Ford Motor Co v Armstrong (1915) says that It is also a penalty where the consumer is to pay a larger sum due to failure to pay a smaller sum. So the size of the breach in relation to the "damages" is very important. Or I might have this out of context with what you were saying, BF. I have had £10 s/o and DD bounced and then charge £28.50 for them!!

I would go the full DPA route (see library) as the request for information relating to manual intervention is key to any possible defence they might offer. Statements, although fine for totalling up, won't show this. Patience my friend..... Interesting meeting if she wouldn't let you say anything! Did you tell them beforehand what you wanted to speak to them about? Martin

This was the Ford Pinto. The car had a neat feature of bursting into flames when it was rear-ended. This was because the fuel tank was between the rear axle and the rear bumper. In a rear shunt, the tank would split, dump fuel everywhere, and the sparks caused by broken lights would ignite the fuel. A lawyer acting for families of people burned or killed found an internal document where, yes, Ford had indeed decided that given the amount of money to fix the problem on one car, was say $11 (it really was that small) multiplied by xx million cars per year, compared to the compensation paid out to families of the dead/maimed, it was cheaper to let 'em burn. The judge fined Ford $350million in punative damages. A record at the time. The Edsel was the car released under a fanfare (Edsel was one of Ford's sons names) and it flopped badly.

Worth remembering that in supplying a service, the garage has to deliver with a reasonable degree of skill and care, and also they can't contract out of their negligence liabilities. SOGAS is linked in the library. Although last time I looked,the link didn't work. Martin

Your local council has a place which does all the MOTs for its scores of vehicles. Because they are subject to the same requirements as Fred's MOTs, they have to be accessible to the public. The key is that they only do MOTs and therefore aren't interested in repairs. Funnily and spookily enough, the pass rate at these places is much much better than your average garage. Go figure, as the Americans say. You can find more information on this on http://www.moneysavingexpert.com

A little known way of getting your own back on them some more.... If you have a dispute with a retailer or service provider, and you paid by credit card, your credit card company is jointly responsible for resolving the situation. The parameters are that the purchase is for more than £100 and not more than £30 000. So you could buy a car on credit card and chase them when it turns out to be a lemon. So if you've been ripped off or are unstatisfied, and attempts to get satisfaction with the retailer/service provider have got you nowhere, get on the credit card's case and make them responsible for sorting it. However, this does not apply when you use the cheques that some credit card companies provide. Or if your purchase is overseas. Consumer Credit Act 1974 s75 http://www.oft.gov.uk/News/Press+releases/2004/186-04.htm

At my company I get 104 days off per year. They're called Saturday and Sunday. Also if I am ill on a Friday, they give you two days off automatically.

I think that it largely depends on what was said in the meeting, whether you gave them case law references etc, whether the meeting was recorded in any way. Also depends who you saw. The person you saw probably has no mandate to do anything anyway. If it was a simple 2 min lecture from them about T&C then I would go the prelim route, then LBA. They could possibly deny the meeting, or claim that certain things weren't said and would say that by going straight to LBA you are being unreasonable. Martin

BankFodder I have an idea for something here, but want to keep it quiet for the moment, can I PM you please? Thanks, Martin

yes that thought had already occurred to me. watch this space.....

My wife called me to tell me about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard of. She wrote a cheque for £66 which, at the time it was presented, was more than she had remaining to her overdraft limit. Abbey paid it out, which took her over her overdraft limit, (for which a £20 charge was applied) then they decided to bounce the cheque, so paid back in the £66 taking her above the overdraft limit again! So she was charged £20 for the three micro-seconds it took the automated system to play its "will I won't I" game. They then charged her £35 for bouncing the cheque. so a total of £55 for one event. Talk about having your bloody cake and eating it!! GRRRRR! To make matters worse (the original debt was settled by cash following the initial bounce)the bank then re-presented the cheque and the whole cycle was repeated. Another £55!! My wife phoned to find outwhat was happening, and she was told that the other bank would present the cheque up to 4 times!! This cycle would repeat unless she cancelled the cheque. (She wasn't told of this when she called them last Friday when the cheque first bounced). The telephone banker was very pleasant apparently and said that she could waive up to £50 per year in charges and my wife's account hadn't had this yet this year, so instead of £110 she will only be charged £60 for bouncing a cheque. This must be a new record!! My wife phoned me and said "I've had a wonderful experience with the bank, they've been ever so helpful." I said that I suspected that there were on a charm offensive to prevent people becoming so irate that they might even sue them!

