Hello everyone, I'm not sure if this is the correct place to post this...hope so. I wonder if I share a story, if anyone can offer advice please. 9 years ago, due to illness and family tragedy, my husband got into financial difficulty. Via the CCCS, token repayments to creditors were agreed an interest suspended. Since then, payments have increased in line with affordability. We have reapid a considerable amount, but still have a fair way to go. I know some will say, 'why didn't you try to go the non-cca, unenforceable route' but, all apart from one were helpful (I did get SD set aside re Arrow Global as they wouldn't play ball) so did not want to pursue the fight with the others. Fast forward to now and our circumstances have taken a turn for the worse and, due to a reduction in income (husband self-employed and work slowed, loss of income due to ongoing health issues and hospital visits), we can no longer afford the current repayment levels, so we have written to the remaining creditors to explain the situation (and included an up-to-date I&E). The one I would like to ask advice on is Idem. ORIGINAL DEBT TO MBNA APPROX £7800 APPROX MBNA PAID £4400 APPROX PAID TO IDEM SO FAR £2000 Original Creditor MBNA agreed a repayment programme that, provided we kept to until they were repaid, they would leave us alone (which they did). We continued the payments, then in September 2012, we were advised that they had sold the remaining debt to Idem Capital Securities Ltd, but that the agreement would continue (which it did). We began paying the same payments to Idem but, we cannot afford these now. Idem has written (see letter C) saying that they need express consent to process the information in our letter and I&E, either in writing or by a phone call. As we won't deal with any of this at the telephone, the signed confirmation is the only option. DO WE HAVE TO SIGN AND RETURN THIS? WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS IF WE DO? WHAT IF WE DON'T? What we don't want is for them to 'get heavy' with us, because we can't pay what we can't currently afford. If the repayment programme with MBNA was in place and a default notice never issued as a result (don't have one in file anyway), when the debt was sold to Idem, did that terminate the account and could Idem take us to Court if we can't agree on continued repayments? Any suggestions on how to proceed? Thanks Sorry, forgot how to attach copy letter, it's been so long since I posted on here!! Think this should work. Didn't-too small, sorry. Hoping this works. Can someone let me know if you can see this copy ok. If not, I'll try the other suggested method. Stigman, Thanks for the response. Yes we do have our own house (with equity, I'm afraid). You said send a CCA request (to Idem I presume). Is that n preference to a SAR (to MBNA)? Also, do you know anything about the request to sign the 'express consent' letter and whether we have to do this in order for them to look at our chnge of circumstances/I&E? I've got all the MBNA statements so I can look at them with regard to charges and a possible reclaim. How far can I go back?

Hi, Thanks for your response. We had an agreement with MS but, when they went to Goldfish, they defaulted us and sold to Cabot. We've just been paying them ever since (they continued the existing agreement we'd had and we gradually increased payments). Have't checked Credit file to see what's currently on there (this was originally defaulted in 2008 so I think may still be on there as agreed repayment programme? Cabot haven't sent any statements at all. ..however, from the last letter we'd had April2013, the balance was what it should be (no interest ever added to date as we'd kept to repayments).

Hi, I wonder if anyone could help with advice regarding the above debt my husband has. Financial problems arose through genuine circumstances around 8 years ago. There were a number of creditors, most of which were very helpful in agreeing minimal repayment programmes, to which we have gradually increased payments as circumstances improved. Total debt has reduced considerably but, at current levels, still a few years to go before being 'free'. Recently, my husband unexpectedly came into a small sum, so he decided he would try to get one of the creditors to accept a reduced payment in full and final settlement, so that it was one less to deal with. This was a Morgan Stanley Card from around 2003 with agreed repayment programme that went to Cabot (received a few Goldfish letters in between). Cabot declined what was a fair offer (with this they would have had in total over 80% of the original cabot debt figure repaid) which means that, assuming we continue to pay at the current level there will still be over 4 years left. As we know Cabot would have purchased the debt for such a small amount and we've already repaid that many times over, he was naturally a bit put out. I did try some time ago (2009) to SAR Morgan Stanley but, after receiving responses from Barclaycard, I only got old statement copies, nothing else, then a letter saying the account was transferred by Morgan Stanley to another creditor prior to MS business being sold to Barclaycard so they hadn't owned it. Would it be too late to query the debt now, as we've been paying for so long? I've looked at old paperwork more thoroughly and, we received no written letter from OC to say Cabot were taking over the debt, only the Cabot 'hello' letter (p1-3) with a page supposedly from Goldfish but clearly annotated down the side as p4 showing no card number or balance on this 'Cabot' NOA. We just never queried it before. Could we at this late stage withhold payments pending proof of legal right to chase the debt and ask for the CCA agreement to show they have the right paperwork to claim on? Do you think it would be worth the hassle? Any thoughts on the SAR fiasco?....Can't get info from OC as they pass to Barclaycard, who don't want to know? Any thoughts/suggestions apreciated.

Hi underdog13 My second post re Statutory Demand they issued led on from this one (not sure how to link it..... Stat demand - ARROW GLOBAL LLC ***WON + COSTS ***) Perhaps someone could link it so you can read what went on ?

Just for info, haven't heard a thing from AG since my 'go ahead if you dare' letter (see post 12/5/10)....long may it continue.

