In other words, you can't back up your advice with any facts.

No, I said from my research plus my ex-wife's case (your beginning to see what you want rather than what's there so take a step back). My ex-wife received her CO over two years ago and hasn't spoken to her creditor since; despite the initial threats. It was only when I felt the creditor may come back that I started to read other people's experiences on CAG and other similar help sites to see what might happen. Without exception, I haven't found a single person on any site who ignored their creditor, after the CO stage, then have an OFS thrust upon them. Further research and helpful insights from people like Sequenci throw the reality of how likely it is for a creditor to gain an OFS. From what I can see, certainly for consumer debt, it's seems impossible and they know it (which is why they don't try.) And until I have any example that what I have researched is wrong, I shall continue to give the same advice that helps people get on with their life rather than see them fretting from the unsupported type of advice you are trying to push forward. You state you haven't got the time to research but I'm only looking for one example? How hard can that be if your advice stands up?

It's not a question of being an expert; it's a question of doing your research and seeing what the facts produce. You do, however, have the huge resources of the internet at your disposal to locate some examples to back up your assertions. But my assertion is you will not do so as I haven't been able to do so (but please let me know if you do!). I am, also, giving my advice based on that research and from the personal experience of my ex-wife who obtained a CO. Like many other people on here; she feared the worst but when you begin to look into what happens when a creditor gains a CO for consumer debt it's not terribly difficult to see why, given the facts, why they don't proceed with an OFS. If people are frightened to trust those facts then there is not much that can be done. But all I ask is people from your standpoint present some form of evidence to support your advice rather than just giving generic warnings without substance of how you might be right? It's the facts that are important not whose right or wrong.

All good bluster, but where are the examples to refute what I state? There are dozens of examples on CAG where people ignoring a creditor receive a CCJ; and there are also dozens of examples on CAG where people who further ignore a creditor obtain a CO. But this isn't what we are talking about here. So, please, show me some examples gained over your "many years of experience" (or even some here on CAG) where a person in Sue's situation is forced to sell their house. If you can't; then you are guilty of making judgements based on incorrect supposition rather than the actual facts.That is far more dangerous as it creates unnecessary fear whereby people make the wrong decision for their situation. Like i said previously, don't do their job for them.

You see, it's this type of comment that has people who really have nothing else to fear from their creditor (given the creditor has a CO) that gets them sweating and panicking about the "but what if!" scenario. It's a total nonsense and totally ignores the facts of what happens in this situation. Creditors are businesses pure and simple and, in this instance, they are using "business" tactics to see how far they can push to extract a quicker and more sizeable repayment. Saying they may "get one by default" is, apart from being total nonsense, doing there job for them. The simple "business" reason they wouldn't go for an OFS in a Sue's case is because she is (1) - Heavily mortgaged - so they could spend a lot of time, money and effort realising nothing (2) - Is a Joint Owner so there is even less to go after and (3) She has children living in the property as their main home. The key to knowing their hand is their continued silly persistence of asking for an I&E. As I've said before, given they are businesses if there was any chance they would get an OFS they wouldn't waste time messing around on this matter. It's why the court stats state reflect that only 0.3% of CO's ever progress to an OFS (which is even less than the Red Squirrel simile Sequenci used to describe their rarity.) And a simple scan of CAG or Google will see that OFS are restricted to cases where there is a council or government debt or a joint owner is trying to realise their half of the equity (but feel free to contradict me on this and lay out the examples of people in Sue's position have been forced to sell up.) As I said previously; decide on the facts, people, not the fear.

(My bold) Will you make an absolute guarantee it won't happen by restitution if it does??

I think it's better to remember Sequenci's comment that OFS's are rarer than Red Squirrels. This is for consumer debt, it isn't going to happen.

The only way you are going to get rid of these goons is to ignore them as they are still trying to extract the I&E as a stepping stone to further demands. Sadly, communication only encourages them! However, if you do feel you need to respond, simply add that your offer is based on your financial ability to pay and if it's not accepted within 14 days you will withdraw that offer it and use the money to repay your other creditors.

