Last weekend in the early hours of Sunday morning, about 3.30 a.m. According to the next door neighbours cctv. I had a "Order of Adjournment of Bankruptcy Petition" posted by "some big bloke" seen running away from my house. It concerns a debt from Capital 1 altogether for £787 with their charges added on. I had a Statatuary Demend in Jan 2010, . I ignored that, as I had asked the previous August for a CCJ request. Lowells were behind it. as they had ignored my CCJ req, I thought they could not take any further action. So I called their Bluff, and ignored it... but sent a registered letter reminding them that they had not complied, and issuing a new CCJ req,, Now, it looks like they have called my bluff.. I have to go to court on thursday. Is the fact that they have not sent my CCJ request a good enough defence... fussalot.

Diddy.. Its early...... what are CFA lawyers /:confused: fussey

So in order to SUM UP.. D,J ruled that the prescribed t&c were probabably in the accompanying leaflet. D.J ruled that D.N. was sent and was O.K. ( without seeing it ) D.J dissmissed previous court order saying that the documents were to be produced. ( saying that he had already dealt with them ). So no documents have been produced, ie, Notice of Assignment. Default notice. agreement with the prescribed terms. D.J. ignored evidence in the " Raw Data " log supplied by Cabrots, that , " application form re-scanned and sent." regarding my CCA request. If I appeal... what is the likelyhood of success.. pos, maybe, good very good. sir fus.

O.K. time to stop sulking....... Heres how it went. Last hearing d.j. was shown that the T&C's were not the correct ones as Cabrot were saying they were. At the Last Hearing he said that subject to Cabot supplying the correct T&C's from the Agreement, then he was "Happy that the (application form ), "agreement", was properley executed.. I had argued that, the T&C's show the wrong APR and Default charges. these being £18, ( they had allways been £24. on the statements.). I also pointed out that an entry from the "raw data action log", stated that the T&C's sent, were from Sept '06. Cabot put in a W.S. that they had investigated this matter, unfortunatley they were only able to put forward the T&C's supplied by the original creditor, who has now supplied the correct ones. Low and behold !,,, Cabot produced T&C's stating the charges would be £24.. However, These T&C's were for Visa platinum, and Visa premium accounts, and printed proudly on the end was, " MONUMENT" also, the APR was incorrect. They should have been for just a "PROVIDIAN Visa" I showed his nibs this, and stood back.... Yes I see Mr Fussalot.. BUT. They would have been supplied at the time so I will accept that the agreement is "GOOD", AND,, AND, I will not be returning to this again, is that clear ?.. ( OUCH ) Oh well, here we go again.... I have not been shown a valid Notice of Assignment, in the Deed of Sale there is no mention that it applies to this account. After he asked Cabrots "man", who explained that as they purchase up to 5oo accounts in any one time it is not practical to print each account as it could be against the Data Protection Act.... D.J....Mr. Fussalot, are you seriously expecting Cabot to print 5oo names and accounts, and then blank them out execpt for yours ? No sir, I just wanted the proof of a Notice of Assignment. We look at the letter in the trial bundle from Barclays to Cabrot ( see post 357 ) for the letter they used in court. Do you accept that a sale was made mr Fussalot ? Well, not from that letter sir.... Oh, and why would that be not acceptable to you ? Well its looks to me like a photo copy of what Cabrot could have just printed off, as there is no headed "Barclays" on what is supposed to be their letter, And I can't see a name from Barclays ...... He then hit the roof............... Mr Fussalot.. ( raised voice ).. I will not have you come in here alleging Fraud with no evidence to substansiate it. YOU WERE SENT NOTICE OF THIS ASSIGNMENT AND THAT IS THE END OF THIS MATTER........ I do apologise... but I have to go to work.. I will continue later. fussey. Mine should have been PROVIDIAN But he carried on

Hiya all. sorry I Lost.. feel like I let everyone down. Same judge, same bias. He agreed with Cabrot. Heres a short version as I have to go to work now.. Don't need to see NoA it , "would be included in the sale agreement." Shedule of accounts below, ( blank ) Yes Fussey " as I said it would already be in the Sale agreement". Did you receive a D. N. fussey? well I cant find it I dont know if one was sent..... Well on the "balance of probabilities", " I am happy that they would have sent you one, and in the absence of you not knowinh or being able to prove otherwise, I will accept that one was sent.... Judgement for claimant...... sir I wish to appeal...... WHY you have accepted no evidence frm Cabrot except when you asked their representative. You have accepted "unlawfull rescission" as NO D.N. I have already said fussey, In the balance of probabilities, I believe that they would have sent one. You must remember that yu are dealing with LARGE crtedit card companies who know what they need to do........ Appeal denied. Good afternoon. I am shaken.... and most definatley STIRRED...... Fussey. One Good Thing, they asked for £2650. costs judge said NO ( Small Claims)

V.J.

