Okay - the judge asked me for a statement of why I thought the charges were unfair, along with a list of said charges, as the amount of space on the moneyclaim did not give much room to expand. Do you think the below statement is enough or should I expand. I would love to put a bit more. Obviously this statement is just taken out of the library. Can i also ask that as I requested 'interest pursuant to s69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum' which stood at £668.06 at the time of claiming in June. Does this continue to go up whilst Abbey are arguing the toss. If so how do I explain to the court that that figure has changed (or will the judge work that one out) Any help would be appreciated as I do not want to cock this up at this stage. Abbey then have a further 14 days to provide their forensic accountants expert evidence. PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1. The Claimant [has] [had] an account 1 ("the Account") with the Defendant which was opened on or around 2 [and closed on or around 2 ] 2. During the period in which the Account [has been] [was] operating the Defendant debited numerous charges to the Account in respect of purported breaches of contract on the part of the Claimant and also charged interest on the charges once applied. The Claimant understands that the Defendant contends that the charges were debited in accordance with the terms of the contract between itself and the Claimant. 3. A list of the charges applied is attached to these particulars of claim. 4. The Claimant contends that: a) The charges debited to the Account are punitive in nature; are not a genuine pre-estimate of cost incurred by the Defendant; exceed any alleged actual loss to the Defendant in respect of any breaches of contract on the part of the Claimant; and are not intended to represent or related to any alleged actual loss, but instead unduly enrich the Defendant which exercises the contractual term in respect of such charges with a view to profit. b) The contractual provision that permits the Defendant to levy such charges is unenforceable by virtue of the Unfair Contract Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations (1999), the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and the common law. 5. Accordingly the Claimant claims: a) the return of the amounts debited in respect of charges in the sum of £ 3 and any interest charged thereon; b) Court costs; c) Interest pursuant to section 69 County Courts Act as set out on the attached list of charges or at such rate and for such periods as the court deems just. I believe that the contents of these particulars of claim are true

I haven't written my statement yet. I will aim to do it tonight and post on here to see if everyone agrees. The other development is that Abbey have served a notice of default on me. The difference between what I owe them and my bank charges is £1700, which I can't afford to pay. I have been paying it at £150 per month but they have never ever said what would be acceptable as a monthly payment (except the full amount). Will post later.

Okay - I have kind of recovered now, and I need to do my bit first. The judge said that as I filed my claim online and there is limited space to detail my claim, I must send a statement into the court as to why I think my charges are unfair along with a breakdown of my charges. Any clues as to what to put. I have looked in the library and looked at the N1 form details, but it doesn't seem to go into very much detail as to why I think the charges are unfair. Can anyone help with the wording. I have about 11 days left. Then Abbey have another 14 days to send in their evidence!

LOL, sorry I got locked out and had to go to my friends. I was so hyped up she gave me a drink, so now here I sit three sheets to the wind. What did I learn. - take a bloody pen with you for a start!!! AND The judge was totally on my side. He was lovely. Abbey wanted to fast track my claim - although it was under 5k they said with the two 'expert' witnessess they wanted to produce it would take the trial to three days, thus costs would be exorbitant ( maybe hoping I would capitulate and give up). However, my judge disagreed - it actually only seemed to be a conversation between Abbey and the judge (it was someone instructed on behalf of DLA Piper by the way). He deemed the forensic expert advice okay but the 'banking industry expert' they wanted to produce should be a senior member of Abbey bank and not an 'expert'. Basically he decided that three hours was enough time (given the number of cases going on all over the country at the moment). He actually did state at one point that surely the bank must already have the expert evidence to hand. So what is next. He set a timetable. I am to produce in the next fourteen days, for the benefit of the court, a schedule of the charges (this has already been sent to DLA - not to the court) along with a detailed explanation of why I think the charges are unfair. Abbey then have fourteen days after that to produce their expert evidences report. I then have fourteen further days to question the expert evidence. Then we both have 28 days to produce a bundle of documents. (that DLA have to help me with, as I am not an expert) and then a date for trial will be set for Feb. UNLESS as the judge pointed out - a case is heard in the meantime. The judge asked me if i had anything to add - I told him I was going to be my expert witness. He laughed and said me and the expertise of the CAG website. I am sure that if the bank produce an expert witness a pig may fly across the sky - but who knows. One thing I am sure of is I am not scared and more than happy to go to court again. Although I may take a pen next time.

Hi ho hi ho its off to court I go. In work till 1.30 then off to court. No offer as yet though i left before the post, so we shall see. Will log back on later and tell what happens. Glenn - not forgotten, a little stressed, too much going on, may ring you later

Their approach has been 'hands on' and pro-active throughout long and complex transactions." Taken from the website. No wonder Abbey are using them then, they are experts at LONG and complex transactions!!!!

