littlemonstersmum

[littlemonstersmum]

Thanks Welsh1.

 

This is what concerns me. The HCEO does seem to have other 'tricks' as you put it! What i don't know is how to deal with the situation.

 

I admit we should have dealt with it when the HCEO first visited but we didn't and now we need to act quickly to stop further action.

 

There categorically is nothing left of the business at home and the items the HCEO has levied on are all personal.

 

Any tips on what to include in a letter/email to the HCEO company would be appreciated.

[ploddertom]

One thing you should do because of your present circumstances is to make the HCEO Company aware that you are soon due to give birth - sure you should be classed as vulnerable under the National Standards. Therefore they should desist in visiting you for the time being - may give you time to sort out the hows & whys of this.

 

If any hassles with the above you must immediately apply for a Stay of Execution:

A - because you are expecting

b - because they are chasing a person for a Ltd Co debt

c - because you're skint - you will have to provide detailed I & E for this part

If you are on benefits or low income you can apply for Fee Remission - FOrm EX160 from HMCS website. Stay of Execution use Form N244 - also from HMCS website.

 

PT

[welsh1]

Your problem seems to be separating the ltd company from the private goods.

If you are certain the hceo has no cause to chase you or your husband(may have acted as a guarantor)and there is nothing there belonging to the ltd company.

Get a statutory declaration sworn at a solicitors,stating all goods at the property belong to private individuals,and there are no assets of the company at the property.

Then as ploddertom has said a stay of execution,to give you space.

 

But you must be certain that there is nothing there of the company,and you should check all your invoices ,bills, contracts and be sure there is no small print making the directors of the company liable for anything.

Edited July 1, 2010 by welsh1
remembered the word statutory declaration(senility)lol