Orange/Arrow/Cope's/Transcom!

[gdbevan]

Hi all,

 

This is a rather strange situation, and I have no idea what I am supposed to do.

 

I recieved a letter out of the blue on 23rd Septmebr from Cope's Solicitors requesting payment of £677.44 for a contract mobile account that I have never had (contract taken out 25th March 2003 - defaulted on 15th August 2005), and saying having failed/refused to pay (which I have never been asked to do by letter or phone) etc...also the usual threats of taking me to court, romoving goods from my home...a proper threatogram! The letter also stated that they had taken on the case from Arrow Global LLC. I was going to file it under "trash" but thought I had better find out what it was all about. I checked my credit file and have only ever had an Orange contract mobile during that time which I had in 2001 and settled my account in August 2005.

 

So I wrote to them requesting a copy of my signed agreement, default notice and deed of assignment.

 

I recieved a letter today (dated 4th July 2008 incidentally!) from Transcom, saying a copy of the agreement is not available as "Orange agreements are services which are invoced monthly and are therefore exepmt from the Cosumer Credit Act". And now they want payment within 7 days!!! (I'm not certain whether thats today or 4th July to be honest!)

 

So what do I do next. I dont know who is dealing with the debt - Cope's (who I wrote to) or Transcom (who I recieved the response from). Also, they can't prove its my debt, yet I can't prove its not?

 

Should I write back to both and request the default notice and deed of assignment? Surely they must have those?

 

Or do I just wait for more letters and threatening phone calls?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Guy

[locutus]

1st thing don't panic. Debt Collection Agencies are all mouth no action.

 

Most of your questions are answered very well in this thread

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/telecoms-mobile-fixed/162548-please-help-new-post.html

remember to tick the scales of anyone who provides useful information

[legalpickle]

Subject Access Request is first move.

 

Whatever you do, don't let them in or sign any letters to them.

 

Send all letters by special delivery, not recorded delivery as is not guaranteed.

[jonni2bad]

They are correct in terms of the agreement, by the way. Mobile phone contracts are not subject to the CCA so there is no need for them to supply a copy in that manner.

 

They should be willing and able to supply other documentation though.

[rory32]

Mobile phone contracts are not subject to the CCA so there is no need for them to supply a copy in that manner.

 

Completely wrong I'm afraid. It depends on the type of contract Jonni. Some are, some (not all) are not. Althougfh if the phone is free the CCA doesn't apply occassionally it does. Different scenarios are shown below.

 

If they include the cost of the phone and make you pay that over a course of payments greater than 4, then effectively it is a hire purchase agreement (so is covered). If the mobile phone is free, then it would normally be a service contract (so not covered). A few mobile phone agreements are done through a finance plan; these would also be credit agreement.

 

Although generally, the most useful thing to look out for is unfair terms and conditions (i.e. they can cancel without giving you the same right, they can vary the price for the same level of service without your permission), payment plan insurance, termination and penalty charges. So you should certainly get that SAR in.

[jonni2bad]

...It depends on the type of contract Jonni. Some are, some (not all) are not. Althougfh if the phone is free the CCA doesn't apply occassionally it does...

 

Happily corrected. I was under the impression that mobile phone contracts were not covered (I'm not talking about deals with phones, by the way, just a plain old mobile service provision).

 

If there are factors involved which would mean that this is not true, might I ask you to highlight this in the sticky thread on this very forum (which I recall was made by Buzby)?

 

Cheers

j2b

[legalpickle]

A Subject Access Request is a Data Protection Disclosure Demand. It is similar but not the same as a CCA disclosure demand.

 

They are still obliged to disclose the information, irrelevant of whether it is covered by the CCA or not.

[Human Writes]

In terms of Orange contracts the phone is classed as a free gift/inducement to enter the contract so the CCA does not apply.

 

I believe para 14 of the standard terms they've been using for several years states that your phone is obtained outside the terms of the contract, which are terms for supply of network services only.

 

Basically an Orange contract is a service agreement not a credit or hire agreement.

[legalpickle]

All this talk of the CCA is irrelevant because a Subject Access Request is under the Data Protection Act not under the Consumer Credit Act, so is still necessary and relevant in the circumstances.

 

A Subject Access Request is asking for all information about the customer that is held on that company's systems. This makes no difference if the contract is in accordance with the CCA or not!

[gdbevan]

Just to let you all know, I supplied a copy of my credit file which showed I only had on Orange contract before the dates they stated which shows as settled and that I switched to O2 the same month.

 

The details were passed on to Orange who have accepted that its not my debt and everyone has now stopped harrassing me!!

 

Now to stop the PPC letters and get A&L to remove the charges default from my credit file....

 

Thanks to all for your help

[legalpickle]

Just to let you all know, I supplied a copy of my credit file which showed I only had on Orange contract before the dates they stated which shows as settled and that I switched to O2 the same month.

 

The details were passed on to Orange who have accepted that its not my debt and everyone has now stopped harrassing me!!

 

Now to stop the PPC letters and get A&L to remove the charges default from my credit file....

 

Thanks to all for your help

Well done!!! Good luck with the others.

[locutus]

Well done! They took their time though! Your credit rating will have been lowered for 10 months!