I think its delaying tactics. A lot of cases are now going to the court stage - including a court hearing for me on TUESDAY! I wonder what will happen to mine??

Hi Glenn Thanks for your advice - really useful. Could you pm me the report? Is that possible. Also any advice on where I might find the statistics on the cases that Abbey are defending (or even capitulated on) for my table. Is that on the forum somewhere - or is it a case of just reading through the posts and adding it up. Not a problem either way, I am more than prepared to put the legwork in. I am also quite happy to trot off to court too. Its in Redditch by the way, so if anyone is in the vicinity I will be more than happy for the support.

It is for my claim against Abbey for bank charges. Story so far. Claim online for £4,000 bank charges (including interest) Defended by Abbey on usual grounds. 50% offered by DLA Piper and refused by me. Allocation questionaire completed by me. Allocation questionaire completed by DLA Piper stating they were going to use 'expert evidence'. Judge ordered that Abbey declare details of their 'expert evidence' Abbey declared that their 'expert evidence' would be the foresenic accountant stuff that I think Karnevil has detailed in his thread. Now a judge has ordered that both parties attend Court next Tuesday to discuss the 'merits' of the case and to decide which track the case should be in.

I received this letter yesterday and wondered if you could all help. The 'judge' has considered the statements of case and allocation questionaires submitted in this claim and has decided that a hearing is necessary before a final decision about allocation can be made. Reasons for the hearing are as follows: 1. To examine the merits of the claim 2. To examine the merits of the defence 3. To enquiry(sic) what expert evidence should be allowed for each party. 4. Whether the case should be a SCT one or such other track as the parties suggest and the court decides. The 'judge' orders you to attend at 14:00 on the 10th October 2006 at the court. I have a couple of questions. I am quite prepared to pull together my 'court pack' as recommended in the library and take that along, but am I doing the right thing. Has anyone else had this? If so any advice. Is SCT small claims track? I now have brown pants on, although I am quite prepared to go all the way!

I agree - write to them and inform them that the account is in dispute and they cannot action a ccj. It will be a long way off. They have been threatening me with this for a long time. However, I have been paying them a token amount every month as a sign of good will and in the hope that it if ever does go to court a judge would look favourably on me. However, I am only doing this because what I owe is more than I would have refunded in charges.

I seem to be in much the same position with regard to default. In fact my letter looks identical to yours. As soon as I started reclaiming bank charges, they withdrew my overdraft, charged me extortionate interest rates and have threatened to default me, as well as dragging their heels over repaying my bank charges. I have threatened to report them to the ombudsman, and I am awaiting a response to my last letter. I would do what has been suggested, and estimate your charges, although to be honest, if I had estimated mine, I would have underestimated. I nearly threw up when I realised how much money I had wasted over the years.

Analytical and forensic accounting examination of charges and comparison of charges within the industry. Am I being a bit thick here. The judge had ordered the Abbey to detail the 'expert evidence' that they would be using in my trial by the 19th of September. A letter sent to the court on the 18th stated the above, which seems to have been detailed on your AQ oddfellow! Is this classed as details of the 'expert evidence'. I actually expected to see what evidence they were going to produce. Is what they have stated sufficient. What do you think will happen next, a court date for the hearing?

I had a business account with Lloyds TSB that was virtually unused, due to things going a bit pear shaped personally at the begining of the year. I had one direct debit set up and as there was no money in the account it bounced on a couple of occasions resulting in charges of £113 being applied. They apparently wrote to me and advised me that they were closing my account. I was unaware of this and paid a cheque into the account. It took 4 weeks for me to get my money from the debt management department of Lloyds TSB and they deducted the £113 from the cheque. This £113 had been 'written off' at the time of the account closure but they decided to ressurrect it and deduct it off my money. I have written to Lloyds and queried why they took so long to pay and why they had deducted an amount of money previously written off. Following a fob off letter I have again written to complain. Does anyone think I should send another letter starting a claim for my charges back or should I wait to hear from them with regards to my original letter of complaint. I haven't really said that their charges are unlawful therefore they shouldn't have deducted the money. Any help would be appreciated

Hi Flames Just read your posts and replied over there but I forgot to add that I have not had a further offer just yet from DLA. Will have to check the post when i get home. Thanks

Did you provide a breakdown of how your charges were made up when you filed your claim online. Has anyone from DLA Piper asked you to provide a list of your charges and interest and how this is made up. ? It sounds to me like the judge is asking you to provide the court with a list of how your claim is made up. If you have already provided this evidence then ring and let them know, but I would send them another copy just to be on the safe side. HTH

Hi Flames thanks for replying to my post, it is nice to find someone at the same stage as me! Although my 'expert' should be sending his evidence in by today, yours should be in by the 21st September. I haven't had a letter saying that the experts report isn't ready, unless it has come in the post this morning. I will look when I get home and reply again. This waiting and stalling game is killing me!

