JobSearch Diary?

[Norman1066]

If they don't want to give me any money, then i have no other choice but to steal it.

 

I have a criminal record, been out of trouble for 10 years, but i'm sure i haven't lost the knack. with any luck, and if karma has anything to do with it I'll end up robbing a ****** from the jobcentre.

[Norman1066]

 

The JSA payment is paid to you as the couple's representative and so they can withhold the payment.

 

 

This makes no sense. We have no option to claim separately, no choice in the matter. so how can they withhold my partner's share of the money?

 

If we were to try and make separate claims they would tell us we cannot do it because we are living as a couple. You can't punish two people for the wrong doings of one person. Not to mention 4 dependents. That is simply barbaric. You either have no idea what you're talking about or the system needs a complete overhaul.

 

It really is about time we started fighting back.

[Norman1066]

In fact, i'm going to 'leave' my girlfriend so then we can claim separately. double whammy. i'll also get myself some private accommodation so they can pay for that too. They also give the first months rent if you apply for it.

 

I've played fair, done everything i am supposed to do. The jobcentre staff want to treat people like idiots, like children...

 

so long as my family has money i don't care about myself, so they can shove their diary where the sun don't shine.

[FitzWilliam]

Norman,

 

Did you see these stories in the press about your jobcentre?

 

Birmingham Mail - News - Birmingham News - Guard is attacked at job centre in Selly Oak

 

A day in the life of a jobcentre | Money | The Guardian

[MRSWESTHAM]

I might get shouted at because of what im gong to say but its just a point of view..

 

This all occured because you didnt do what they requested? Why not just do it and save all the panick for you and your family having no money?

 

I go to work if i dont do what im asked to do ultimately i get the sack and end up with no money...whats the difference here?

Edited September 26, 2009 by MRSWESTHAM
spelling

[drone69]

@MRSWESTHAM maybe because they insist on applying the rules with no leeway. They should all be taught that `things you can do` is not the same as `things you have to do`. If they can`t understand basic English then they should not be in a position that carries so much responsibility. Until you have experianced how petty and small minded some people who work in the job center are you wouldn`t believe what some of them are like. Not shouting at you, just a sad fact of being a `customer` of the job center.

[MRSWESTHAM]

Ok - i didnt mean it funny I just wondered

[drone69]

No problem, it`s just you`d not believe what some of the staff can be like. Although the majority are ok some are far from helpful.

[Jan4a]

I have wondered the same as Mrs Westham but understand and agree with Norman's principles.

 

Someone should stand up to the obnoxious ones but most are too scared because of precisely what has happened to Norman. Government departments bully a lot of people into doing what they don't have to. I fill my book in because it makes my life easier and because my JC lady asked me nicely when I didn't at first do it. Attitude makes a big difference.

[Guest Bernie_Schitts]

There's a word called "lipservice." Basically, you tell people what they want to hear to keep them happy. It's not deceit, but more a case of giving people enough rope to hang themselves in a lot of cases.

 

Imagine you are in an eating establishment and your food is cold or undercooked. Fly off the handle and start in with the scolding and your meal will arrive back or be replaced and be piping hot and well cooked, but with some added ingredients; I know, I've seen it happen. But, be nice and allow those who have made the mistake to rectify it whilst feeling slightly guilty for not reaching a certain standard and your meal will come back perfect.

 

It's the same the world over. Wind people up and they will do their uptmost to be as unhelpful as possible. So I would advocate to be nice at all times and keep your feelings close to your chest, but also, remember to thoroughly read anything before ticking boxes or signing your name. Ask if you can take forms away for a while to study them fully before filling in and if need be, get some advice on them from someone who is in the know if you are unsure about anything.

 

Always remember this: People like to feel that they are important and useful in this world. Help them to feel this way and they will walk over hot coals to help you.

[Guest Bernie_Schitts]

I have wondered the same as Mrs Westham but understand and agree with Norman's principles.

 

Someone should stand up to the obnoxious ones but most are too scared because of precisely what has happened to Norman. Government departments bully a lot of people into doing what they don't have to. I fill my book in because it makes my life easier and because my JC lady asked me nicely when I didn't at first do it. Attitude makes a big difference.

I have to agree with you here. In this country there is an ever growing sense of fear to not step out of line in any way or to get involved for fear of litigation. This country has become so PC and bureaucratic that it is fast becoming like a balloon that can only take so much hot air before it explodes. I feel we are on the verge of a revolution.

[zazen.warrior]

I might get shouted at because of what im gong to say but its just a point of view..

