Cap1 debt, many dcas could not find CCa - Dryden Fairfax Claim form - HELP!

[Desperate Daniella]

Personally I would complain about her, even if you decide not to appeal.

[wendyboats]

So sorry to read this Big Merv,

 

 

I had the same attitude from the Judge I had at my appeal, But I am fighting back with help from CAG and I will fight to prove what we all know, and that is Debt Collection agencies are using the court arena, mainly district Judges to succeed in false accounting, and take money that they know is not theirs to take............. Call it what you will ! But I for one will not let them take from me or mine, I just thank god for CAG and all the support I have !!

 

 

Kindest Regards Wendy x

[Big Merv]

I have considered it DD...

 

I just don't know where to start. I am miffed slightly that having mentioned the points regarding the act i.e true legible copy then the DN, As I couldn't remember them explicitly the judge said she couldn't be expected to memorise the whole act herself it is massive but that she would check the points I raised.

 

I thought oh OK she will then see what it states about these things. To then be told well the law/act states that only the original needs to to legible and there is no mention of a need of date or 14 days etc on a DN I was well ...what could I say at this point? Are you sure? Are your eyes dreaming mam? Can you not bloody read? Sorry mam you don't know the law here? Err...perhaps not.

 

That could really have p*ssed on her chips.....and mine. However, it was the bit I was not prepared for I guess. How to politely tell a judge they dont know there eggs on this one and it DOES state these things in the act. I did say to her that was not my understanding of what was written in the act to which she replied well tell me where it is written (in the bit that MandM supplied me here ....). On to the computer she went to tell me that part of the act states nothing about 14 days notice how to make good default etc....FFS

 

When she said about the agreement being legible etc and that only the original I signed needed to be, I then said so if I understand you correctly mam as long as they produce something regardless whether we can read it or not with my signature on it that is OK?

 

She got a little bit cross'ish about that and said that wasn't what she had said. I then got an explanation about how that taking multiple photocopies of the same document has obviously led to the deterioration of the print? Que? At that point I almost said "you have 30 fooking pages of photocopying in your hand done on my p8ss poor hp inject and you can read all of them from 4 foot away!" I didn't. But it was at this point I started thinking where the hell do i go from here. The law or acts don't mean sh*t clearly.

 

As you know I at this point put my panic post to which once again people came up trumps...but alas judge not interetested - told me that she had already established with me what the law/act states.

 

Can I ask for a full transcript of the session?

[Big Merv]

So sorry to read this Big Merv,

 

 

I had the same attitude from the Judge I had at my appeal, But I am fighting back with help from CAG and I will fight to prove what we all know, and that is Debt Collection agencies are using the court arena, mainly district Judges to succeed in false accounting, and take money that they know is not theirs to take............. Call it what you will ! But I for one will not let them take from me or mine, I just thank god for CAG and all the support I have !!

 

 

Kindest Regards Wendy x

 

Thanks Wendy

[MandM]

Can I ask for a full transcript of the session?

 

I believe that you can but you have to pay for it to be produced.

 

Hopefully someone can confirm that.

 

M

[AndyOrch]

Yes there is a fee and also appeal fees...which will amount to the same as the judgment amount.

 

 

Regards

 

 

Andy

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Transcripts can be very expensive, have a look on Google there are a number of companies that provide this service.

[Ganymede]

I believe that you can but you have to pay for it to be produced.

 

Hopefully someone can confirm that.

 

M

 

 

Correct.

 

He'll need to call the Court and they advise how to do it.

[The Mould]

I am going to have a read of your case, in particular these last few pages.

 

 

Transcript of the case will require a fee.

 

 

At the present time, I have noted that the DN relied upon by the creditor is invalid, in this respect, his claim ought to have been dismissed in its entirety and it appears to my mind that the judge has allowed his case to succeed in contravention of statute.

 

 

In Brandon v American Express, on the issue of the invalid default notice, the Court of Appeal stated that a creditor cannot proceed to enforcement of a regulated agreement in contravention of statute, this judgement is qualified.

 

 

Kind regards

 

 

The Mould

 

 

PS. Post back here for you ASAP (when my health permits such) - hang on in there my dear fellow

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi DJ,

 

I asked The Mould to come over here to have a look.

 

I am so sorry I didn't think of Brandon/Amex.

 

DD

[Big Merv]

Hi DJ,

 

I asked The Mould to come over here to have a look.

 

I am so sorry I didn't think of Brandon/Amex.

 

DD

 

Right that is it I am therefore going to hold you totally responsible DD

 

Fear not, you did more than enough

 

Thanks to, to The Mould

[Desperate Daniella]

The Brandon judgment is very important because the Court of Appeal is a much higher authority than a district judge.

 

Wait to see what The Mould says, but I think you could win an appeal on this. She chose to ignore a statute and they are not open to interpretation.

[Big Merv]

I will do DD

[Desperate Daniella]

When you have a minute, clear your inbox!!

[Peterbard]

cap1 so called dn.pdf‎

 

Are they saying that this is the DN?

 

This is a good question because to me it looks like a termination notice.

[Big Merv]

When you have a minute, clear your inbox!!

Done

[Peterbard]

Also I have only skimmed the thread so forgive me if I have this wrong , but I understand the judge said that the photo copy of the agreement does not have to be legible under the act, if this is so she is absolutely correct, it does not.

