mackerel vs barclaycard! ***WON***

[mackerel]

Thanks for getting the advice slick, and giving it steven

 

A few more questions i'm afraid unitl i can post this baby off!

 

a. Do i need to put anywhere in the POC that they already refunded me £200 previously? Otherwise the SOC will be showing a figure that is £200 higher than i am claiming for. Is that relevant?

 

b.

(3) Interest in restitution of £xxx at the defendant's normal interest rate of xx% compounded up until date of claim and at a daily compound rate of x% until judgement or sooner payment

...should this be the amount of interest i'm claiming? I have entered this paragraph in my POC as:

 

"Interest in restitution of £933.57 at the defendant's normal interest rate of 16.60% [my interest rate as it appears / is calculated on my SOC] compounded up until date of claim and at a daily compound rate of 0.04209% [my interest rate as a daily figure/ divided by 365?]"

Is that correct?

 

c.

(4) If the court is not minded to grant compound interest, interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of payment of the Charge to date in the sum of £[xxx.xx ], and at the daily rate of [ xx ] until judgment or sooner payment.

I think you mentioned before that the daily rate is 39.6p, but how do i calculate the section that states "at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of payment of the Charge to date in the sum of £[xxx.xx ]"?

Is it that NASA looking thing you said:

(1+APR)^(1/365)-1

- if so, how do i use that to calculate that value i need to enter in red? Do i need to apply the 40p interest to every charge or is it to the overall amount i'm claiming for? I may need to point out that the spreadsheet i'm using has not generated an 8% interest - i'm using stevens spreadsheet (interestcalc.xls) which simply calculates the interest on charges i believe? Should i copy and paste my charge entries into another spreadsheet to get the 8% figure, if that is indeed what's missing?

 

d. Simple one this- do i assume that on the POC, where it says "Claim No. [...]", i leave a big space between the square brackets for the person at the courts to write in pen the claim number? Do i just walk into court and hand them this document and wait for them to assign it a claim number?

Edited July 6, 2008 by mackerel

[steven4064]

Hi mackerel

 

a. Yes, you should put a statement in that £200 has already been refunded and adjust your claimed amount accordingly.

 

b. The paragraph is correct (your daily rate is correct but it is not the APR/365 - that would be 0.045%)

 

c. the s69 interest is calculated by the spreadshett. If not, you need to work out the number of days between the charge date and the claim date (call that 'n') Then the interest at 8% on each charge 'c' is

 

c * 0.08 * n / 365

Then add them all together.

 

The daily rate is 0.022% or 20.5p/day

 

(the "NASA looking thing" is the formula the streadsheet uses to calculate the compound interest)

 

d. Yes and Yes (last 'yes' - alternatively youcan leave it with them and they will inform you of teh claim number by post)

[mackerel]

Thanks for the help steven

 

Ammended my POC to contain the following - does it seem ok?

17.The Defendant wrongly applied Charges to the Account totalling some £1220.40 from or around 08/1999 to 6th July 2008. Particulars appear from Schedule 2.

 

18. The Defendant repaid £200 in charges when requested on 27th April 2006. This is deducted from the amount being claimed. On 6th May 2008 the Claimant demanded further repayment of the remaining sums wrongly applied.

 

19. The claimant is requesting repayment of charges totalling £1020.40.

And the Claimant claims:

 

(1) A declaration that the sums totalling £1020.40 have wrongly been applied to the Account.

 

(2) Payment of the said sum of £1020.40 and interest of £933.57 applied by the Defendant thereon.

 

(3) Interest in restitution of £933.57 at the defendant's normal interest rate of 16.60% compounded up until date of claim and at a daily compound rate of 0.04209% until judgement or sooner payment,

I'm hoping it doesn't leave a massive legal loophole for bc to squirm out of anywhere?

As for the 8%, i added another column to the spreadsheet, and used this formula:

=(B14*0.08)*(D14/365)

(where Bx is the charge amount and Dx is the number of days since the charge was levied)

...then drilled it down. Seems to have filled out everything ok, and i now have 8% interest column (woot!) giving me £337.97. Does that sound ok or way off? If it sounds fishy, i can post the spreadsheet here?

 

This means the final paragraph is question is as follows:

(4) If the court is not minded to grant compound interest, interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of payment of the Charge to date in the sum of £337.97, and at the daily rate of 20.5p until judgment or sooner payment.

[steven4064]

There is still something wrong here - the interest in (2) and (3) is exactly the same - that is very suspicious. How were they calculated?

[mackerel]

so they don't refer to the same thing? I'm getting that value from the "Interest" column (E11) from the spreadsheet.

 

[steven4064]

No they don't. To claim interest in restitution you need to understand what you are doing.

 

What I suggest is that you could use the interest column from the spreadsheet as your estimate of interest levied on the charges (item (2) in your POC), ditch item (3) and reword item (4) (now (3)) as

 

"(3) Interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of payment of the Charge to date in the sum of £337.97, and at the daily rate of 20.5p until judgment or sooner payment."

 

Using the interest column as an estimate of interest levied is not too far out if your card balance was always near the limit, which it seems to have been given the 'over credit limit' charges.