OH WELL, In court later on this morning (Thurs,,), Guess what ., received a third witness statement yesterday from Cabrot. Saying that the dates on the Deed of Sale for the Deed of Assignment were incorrect, and that , "after requesting my supervisor to supply the correct signed , offer for sale letter. we now have the correct date of sale." Then a copied letter saying, "1 We refer to the account sale agreement (such account sale agreemnt, as from time to time amended supplimented or novated being herein called the account sale agreement ) dated 12th Oct 2005 and made between ourselves and yourselves. 2 Terms defined in the account sale agreement shall bear the same meaning herein. 3 We hereby offer to sell you on the 27th September 2006 (the offer date). the accounts (the accounts) listed in the schedule hereto and notify you that : (i) the aggregate Face amounts of the accounts listed in the schedule hereto as at 21 september2006 (which shall constitute the determination date for the purpose of this offer) was XXXX blanked out XX (ii) the offer price (inclusive of a discount of XXX is £XXX This is just a copy A4 sheet at the bottom it says, Yours faithfully' ( scribble ) For and on behalf of Barclays bank plc. There is no headed "Barclays or their address " on the letter, and no printed name for the scribbled signature. Then, there is a blank sheet headed, " Schedule. (list of accounts)." So still no direct evidence to my account... wish me luck fussey

Allan, I think that just about sums up Cabrot. :grin: If only the D.J's could be made aware of how they operate. AND. AND.... the O.F.T faced up to its responcibilities...... If only... fussey

Hiya All, Just a quick thought As Cabrot have previously quoted case law on Law of Contract. Can the APPLICATION FORM be defined as "an offer to treat". Then, as they sent the card, it would be "assumed" that they accepted BUT, without prior T&C's being discussed ? I have read somewhere on their conditions that "English Law" will prevail.. " DISCUSS " fussey

Hiya. Is the public barristor access what it "says on the tin" will he cast his eye over your case and give an opinion? If so how do you start. and how much does it cost? fussey

Bye The Bye............... Does anybody know where I can get to see a copy of.; .Goode Consumer Credit Law and Practise ( issue 30 ? ) Some excerpts have been quoted by Cabrots with poor quality photo copies. I fear they may have "cherry picked" the parts they need. My local county reference library does not have it. At about £980 a copy I can see why.......... fuss

I totally agree......... We cannot and must not go down to their " Sneaky tricks". Should we start going down that route, ( much as it may be tempting to do so ). Then there are no longer any "sneaky tricks", as it then becomes "Fair Game" for both sides. With proper thought and facts, their "sneaky tricks" will ALLWAYS be shown up in the courts. Whether the D.J.'s will take heed is another matter.! sir Fussalot

Patrickq...... A BARRISTOR.?.................. :eek: fussey

Patrickq, Thank you for that, I can see there must have been a lot of hard work in your reply.. very much appreciated. That was going to be my "tack". Politely explain that he must take into consideration that Cabrot have now furnished 3 lots of T&C's. None of which were attached to the application form. Contrary to the Wilson descision. Should he then dismiss my argument, to please put on record why the Wilson case was not accepted. I wonder if I had showed the wrong document, the D.J. would have said "next time you come, see where you went wrong and bring the proper doc's."? Thanks. fussey

Patrickq.,.... At last! What EVERYONE on this site knew....... Finally about to be publicised... to the wider GOOD. This can only help.. Cheers, fussey

Hiya All, I need some Help... I have put new witness evidence in as directed by the D.J. But, I have not Quoted the actual regulation and section numbers etc. Would it be advisable to supply these so that The D.J can look them up more quickley to see my point. AND:, as he has told me in NO Uncertain Terms that he would NOT look at the validity of the Agreement again. ( subject to Cabrot supplying the correct T&C's,, which by the way, they haven't ..)...... How could I get him to look at Wilson. ( I am assuming that Wilson still has "superiority", over the, " Manchester case", as the D.J. frequently refered to .) ALSO:, if, I engaged a solicitor to "speak for me", would I get his costs to me back, if I won ? sir Fuss.

Hiya All, Tonster, yes I thought is it possible to write to the D.J. pointing this out and supplying the "Quote" of Wilson. Providing I also wrote to Cabrots with a copy of the letter.? as this seems to be an "Error in Law". On the other hand,, I don't want to upset him before I have to :-| s.f.

