County Court Claim

[stupot59]

I have been in dispute with Cabot Financial for over a year concerning a debt they allegedly bought from Goldfish Bank Ltd.

 

Heard nothing since April and now out of the blue I receive a County Court Claim which I have acknowledged via the internet. I intend defending the claim as Carboot have not acted ethically, professionally and honestly, in my view.

 

How do I change the Court from Northampton to one that is more convenient for me ?

 

More about my dispute with Crapbot later, as I'm off to work now !

 

Thanks to all contributors..

[BankFodder]

Once you supply your defence, the case will automatically be transferred to your local court.

Make sure that you file your defence on time.

Cabot's honesty, ethics or professionalism are unlikley to be a good basis for a defence.

You need to make sure that your defence is based upon solid fact such as that the agreement is flawed in some way or that the alleged debt is comprised of charges etc.

[stupot59]

What about if they have "created" documents which never existed and called them "reproductions."...? e.g. Notice of Assignments from both themselves and the original lender, both of which never happened !

[Desperate Daniella]

Did they send you an enforceable Agreement?

[stupot59]

They sent me the original application form for the credit card which bears my signature, for sure. However, the application form does not have within it all of the perscribed terms, namely The amount of credit, the credit limit, interest rate and repayment procedure. The document is void of any signature from the original lender, but has a date stamp.

 

Cabot have argued that the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 61(1)(b) states:

61 Signing of an Agreement

(1) A regulated agreement is not properly executed unless:

...(b) the document embodies all the terms of the agreements, other than implied terms

 

They also argue that the Consumer Credt Act 1974 Section 189(4) states:

189 Definitions

(4) A document embodies a provision if the provision is set out either in the document itself or in another document referred to in it.

 

Cabot appear to think that perscribed terms may be set out in a document other than the credit agreement as long as reference is made to the document.

 

On this basis one could say that any consumer signs not knowing what the condition of the terms are until it's too late to do anything about it...

What are the opinions of my colleagues ?

[Desperate Daniella]

Can you post it up here (without identifying bits)?

[stupot59]

DD......Here are the photobucket links :-

 

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee240/stupot52/MorganStanley1.jpg

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee240/stupot52/MorganStanley2.jpg

Awaiting your comments..

 

stupot59

[IdaInFife]

can you confirm if your signature is on your first link?

 

ida x

[stupot59]

IMy signature IS on the document but I removed it from the image prior to posting on the forum..

[Desperate Daniella]

Can't read it completely, but it looks as though it could have the prescribed terms so need an expert to look at it. There is an almost identical one on another thread which I will post.

 

What worries me is that the lines don't match. Look at the thick line under the top bit. It is over to the right. It doesn't line up with the first column which is over to the left.

[Desperate Daniella]

Sorry, hit post by mistake.

 

I don't think real agreements are out of alignment like this.

[ScabHunter]

I can't read that first link, so I can't see whether or not the prescribed terms are there.

 

Crapbot have been coming out with this bilge about the prescribed terms and another document for a long time now. There is a post on it here -

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/223570-cabot-financial-dealing-cabot-2.html#post2479594

 

The TRUTH is contained in this post -

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/223570-cabot-financial-dealing-cabot-2.html#post2488448

 

It is absolutely essential that you not only know the truth, which you do now, but are able to argue it very convincingly in court. Crapbot will try every trick in the book to deceive a judge just as they try to deceive everyone else. The law itself, the High Court precedents, and the opinions of the foremost experts on the Act, including the draftsman himself, are our best weapons. Make sure you use them to full effect.

 

Mods - this needs moving to Legal Issues.

 

SH

[IdaInFife]

if tyhe have the original of what you have posted then it would be enforceble IMHO

 

it looks like photocopy of the original if thats what dd means

[Desperate Daniella]

I think it's photocopied bits but it looks like it's been cut up a bit. The top bit isn't centred. The black boxes for the consents are not in line with what is above.

 

I think it's bones's thread Morgan & Stanley /barclaycard which has the same as your agreement, but I'm having problems today opening the links. Have a look there.

 

If it really does look out of sync I'd ask to visit the original at their offices.

[stupot59]

if tyhe have the original of what you have posted then it would be enforceble IMHO

 

it looks like photocopy of the original if thats what dd means

-----------------------------------------------------------------

 

Please explain why you appear to be so emphatic with your statement.

 

Call me stupid, but the Application Form does not appear to contain :

• The Amount of Credit
  
• Credit Limit
  
• Interest
  
• Repayments
  
• An Authorised Signature by a Goldfish person
  

Therefore. when are "prescribed terms" not "prescribed terms"..?

 

In fact, What ARE prescribed terms which enable an application form to suddenly become an enforcable CCA ??

[stupot59]

In addition, Cabot have definitely produced "representations" of documents which never existed at the time thay should have, i.e. Notice of Assignment from the OL and a so-called "Welcome to Caboty" letter.

 

Both of these representations bear dates not contemporary with when they would have been sent/received and to all intents and purposes are spurious.

 

If a proper Notice of Assignment is not provided by the OL or DCA what relevance does this have to my defence ?

 

Awaiting replies,

 

Stupot59

[angry cat]

What are the particulars of claim as stated by Cabot?

[stupot59]

What are the particulars of claim as stated by Cabot?

 

Here are the exact words:

 

The Claimant is the Assignee of a Debt(s) from Goldfish Bank Ltd. Credit Card reference CCCCCCC

Notice of Assignment having been given to the defendant in writing. Despite demand for payment £XXXX.XX remains due. The Claimant claims £YYYY.YY and interest under s.69 County Court Act 1984 and costs.

[stupot59]

Just for information, I have already sent a CPR18 - Request for Information letter to Cabot by special delivery.

[angry cat]

Ah Ha

 

Vague POC from Cabot, as ever!

[angry cat]

From the 'Vague' POC that Cabot have issued, it would not be possible for you (the Defendant) to submit a proper defence.

 

Cabot must disclose to you all documents that relate to the case; documents that support their claim.

 

When you receive your AQ (allocation questionairre) you will have to request 'Directions' and then you will be able to submit your amended defence.

[angry cat]

Can one of the mods move this thread over to the legal issues forum!

 

Thanks

 

AC

[maroondevo52]

Thread moved to Legal Issues, you OK with that stupot59.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[angry cat]

Thank you!

 

stupot59, you will obtain the correct advice on this forum:)

 

AC

[angry cat]

Another member in a similar situation:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/180589-cabot-issued-claim.html