kkpc0703
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PCN Box junction - Pls Help
kkpc0703 replied to kkpc0703's topic in Local Authority Parking and Traffic Offences
One thing I would say that when I entered into the box the cars ahead were moving with no blockage imminent on the exit. But the red taxi in the front chose to stop (when the space ahead of it was available) in order to allow pedestrians to cross. But then all along I thought that the camera operator will know all that and I can't be possibly be issued for such a brief stoppage anyway. -
PCN Box junction - Pls Help
kkpc0703 replied to kkpc0703's topic in Local Authority Parking and Traffic Offences
I have just managed to upload the video here The vehicle stops at 0:58 -
I have just received PCN for 'entering and stopping in a box junction when prohibited'. PCN code is not given. This is the first of this kind for me and I have no idea what chance I have to make a successful appeal against this. But I know that the overall stoppage was no more than 10 seconds near the exit of the junction when a car ahead of me stopped despite some available space in its front.
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They have actually rejected my 'late representation' made after receiving their CC. They did not earlier consider it at all and replied with their letter that it was out of time. But I called them two days ago and drew their attention to the series of emails which were not dealt with appropriately and that these were all in time. I also drew their attention to the adjudication decision on the previous PCN. They have now cancelled CC but served NoR with the CD of footage. Is it worth raising any point in relation to the actual contravention in my submissions to the adjudication (now that I have seen the CD and the council are likely raise it to the adjudication) or to just stick to PI? I think I have duplicated the message after confusing few options on the Thread. My apologies.
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They have actually rejected my 'late representation' made after their CC. They did not earlier consider it at all and replied with their letter that it was out of time. But I called them two days ago and drew their attention to the series of emails which were not dealt with appropriately and that these were all in time. I also drew their attention to the adjudication decision on the previous PCN. They have now cancelled CC but served NoR with the CD of footage. Is it worth raising any point in relation to the actual contravention in my submissions to the adjudication (now that I have seen the CD and the council are likely raise it to the adjudication) or to just stick to PI?
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They have actually not rejected my request for footage. But they have now considered my full representation made after CC and served NoR now. Earlier they did not consider it and replied with a letter saying it was out of time. But I called them and drew their attention to the series of emails for footage request which were not dealt with appropriately and to adjudication decision for the PCN dated 15/03. They have not canceled the PCN but served NoR with the CD of the footage now to allow me to go to adjudication again. Is it worth raising the contravention in my submission to adjudication or just stick to PI? Because the council will now say they have made CD available albeit late. Remember the above account is based on 'as far as I can reasonably recall' after such a long time.
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I have now received NoR from the council to my 'late representation'. They have cancelled the CC. Now I have the option of discount payment or going to the adjudication. They have sent NoR following my call to the council a couple of days ago as I had a feeling it would not be straightforward after order of recovery. But it is clear that CC should not have been served instead I should have been allowed to go to adjudication albeit by considering my late representation. They have also sent a CD this time which shows my car staying there for around 5 minutes. Seeing the footage and after confirming this with my wife I can recall it was the day when my young child vomited in the back seat, I parked there, my wife got out with my little daughter and went across the road to buy a pack of towels. All this time my young child can be seen through the car windows out of his child seat as it was not possible to restrain him while he was still soiled. The footage ends before showing my wife getting back to the car. The question now is whether the contravention occurred. If I go to adjudication, can I now raise any point in relation to the contravention especially when it was not raised at the representation or just stick to PI.
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A request for footage is not a FULL representation. I raised this point to the adjudicator in the previous case and the response confirms this. The council has now gone from one extreme to the other and missed the central point. I needed to view the footage in order to be able to make a FULL representation and to ascertain if the contravention occurred. But let me also say that eventually when the footage was made available for adjudication key details on the PCN were found incorrect.
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I am quite confused now. I would like to believe that the representation may be a single letter or a series of letters. In this case I initiated my representation by asking for video footage a number of times and expected the council to make arrangements for its viewing and to suspend progress until such time. Instead I received CC. Equally it would have been premature on part of the council to send NoR without the footage. My appeal to the council was out of time but was the last step of the overall representation which had been initiated in time. The question is whether the council should or should not have considered my video request as a representation especially when they had decided to send charge certificate. Please note in exactly the same situation for the PCN dated 15/03 they considered it my representation and now adopting a different strategy.
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Is it worth writing to the Council again before order of recovery is issued requesting them to reconsider their decision especially referring them to the adjudicator's decision on the separate PCN dated 15/03/2014? Please note the difference between the two cases is that the council considered my video request for PCN of 15/03 as the formal representation and sent NoR. In this case of 16/03 the video requests (that were in time) were not considered as the representation and the Charge certificate was sent. I made the appeal after the issue of charge certificate which was then considered out of time. Please advise on the ground(s) for the TE9 also.
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Hello Everyone. Please advise me in relation to the PCN with following details: Date of alleged contravention: 16/03/2014 Date of PCN: 25/03/2014 Contravention: Parked in a parking place or area not designated for that class of vehicle (code 23L) in a loading place for goods vehicle only I made a number of requests to view video recording of the evidence. This was not made available. Instead a charge certificate was sent. I then made the representation without seeing the evidence and without ascertaining whether the contravention occurred or not on grounds of procedural impropriety. Please see the attached representation letter for further details of the case. Now I have received the letter from the council stating that my appeal is out of time. I don’t even have the option of going to the adjudication. In a similar situation for the same code, I was allowed to go into adjudication and my appeal was allowed. Please see details of the other PCN on this link http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?423738-PCN-through-CCTV-camera-for-parking-in-a-loading-place-for-goods-vehicle-only-%28Code-23L%29-**PATAS-Appeal-Allowed** Any advice please.
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[ATTACH=CONFIG]51737[/ATTACH]Just received Adjudicator's reasons for the decision. It may help some. Thanks.
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Just coming back from PATAS. My appeal is allowed today. Thank you all for your support.
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They have not made any video available. I have not yet seen any video. I was told when the video is ready, I will get an email message. But I haven't received one. The link given on PCN only contains still images. I have been told there is a different link for videos but is not on PCN. You are right. Thank you for all the effort. I am going ahead with the appeal to adjudication.
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Just managed to scan the PCN. Actually I have attached the NoR too if that helps. I was not specific because I often stop the car on that location and could not be sure of what exactly happened on that day. Often this is just to drop my wife only to come back later to pick her up but sometimes I wait for her until she comes back. Durations varied from 2 mins to around 15 mins. I have to say all along I wrongly assumed 30 mins were allowed anyway.