Well today is the day that Abbey are supposed to send their 'expert evidence' to the court. Should I ring the court and find out if they have. What if they haven't - can I then write to the judge and ask that a judgement be issued?

I am a lot further down the line than you. I am waiting for Abbey to provide 'expert evidence' in defence to my claim. They have also closed my account and are now threatening to default me. My charges are less than the default amount though, and it is my understanding that only the amount in dispute can stop a default being issued. I am however going to try to stop them. I think there is a standard letter you can send them called the s10 and it is in the library template. I think expecting a reply from last week is a little optimistic. Abbey have managed to ignore virtually EVERY letter I have sent them with regard to reducing my overdraft. When all this is over I am going to complain to the financial ombudsman

Thanks Lula I will keep an eye on your case as it seems to be just behind mine. This just seems to be dragging on and on. We are now in debt management with the Abbey and they have threatened to default our account if we don't pay back our overdraft. Unfortunately the overdraft is more than the bank charges reclaim. We are paying them back a monthly amount but the interest at the moment is virtually swallowing the whole of the monthly payment.

Having taken the Abbey to court, I have refused their 50% offer, completed the Allocation Questionaire and Abbey now have until the 19th September to submit their 'expert evidence' - is anyone else at this stage and have they ever submitted evidence.

Hi Jayne As you know I offered to settle for 100% of the charges, the court fee but dropping the interest element. I gave them til today to respond. They haven't, so I will be filling in my allocation questionaire tonight and sending tomorrow. I am a bit unsure as to whether I am glad now that they haven't responded. I had to agree to pay the difference between my outstanding charges claim and the balance by the 1st September to avoid my account being defaulted. The interest comes to nearly £700 so that would be a help. Well done for winning! I am chuffed for you.

I am with the Abbey. When my OH got made redundant and then I got made redundant too (and consequently going to employment tribunal) Abbey threatened to withdraw our Overdraft. On the promise that both our salaries got paid into the bank they would not withdraw the overdraft. However, before our salaries were paid in they wrote to us to tell us that they were taking the overdraft off us. This meant I had no choice but to put my money somewhere else otherwise we could not have eaten! I then made proposals to pay by email - was ignored. I then sent a recorded delivery letter with my proposals - which they ignored. I then telephoned them to be told that they were awaiting the outcome of my court case for reclaiming charges and they would put the account on hold for two weeks. NOW they are threatening to default me in the next week. I have managed to get a stay of execution for a month but this means me trying to find £3,000 by the end of the month - no mean feat. I feel like I am being threatened due to my claim for bank charges.

I too thought it was against the banking code to enter a default whilst we were in dispute, but they have rung me to tell me that they have taken legal advice and that they must continue their collection methods until the dispute is resolved. Even if the charges were paid back I would still owe them £3,000. I have managed to negotiate a months stay by agreeing to pay my overdraft back in a months time. (I may just be able to manage this with freelance work and overtime that my OH has earned) but this may have been avoided if they had entered into a dialogue with me back in April, or if they had stuck to their word and not taken my overdraft facility off me. Don't worry about us struggling - we have been, but light is at the end of the tunnel, we have gone through the worst and it is just Abbey who are now to be paid back.

Following my redundancy in Jan we had problems with our bank. They withdrew our overdraft facility and we had no option but to pay money into a different account. I have started my claim against Abbey and it is at the allocation questionare stage at the moment. I first approached Abbey with repayment proposals in May. They ignored me and I sent a recorded delivery letter with repayment proposals. Again no reply. I got a letter stating we were ignoring them, and I called them up. they asked me how my court case was going. I told them - you should know, its against the Abbey!' She didn't but said she would put the account on hold for two weeks and said that maybe we will have heard about the court case by then. I got a phone call on Saturday and basically they have now told me that they are going to default our account. They have said that they will amend any default once the case has gone ahead and a decision has been reached. There will still be a balance of about £2,000 if my charges are repaid. I have had to agree to pay this by the end of August if I am to avoid a default notice. Does anyone have any links to sites about default notices, ie when you can issue one. They are basically saying that they can issue a default notice, because I have made no attempt to pay. I thought a default couldn't be given if the balance was in dispute. Can anyone help????