Hadit The very one That' saved an hour or two... s.f.

Tonster Yep will be same D.J. he "reserved it for himself" I was thinking along the lines of , You did say that save for the T&C's from Cabot to be correct, if you are going to accept the application form as the agreement, I would respectfully ask that you make a note of why you have accepted it, in the court notes". The T&C's that Cabrot have NOW supplied are still NOT correct. That's now three different lots from them. Plus with the original D.J. (this will be the 3rd hearing ). He originally made an order for the original documents to be brought to court. e.g. The agreement, the D.N. and the DoA Needless to say Cabrot have never produced.. And I think that under CPR rules, " where a case centres on a written agreement, then that agreement should be available at the hearing" I'm still looking for the exact rule. s.f.

Incidentally, could someone please P.M. Vint with this post The D.J. accepted from Cabrot that the application form WAS signed by Providian. This being the stamp that said, " PROVIDIAN 3 NOV 2002 ". they had quoted from proff Roy Goode, who said that a signature cuold be a badge or a mark and not a name.. [30.109] (the formalities of Agreement) What constitutes a signature: Any writing placed on the document by a party with the intention of authenticating it will suffice, whether it be his name his initials or even a cross a mark or impression. Similarly the medium employed is not material. The signature may be by pen or pencil, by facsimile stamp or any other form of marking. He goes on, In general law the position of the signature is irrelevant, it may appear anywhere on the document as a whole. The CCA 1974 requires the signature to be effected in compliance with the agreement regulations. Regulation 6(3) prescribes the mode of signature of regulated consumer credit and consumer hire agreements. Sch 5 contains the various forms of signature box applicable to different types of agreement. The debtor or hirer must sign within the required signature box, the creditor or owner or his agent must sign outside that signature box. Quoted from : Goode:Consumer Credit Law and Practice (this was a page photocopied from the book, and given by Cabrots.) fussey

Beau, your point is correct. Cabrots are so cocksure that they do not need to supply any "doc's" They are missing the point completeley I have a letter from Morgans saying they do not need to issue a D.N. nor did the O.C. as they are only after collcting the arrears Is this a tacit statement that one was not issued. 3 court hearings not produced or aknowleged any sign of a D.N. Now if the agreement was good IF then the mimimum payment levels would mean its ( the whole amount they are claimimg ).. not fully payable unti 2013 s.f.

Tonster D.J. didn't want to know, went thro' the terms and cons Cabrots supplied at the time when I said the prescribed terms weren't there. Found a paragraph about interest rates said well whats that sir fussy? I said there should be the rate of payment. He went thro again until he found the part about payments shall be monthly, said well then? I then queried the default charges being £18 in the T&C's I told him they were not the proper T&C's as I could prove I had allways been charged £24. He replied (sarcastic), sir fussey, has it ever occured to you they may have gone up? No sir, not when these are supposed to be the basis of the agreement, AND if you look below, it says to vary any charges 30 days notice will be given He was Not amused...... He then told Cabrots to sort this out for the next hearing, BUT,, sir fussalot, apart from that, I WILL NOT LOOK AGAIN AT THE AGREEMENT Do you understand, I will not go back to your argument on the validity of the agreement, that is finished..... s.f.

Now then here's a thing for you " LEGALS " Cabrot showed T& C's for the original hearing purporting to be the originals that applied to my "application" form. I showed the court that they weren't, as the APR and Default charges were incorrect. The "kindly" D.J. then asked Cabrot to "look into it" for next time. They have now sent me the new witness statement saying that," they were only showing what the original creditor had sent them" But they have now sent ( copy attached for me to see ). the "original T&C's. Now in the middle of all this, I had SAR'd the original creditors ( Barclays ) who replied with a letter, ( dated before the "new" T&C's were produced ) That they did not hold ANY CORRESPONDENCE for this account, and the rest of my request would be sent to me by the appropriate department. Well all that came was a list of the default charges and dates applied. SO, If Barclays ( the original creditor ) did not hold any info' on my a/c. Then where have Cabrot got the T&C's from.? Could I insist that they can NOT be used as evidence? s.f.

VJ. what can I say.......... It did seem to make more sense on the THIRD reading.... i think I can see were we are going. I will read it thro' once or twice until I can fully understand it. But thank you, it will "stop it dead", if its done correctly. s.f.

Thanks, will study Carey. VJ agreement is page 7 post 134 No still no NoA. fussey