 

This all occured because you didnt do what they requested? Why not just do it and save all the panick for you and your family having no money?

 

I go to work if i dont do what im asked to do ultimately i get the sack and end up with no money...whats the difference here?

 

Yeah I tend to agree with you, we all know it's a big silly game, job centre staff included. Play along until you're free of them.

 

And if someone says something entirely unreasonable to you whilst you're signing on - as described above. The next thing you do is ask for a manager, and a complaint form.

 

On the two occasions I felt the need to complain I copied in my MP and the Secretary of State for Works and Pensions.

 

It made them resolve my issues very swiftly.

 

Luckily I am now free of them but the anger lingers on which is why I still look at this forum.

Edited September 27, 2009 by zazen.warrior

[Norman1066]

Norman,

 

Did you see these stories in the press about your jobcentre?

 

Birmingham Mail - News - Birmingham News - Guard is attacked at job centre in Selly Oak

 

A day in the life of a jobcentre | Money | The Guardian

 

I guarantee you this is simply because they played with somebody's life. The anger one feels when dealing with these people can lead to crazy circumstances.

 

I don't know the full circumstances to the stabbing... but I can sympathise with the frustration the man witht he knife must have been under.

 

people are angry anyway. No jobs, yet we're expected to magic one out of the air. People are losing their homes and everything they've worked for while the rich are still sitting pretty after taking even more money from the poor.

 

Then we must suffer the indignity of being treated like second class citizens by people in the jobcentre working for £6 an hour. Basically little hitlers on low pay. This isn't the majority of the staff, just one or two, actually 3 or 4 in my office. Selly Oak must be where they send the idiots to work.

[Norman1066]

I might get shouted at because of what im gong to say but its just a point of view..

 

This all occured because you didnt do what they requested? Why not just do it and save all the panick for you and your family having no money?

 

I go to work if i dont do what im asked to do ultimately i get the sack and end up with no money...whats the difference here?

 

 

I have done everything requested of me... i forgot the diary on one signing day and happened to mention that it is optional anyway and for my benefit not theirs. The advisor then told me that i was wrong... and here we are.

 

What if you go to work and your boss asks you for a sexual favour... would you give him one?

 

Of course you wouldn't, because it is not in your job description, unless you're working for a pimp maybe.

[Norman1066]

@MRSWESTHAM maybe because they insist on applying the rules with no leeway. They should all be taught that `things you can do` is not the same as `things you have to do`. If they can`t understand basic English then they should not be in a position that carries so much responsibility. Until you have experianced how petty and small minded some people who work in the job center are you wouldn`t believe what some of them are like. Not shouting at you, just a sad fact of being a `customer` of the job center.

 

 

yes exactly, they enjoy the feeling of power and expect you to be subservient. However I am too proud to be bullied, especially by people that I consider to have a low IQ. Anybody can work in the jobcentre it seems. IQ tests should be mandatory for a profession like that, imo.

[Norman1066]

There's a word called "lipservice." Basically, you tell people what they want to hear to keep them happy. It's not deceit, but more a case of giving people enough rope to hang themselves in a lot of cases.

 

Imagine you are in an eating establishment and your food is cold or undercooked. Fly off the handle and start in with the scolding and your meal will arrive back or be replaced and be piping hot and well cooked, but with some added ingredients; I know, I've seen it happen. But, be nice and allow those who have made the mistake to rectify it whilst feeling slightly guilty for not reaching a certain standard and your meal will come back perfect.

 

It's the same the world over. Wind people up and they will do their uptmost to be as unhelpful as possible. So I would advocate to be nice at all times and keep your feelings close to your chest, but also, remember to thoroughly read anything before ticking boxes or signing your name. Ask if you can take forms away for a while to study them fully before filling in and if need be, get some advice on them from someone who is in the know if you are unsure about anything.

 

Always remember this: People like to feel that they are important and useful in this world. Help them to feel this way and they will walk over hot coals to help you.

 

 

This is completely different, your analogy of the restaurant just doesn't fit this situation.

 

Yup wind people up... it was me that got wound up. I told the advisor that it was optional as it clearly states on the agreement. She then told me that i was wrong. I understand English very well, she clearly did not so I tried my best to explain it to her. She still told me I was wrong.

 

Now, I stay away from teaching my 5 year old son, reason is because i get too stressed out if I feel he should have understood by now what I am telling him. So, I defer the teaching to my gf, preferring to wait till he is a little older and can therefore understand better what I am trying to teach him.