Pipelinecard.org, which is a scheme run by one of the 2000 fuel protestors, is about approaching a major petrol retailer and saying "hey, we have 150 000 subscribers, if we all promise to get our fuel from only you, give us a discount in the 5-10p per litre region". It's then gone about getting as many people as possible registered, and its done this via publicity (Martin Lewis again) and press releases. A lot of people have bought car stickers from the site. Could we have some designed and sold for, say £10? Any profit could go towards books, resources, hosting etc? (I'm not trying to plug Pipelinecard, just drawing a similar analogy re:publicity) Just a suggestion Martin

Sent by secure message last night, faxed to Northampton this evening, posted to Northampton tomorrow!! Try claiming they didn't receive it!!! GRRRRR!!!

Yes, the very chap!! I hope he's been to Staples recently and bought lots of IN trays! Ha!! Martin

How do you make a "Sticky" with the new software? Data Protection Team, Nationwide Building Society Kings Park road, Moulton Park Northampton NN3 6NW Tel 01604 855060 Fax 01604 854933

Hi, I know other users with Nationwide have gone to the branch. However, my experience is that whoever you send it to, it will get forwarded to the department dealing with Data Protection. When I get home I will post a sticky with DP contact details. Cheers, M

Message received from Nationwide re: DPR My reply this evening: If anyone spots any errors, please let me know. Thanks M

mobiles often have a record facility built in. This can be transferred to a PC. My nokia does and was used for the firsttime with Sainsbury's Visa at the weekend. Martin

If I didn't know better, I would suspect that it's an attempt to fob me off!! I am a bit undecided as to whether I should chort circuit the system and go to the branch as you say. Unfortunately, statements alone are not all the information I require. I want the disclosure of manual intervention too. They say that they have ordered the statements..... I was a bit surprised to see in their letter "tell us where to look, and who you spoke to and when, and we might have a go at looking for you". Not good enough I thought. I think the letter will have to go off along the lines I mentioned. Unless someone else has a better plan? thanks, Martin

That's a heck of an hourly rate for someone to look at that cheque for long enough to determine its over £10. Either that or a VERY thick person. Who knows. Could be either. Martin

Letter received today from Nationwide: Not the reply I was hoping for. Firstly, those damned forms!! I don't need to write one out, and does the DPA really need a signature when a) the request came from a secure messaging area of the online banking site and b) it's being posted to the address where the account is registered. My reply will be in writing, using their envelope, (can/should I still do recorded delivery?) along these lines. "My requests were from your secure messaging area, so I do not believe that a signature is necessary, it is not a requirement of the Act. I made two requests via this route, on the 8th and 9th of March, regarding my current account and credit card account, detailing my account numbers clearly in each message already. Both messages were clearly marked "Data Protection Act Disclosure Request". Both requests were quite clear and exact in specifying the information I require. The 40days, then, starts from 8th and 9th March respectively not the date you receive this letter. The form you have asked me to fill in is not a requirement of the Act and is not necessary for my message to be a Data Protection Act Disclosure request." Does this seem ok?

Dave - if I'm not mistaken, this is at least the second time I've seen this question asked today alone. One for the FAQs? The answer is, in reality, whichever you are more comfortable with. However, due to the way the County Court system works, if this gets to court it will be sent to the court nearest to the address of the defendant. If this is the branch, then the case will be near to you, assuming that the branch is near you. If you fill in the papers against the head office, the case will probably go to the court nearest to head office, which may not be near you. Make your decision and try to deal with the same people throughout. Don't switch between head office and branch. Statements will do, or if you can get a list of charges then this will work also. Don't forget to ask for disclosure of manual intervention. Good luck! Not that you will need it! Martin

I would stick with the branch. Particularly if you have regular contact with them. Ultimately when you file the court papers, if you file against head office, the case will be heard whereever head office is. File against your branch and chances are the case will be heard where your branch is.

Nationwide NEVER EVER write to me to tell me that charges will be applied. My first written notice of this is when I get my statements, after the money has been stolen, i mean, taken. In truth, I do get notified because the people trying to take the DD usually notify that it hasn't gone through Not all though. O2 policy is that they cut off your phone and wait for you to call in and find out why. The person I spoke to admitted that this is to save costs.

My recommendation to you is to read firstly the FAQs and then the rest of the forum. Read about what other people are doing, and you will see lots of messages with the answers you require. I'm not trying to be unhelpful but your case may well go to court and YOU will be the one arguing the case. YOU need to KNOW what you are talking about in order to convince the judge. So please, (and I say this kindly) do your own research on this forum. Don't be in a rush, and you will be better off in the long term. I promise.