[mackerel]

I added that from post #50, but i'm glad you spotted it - is claiming interest in restitution the basis of the sempra case? I don't want to take it that far - just charges, interest and 8% will suffice. So it now looks like:

 

And the Claimant claims:

 

(1) A declaration that the sums totalling £1020.40 have wrongly been applied to the Account.

 

(2) Payment of the said sum of £1020.40 and interest of £933.57 applied by the Defendant thereon.

 

(3) Interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of payment of the Charge to date in the sum of £337.97, and at the daily rate of 20.5p until judgment or sooner payment.

Apart from that, was everything else ok? The statement about the previous repayment of £200 etc?

 

Thanks steven.

 

edit: just wondered, adding the 8% to the charges - do i need to add 8% to interest on charges too?

Edited July 7, 2008 by mackerel

[steven4064]

Yes, you can add 8% to the interest too.

[mackerel]

Ok, added the 8% to the interest too using the same principle as explained above. Here's a screencap:

 

 

Does that seem ok, at a glance? Do i now need to amend my POC anywhere to include the fact i'm claiming 8% on the interest too?

[steven4064]

Looks OK

 

Just amend your POC to reflec the total of the two 8% interest columns.

[mackerel]

(3) Interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of payment of the Charge to date in the sum of £337.97 relating to the charges and £339.74 relating to the interest applied to the charges, and at the daily rate of 20.5p until judgment or sooner payment.

Is that clear enough?

 

ps. If barclays settle before it goes to court, i can't claim the 8% too can i? As in i don't include it in the settlement figure - i only get (both lots of) the 8% if the court awards in favour of me, if i go through the whole legal procedure. Is that correct?

[steven4064]

I think I would still add them together to try and head off the interest-on-interest argument that the banks often come up with (completely spuriuosly) ".... in the sum of £677.71 and at a daily rate of ..."

[mackerel]

Point taken. POC ammended.

 

I'm ready to go to the courts now!!! Thanks for your help over the past couple of days

[mackerel]

Filed at court today, should get a court date within a week

[mackerel]

Got a Notice of Issue from the courts the other day - was deemed served on the 2nd august, they have until the 18th of august to reply.

 

I am sorely tempted to tick box B - 'the defendant admits all the money is owed' and send it back

[mackerel]

Well, not sure how to proceed now. The 18th has been and gone, and i've left a couple more days just because i know how barclaycard love to reply at the last minute. Had nothing in my postbox from barclays or the courts.

 

Shall i now return the bottom half of the Notice Of Issue, for the Request For Judgement?

[slick132]

Hi Mack,

 

Next step is to call the court and ask if BC have Acknowledged your claim - they may well have done at the last minute or even done it late, in which case it will probably still be accepted.

 

Let us know what the court says.

[mackerel]

ok slick, i phoned the court today, and they hadn't put in a defence. So i ticked box A on the notice of issue - that they hadn't put in a defence, wrote in the amount due (total claim + 20.5p per day since date of issue; just over £5) and handed it in. Should hear back in a couple of days.

[slick132]

This is interesting - twould be nice if that's it and you get Judgement against them.

[mackerel]

This is interesting - twould be nice if that's it and you get Judgement against them.

 

i know...seems almost too easy. When i handed it in yesterday they checked again and said they had still not recieved any defence, but she was saying something like if they do put in a late defence it may still be accepted or something, even though the date has passed?

[mackerel]

I'm not sure if i should be or

 

Got a letter in the post this morning - a copy of a Judgement for Claimant (in default) addressed to barclaycard ordering them to pay up the full amount since they never replied to the claim form.

 

I think i've won?

[slick132]

Fantastic news. Although I'd keep to the just now as they may still contest the case on the basis that they overlooked it.

 

Write to BC and tell them you'd like a cheque by return or you'll send in the Bailiffs.

[mackerel]

Heard nothing from barclaycard or the courts since i received the judgement by default. Phoned up my local courts yesterday, and was told that although they hadn't (yet) applied for the judgement to be set-aside, since the judgement was served on an address with a PO box (the northampton address), it's almost impossible to enforce.

 

Should i write to them asking for payment? And if they refuse, knowing that their business address is unenforcable?

[slick132]

You could contact BLT, by phone initially then by email. Tell them you have a Judgement against them and require payment or you'll be sending in the bailiffs (along with any TV film crews that are interested).

 

Also see here -

 

Judgement: How to Enforce

How to enforce a Judgement.

Judgement: How to get Paid

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...t-how-get.html

[mackerel]

I emailed them, and got a reply saying i could speak to a customer account manager 24 hours a day, 7 days a week - so i put that to the test and phoned them at 2am Sunday. Shouldn't have been surprised to be told to call back after 9am, so that i did, and was told that they had sent me a letter on the 3rd September, which should take 15 days to get to me. I'm assuming it's one of those "admit confidentiality and have your money back" forms, but the fact remains that was almost 2 weeks that they "sent" this letter. Just mailed them again, reminding them judgement was declared on the 28th August, and i was to only wait up to 4 days to recieve payment.

 

Will post more when i hear more.