 

This is the same thing. Anybody with an average IQ would have understood my explanation, yet this advisor still insisted on arguing with me. Telling me even that if I don't do it she will get my money stopped.

 

When threatened I always react in only one way, I fight back.

[Norman1066]

Norman,

 

Did you see these stories in the press about your jobcentre?

 

Birmingham Mail - News - Birmingham News - Guard is attacked at job centre in Selly Oak

 

A day in the life of a jobcentre | Money | The Guardian

 

actually i should take back what I said. The security guard in question was a good guy. I'd spoken to him on several occasions, and even at my most frustrated he never once tried to make me worse. He seemed to genuinely be an ok guy.

 

I've only just learned of this myself so phoned up a friend. he filled me in. Apparently the security guard didn't even see it coming, a 'customer' was walking out of the jobcentre apparently calm, and just stabbed the security guard in the stomach on his way out. Sounds to me like the guy has had a problem at the desks and taken it out on the security guard. Those security guards are just ordinary guys like us doing a job, they have nothing to do with decisions made by the staff.

 

damn. Excuse the expletive, i'm just a little shocked. he was a decent man, I hope he's ok.

[Norman1066]

If you guys are not aware of TPUC yet you should check it out:

 

http://www.tpuc.org/content/tpucorg-gathering

[FitzWilliam]

Apparently the security guard didn't even see it coming, a 'customer' was walking out of the jobcentre apparently calm, and just stabbed the security guard in the stomach on his way out. Sounds to me like the guy has had a problem at the desks and taken it out on the security guard.

 

Thanks for the info. I think your assessment is very likely right.

 

Sounds like it will be a crown court case so I'll look for further media coverage.

 

These security guards were introduced a few years ago. I would not be surprised if next they have metal detectors and frisking like at airport security.

[Norman1066]

The guy that stabbed him, i was told, is in his early 50's.

 

Most likely some guy that should have been on disability benefits in the first place.

 

 

However, it is still cause and effect. Once you start taking money from people and make them go hungry... well, revolutions are borne from that.

[FitzWilliam]

Anybody can work in the jobcentre it seems. IQ tests should be mandatory for a profession like that, imo.

 

Strangely enough, a thought that frequently goes through my mind as well.

 

But if jobcentre staff had to pass IQ tests there would only be about 20% of them left.

[FitzWilliam]

The guy that stabbed him, i was told, is in his early 50's.

 

Most likely some guy that should have been on disability benefits in the first place.

 

However, it is still cause and effect. Once you start taking money from people and make them go hungry... well, revolutions are borne from that.

 

Yes, it will be tragic if it turns out that the guy who stabbed the guard was the victim of jobcentre incompetence in wrongly sanctioning him or something like that.

 

The simple mistakes that jobcentre staff often make can cause a great deal of distress to people who feel maligned or are left without money to feed themselves. And the poor attitude of staff can sometimes make things worse.

 

Not, of course, that any of that can justify stabbing someone.

 

I hope the truth, whatever it is, will come out in court.

[zazen.warrior]

It amazes me that this sort of thing doesn't happen more often - what with the huge amount of needless anger and frustration that job centres generate.

 

I'm also very curious to see what happens when people start getting condemned to endless 'provision' until they find work. Thousands joining these useless 'courses' and hardly anyone vanishing off the other end. It defies reason.

 

We are living in interesting times.

[MRSWESTHAM]

Hi sorry I didnt reply quicker...

 

Well Norman I would do whatever they asked of me if th price was right Joke of course.

 

I wouldnt obviousy perform sexual favours but I would do something that was out of my job description if it benefited me or my prospects within the organsation.

 

Unofrtunately bosses and jobcenter staff by the sound of it are sometimes on a bit of a power trip and all the while you do as your asked things are hunky dory, i admire you for not backing down and standing your ground and its sad that where you are there no jobs where you are. I hope you find work soon and when you do take the diary in and shove it where the sun doesn shine.

 

Good Luck

 

Mrs W

[MONX]

I have done everything requested of me... i forgot the diary on one signing day and happened to mention that it is optional anyway and for my benefit not theirs. The advisor then told me that i was wrong... and here we are.

 

What if you go to work and your boss asks you for a sexual favour... would you give him one?

 

Of course you wouldn't, because it is not in your job description, unless you're working for a pimp maybe.

 

Expecting you to complete a jobsearch diary is not comparable to an employer asking for sexual favours!

 

I understand your frustration and can see why you are getting so angry but in hindsight, wouldnt you rather have just completed the diary and saved yourself so much stress and anger?