I understand that in your position you would have to be seen to be offering the "correct" advice and I understand and respect that. I also agree that prior to any court action an I&E is vital to help avoid further problems. But Sue's passed that stage and she is now dealing with the bottom feeders who go beyond the pale in their collection methods as all they want is results. They are not concerned with people like Sue's welfare or, particularly, where she gets the money to repay the debt, either. At this stage the I&E becomes nothing more than a test to see if they can still manipulate and extract information from of you. If they do they will keep on trying for more; but once they realise they can't then the game is up for them and they stop wasting their time trying.

Hi Sue I certainly understand how you feel regarding your comments about policeman (my Grandad was a Policeman) but, sadly, much of the respect and regard we used to have for such offices have long since been diminished due to the changing remit of those offices in today's World. However, it's those inbuilt feelings you have described that your creditor is trying to play on in trying to extract a higher payment through a mixture of guilt and fear. I have a lot of time for Sequenci but his "disheartened" feelings here are misplaced. If you provide an I&E (particularly to this Solicitor - Google them!) they will pester the life out if you in future as they know they can manipulate you with fear. CAG is littered with people who have "tried to do the right thing" but have suffered at the hands of unreasonable creditors. Ultimately, you have to do what YOU think is best; but please don't make the mistake of thinking your creditor is trying to be, or will be in future, reasonable. It's a numbers game to them and, sadly, the tactics they use of fear and coercion will continue to work and be used as long as they reap rewards. As I previously stated on this thread, you need to keep hold of the facts of your circumstances and understand your creditor will be aware they have gone as far as they can (legally) with the CO as they know they won't get an OFS under your circumstances. Creditors, contrary to what many people think, aren't, either, vindictive; they are businesses and as such they won't waste money chasing you through court for an OFS when they know the chances of obtaining one are virtually zero. But as businesses, if they thought they had any chance of getting an OFS you would have been in Court long ago and you wouldn't still be being pestered for a fairly irrelevant I&E.

Hi Sue It's just further BS on their part. If they had any chance of actually obtaining an OFS they would have moved on it long ago. All they have left is to try and extract the biggest repayment they can, but they are frustrated because you aren't playing ball. The fear they are trying to instil by threatening to go for an OFS, in order to extract the I&E, pretty much gives the game away. So stay resolute and don't give them something to work off trying to gain a larger repayment. My advice would be to follow Abrigadier and also state that if they aren't willing to now accept your repayment you see no point in wasting further time continuing to correspond with them. They're chancer's pure and simple.

Just sent you a PM. Any questions let me know

The bad new is that yes they can do this and CO's seem pretty much unstoppable at the moment. And you should always attend Court to explain your circumstances and make an offer of payment to try and stop the Order being made. The good news, however, is that as the property is jointly owned, but the debt is solely owned, then the Charging Order can only be registered as a "Restriction" against your property. All this means is that the Creditor with the CO has to be notified when you sell the house; it has no legal powers to enforce repayment as people are becoming more and more aware of. You will need, though, to explain this to your Solicitor if you do sell as many are still under the impression there is a legal obligation to pay off these debts from the proceeds of your sale. There isn't.

What has likely happened is the finance company arranged a "Personal Loan" for the car to be purchased and not "Hire Purchase". With a Personal Loan the Finance Company has no legal interest in the vehicle as the loan hasn't been secured against the car. Your friend is, therefore, free to do with the car as she wishes. If your friend, however, had bought the car under Hire Purchase then the car would have either been repossessed (or a court order for it's possession sought if a third of the payments had been met) before any CCJ or subsequent Charging Order would have been sought.

Tinkerman Firstly, I'm glad you feel better! Your experience at the hands of the Court system, however, is certainly not unique as many others on here will confirm. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who wouldn't feel obliged to pay these Muppet's after all they have put you through after you managed to sell up without paying them.