 

The act and in particular the cancellation and copy regulations say that a "true copy" must be legible, this would be a copy obtained under section 62 63 77-79 of the CCA.

 

I am unsure if this is where the confusion has arisen but I thought it worth pointing out

[Big Merv]

Also I have only skimmed the thread so forgive me if I have this wrong , but I understand the judge said that the photo copy of the agreement does not have to be legible under the act, if this is so she is absolutely correct, it does not.

 

The act and in particular the cancellation and copy regulations say that a "true copy" must be legible, this would be a copy obtained under section 62 63 77-79 of the CCA.

 

I am unsure if this is where the confusion has arisen but I thought it worth pointing out

 

So DB if I understand correctly what you have put there, when you ask for a copy of the legally enforceable agreement and they produce something that clearly shows your signature regardless of whether you can read it or not, because your signature is on it, it is enforceable in law. This is essentially what the judge said to me also.

 

DJ

[Peterbard]

So DB if I understand correctly what you have put there, when you ask for a copy of the legally enforceable agreement and they produce something that clearly shows your signature regardlesstrue copy" of whether you can read it or not, because your signature is on it, it is enforceable in law. This is essentially what the judge said to me also.

 

DJ

 

Like I say I have not scrutinesd your thread so forgive me if I have the particulars wrong.

 

But the legibility of copy documents only extends to those obtained under a request made via section 180 of the act a "true copy". This is prescribed under the cancellation and copy regulations as mentioned earlier, and if not complied with makes the agreement unenforceable under section 78(6).

 

If you were presented with a fuzzy document as proof that on the balance of probabilities a compliant document WAS signed then it would probably suffice, there is not requirement for that copy to be legible it is not for information it is just, as said proof that an agreement was signed.

[Big Merv]

I see on the OFT web page on making a CCA request -

If this information is not provided within 12 working days the debt becomes unenforceable. This means a creditor:

cannot:

- make the debtor pay the debt before they're supposed to

- get a court judgment against the debtor

- take back anything hired or bought on credit, or take anything used as security in the agreement.

 

So when a DCA takes this on and doesn't respond to a CCA request is it only they who can't legally enforce it? Can they just had it then to another DCA to have a try at getting the information in time. I ask because long before Lowell had this Fredrickson had it, they failed to furnish me with a credit agreement following a CCA request - they wrote to me saying sorry we have referred this matter to our client (CApital ONe) and be in touch when we have further instructions - a letter included in my defense bundle I didn't refer the judge to it.

[Peterbard]

I see on the OFT web page on making a CCA request -

If this information is not provided within 12 working days the debt becomes unenforceable. This means a creditor:

cannot:

- make the debtor pay the debt before they're supposed to

- get a court judgment against the debtor

- take back anything hired or bought on credit, or take anything used as security in the agreement.

 

So when a DCA takes this on and doesn't respond to a CCA request is it only they who can't legally enforce it? Can they just had it then to another DCA to have a try at getting the information in time. I ask because long before Lowell had this Fredrickson had it, they failed to furnish me with a credit agreement following a CCA request - they wrote to me saying sorry we have referred this matter to our client (CApital ONe) and be in touch when we have further instructions - a letter included in my defense bundle I didn't refer the judge to it.

 

It has to be remembered that this unenforceabitly is only temporary and means that the current owner of the account cannot commence proceedings in court, however all they have to do is fabricate a document that has the same financial particulars on it as those that were in place when you signed the agreement. Once they have done this the bar on enforcement is lifted.

[Big Merv]

Which is essentially what the judge read out yes. Thanks

 

But that still leaves the DN problem also my question from the post above

 

Thanks

 

DJ

[Big Merv]

It has to be remembered that this unenforceabitly is only temporary and means that the current owner of the account cannot commence proceedings in court, however all they have to do is fabricate a document that has the same financial particulars on it as those that were in place when you signed the agreement. Once they have done this the bar on enforcement is lifted.

 

Which is what I suspect that DCA have produced/done here. On questioning the authenticity of the document the Oppo immediately jumped in about accusations of fraud etc. Judge warned me about this tack then asked me if I was saying document was a fabrication of some sort. Clearly accusing the DCA of fraud was not in my mind a prudent cause of action here.

 

DJ

[Peterbard]

Which is essentially what the judge read out yes. Thanks

 

But that still leaves the DN problem also my question from the post above

 

Thanks

 

DJ

 

Do you mean who can enforce ? if so only the current creditor or owner can enforce.

As for your DN, as said did they say this was the default notice or did they say it was the termination notice, because the first line says we terminate the agreement, this would not be on a DN.

[Peterbard]

Which is what I suspect that DCA have produced/done here. On questioning the authenticity of the document the Oppo immediately jumped in about accusations of fraud etc. Judge warned me about this tack then asked me if I was saying document was a fabrication of some sort. Clearly accusing the DCA of fraud was not in my mind a prudent cause of action here.

 

DJ

 

Yes I think you are right, attention should have been drawn to the requirements of the copy regulations and section 78, if it had and if the document indeed was supposed to be a compliant section 78 copy then they could not have enforced. As it was they used it to prove the existence of an agreement.