If you sold up and gave them no time to object, but are still paying the CCJ, then they aren't really going to be too concerned as you are paying them anyway? I understand the "no more hassle" concern but if they were rogues why would you want to pay them now you have moved?

Firstly, you have to do what let's you sleep at night. But the reality is that the creditor wouldn't get an OFS even if it tried (which it won't). My ex tried to avoid a CO with an offer of repayments but the creditor ignored her offer and went for the CO regardless. She was so angry she hasn't spoken to them since (let alone pay anything to them) and nothing has happened despite a few initial "further enforcement" threats. As Sequenci will attest, having children at home stops them in their tracks which is why they wouldn't try. As has previously been trotted out on here; only 0.3% of CO's progress to an OFS. Those that do aren't for consumer debts on one home families. The whole action, IMHO, is based on fear and making debtors believe they are about to be made homeless. If you take that fear out of the equation and actually investigate the facts then you will see you haven't got an awful lot to worry about now as the worst is over. And if the CO is only against you and not your partner then they are stuffed even further.

Tinkerman Your creditor can easily find out from your credit file who your other debtors are secured or otherwise, so don't worry. Sadly, from personal experience and also talking to others the court doesn't seem to concerned if your other creditors have been contacted or not. But it's always wise to attend to make sure your creditor doesn't get anything granted in your absence (like interest being added etc.). After that, if, as you say, the CO can only be registered as a Restriction then I would forget about paying your instalments as it hasn't helped you up to now and there is nothing your creditor can do regarding an OFS in your circumstances.

I understand that's what happens I was just wondering if they made any kind of objection? I, also, wouldn't be so quick to assume they are saying nothing because they have a CCJ (unless you are still making repayments to them?) Whilst a CCJ technically doesn't expire, it does drop off your credit file after six years and if you haven't been paying anything to the creditor they don't waste further effort or money chasing you again.

Can I ask how the creditor on the single debt reacted (if at all) when you sold up?

Not really if the property is your main home, but do understand a Restriction doesn't prevent a creditor applying for an OFS. What usually happens is that, after receiving their CO, the creditor will come after you hard as it believes you will fear losing your home and they can extort money from you through this fear. But anyone who has read up on this site knows they aren't going to go for an OFS on consumer debt as they won't get one. We ignored them completely and they went away. I'd advise you to do the same.

gprit You do still have a Charging Order. But a CO against a sole debtor on jointly owned property can only be registered as a Restriction as it is registered against your "Beneficial Interest" in the property not on the property itself. . And the Creditor having a CO doesn't stop them from pursuing repayment by other means, either. However, the problem for the Creditor having obtained a CO is that it's virtually impossible for them to obtain an OFS for consumer debt as courts have much wider discretion and, if the property is your main residence, then it's a no goer. I've argued on other threads that a creditor going to these lengths is primarily trying to prioritise THEIR debt over other creditors as a CO is even settled before Bankruptcy debts. But once they do this they, IMHO, back themselves into a corner as they, realistically, have nowhere else to go? My Ex hasn't spoken to her creditor since the day she received her CO over a year ago (despite the initial "further enforcement" threats). Nothing has happened because they won't waste money on something they aren't going to win.

Hi Clynite Yes they can keep rejecting your offer and they will. At this stage they want the "security" of a CO over other creditors and, as you have seen on these pages their is very little you can do to stop this process going through. But take my advice and now simply ignore them as the CO is the end of the end for them in being able to coerce repayment. They aren't going to get an OFS so sit tight and stay calm.

Solicitors have to be, by the nature of their profession, assertive or they don't survive. You just have to match that anyway you can and learn not to fall for the tricks they use. Believe nothing of what you hear and half of what you see and you won't go far wrong with Solicitors!

Email your offer, making clear it is all you can offer, then you wait for them to contact you.