Not sure if you've looked at this yet...it's scanned copies of all MBNA application/agreements in year of issue order (I just found it). If you can match the one you've been provided, you can see what years' MBNA application it is....it is clearly then not only an application if it doesn't have the required T&C's but is from a period AFTER your card was issued. http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/609-mbna-agreementsapplication-forms

You haven't upset me at all Dannybro...I merely was trying to say you need to be sure of your own arguments as you just don't know what will be thrown up in Court (many have had bad experiences) so you need to be prepared. This same advice was given to me when I had an SD pending and it made me doubly sure to check any quote or advice given so I knew how to defend any AG's possible arguments thrown up in Court. You are more than welcome to use ANY info in any posts I've made. Regards. Lorri-Croft

Hi Dannybro, Your card was originally A&L This from MBNA website: As you may be aware, MBNA has been providing the Alliance & Leicester credit card since 2002. However, Alliance & Leicester is now part of the Santander Group, and our relationship will be coming to an end. This means we are going to replace your card with one that carries the MBNA name. Did you say you applied for the original A&L card in 1998? If prior to 2002, T&C's should be from A&L? Perhaps someone may clarify this for you as I do not know. If this is the case, all you have received is a copy of a pre-contractual application form and more recent T&Cs (not even from the OC). Valdez has offered good info with regard to Default and NOA. Prior to terminating an agreement and taking further action(which includes passing to a DCA), a creditor must issue a Default Notice (in the correct format and with sufficient time for service). Did you receive a NOA saying debt was being passed to Clarity? Did you receive one from Clarity saying it was being passed to AG? My best advice is it's no good just using someone else's similar defence (this is good advice I was given). You must UNDERSTAND your own argument so that you are in a position to defend it. I spent hours and hours reading on this site and also reading case law references suggested, and printed off the case laws to which I referred in my SD from BAILII, together with relevant sections of the CCA, the OFT debt collection guidelines and Law of Proprty Act 1925 so that the Judge could see I'd done my research. I was lucky that AG did not attend but, if they had, I knew what my arguments would be and I believe, I would have been in a position to defend as I'd done the research. I have to say that, I had already SAR'd the OC successfully, so I knew exactly what paperwork AG would be able to come up with in advance. I knew there was no original CCA (only the precontractual app), and found no record of a Default being issued (had just had a rep programme agreed when Monument debts were sold off in bulk to Compucredit) so I had the 'heads up' there. However, they are still being persistent (see update post on my thread).

Just a further update for anyone interested. Had to threaten AG with legal action before they sent cheque but it finally arrived. All went quiet for a bit, until a letter came with a copy of 'Rapid Reply Card' application and T&C's (not original ones...£12 charges showing). Just told them they were still in breach, would not correspond further until they provided a true copt of the executable agreement and that, if they tried to take to court with an application form rather than an executable credit agreement, I would make the Judge aware that I'd brought this to their attenion but they had ignored the fact and I would vigorously defend on the same basis as the successful SD Set Aside. Also added ps. need to provide original executable CCA agreement in Court. Goes to show they don't want to give up....wait to see what next. Dannybro, I'll post on your thread shortly.

Thanks for your prompt response Supersnooper. Can you (or anyone else) answer my question regarding the paperwork they have provided (Rapid Reply Card and T&C's-curent???) and their obligations under the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983? I would like to know definitively so I can include in my response ie. 'whilst you have fulfilled....under...it's not a CCA with prescribed terms' OR 'you have NOT fulfillled.... because...'. Any response received.

Following advice above (and prior to taking any further steps), now received a letter from AG, included copy of a 'RAPID REPLY CARD' and T&C's (Current?). http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s156/shaunieman/DCA/CCF21122009_00000.jpg http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s156/shaunieman/DCA/CCF23092009_00000.jpg They feel they have satisfied my S78.1 CCA request and now want repayment proposals or will continue legal action. Does the paperwork above cover their obligations under the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983? If so, does this mean they can continue legal action? I realise this is an 'application form ' which I believe, is unenforceable as it does not 'embody' all the relevant terms required under the CCA. Am I correct? So, if they choose to go further, I can use as one of the defence arguments? (along with the other SD counter-arguments I put, like no default,NOA etc.) What I need to do is compose a suitable response (once clear on the legal facts) to try to prevent them from taking these steps. I've already had to (successfully) defend a SD and was hoping for a break! Any advice/help very much appreciated.

Hi, You helped me considerably to get an SD set aside against Arrow Global at the end of September. The judge awarded costs against them and a deadline to pay. As you might expect, no funds were forthcoming but I haven't had time to do anything about it yet. It's the principle more than the money (which was less than £300) that they should be brought to book over their blatant abuse of process that brings me back on here. Could anyone tell me what are my options/what is the best route to take to enforce this order? Thanks. (Sorry-titile should read Non-payment!!)

Thanks lillywhite and MandyJayne for your congratulations. Shows what can be achieved with a little informed guidance from people willing to help you follow the correct steps. MJ,Good luck with your SD. Hope it goes as well for you.

Thanks everso 42Man and Shadow for your congratulations and valuable input. Can't stop smiling!!!!!

GOOD NEWS!!! Went to Court for hubby's SD hearing today. Judge commented on the affadavit being clear and well researched and asked where I'd got the information. Showed the 'pile' of paperwork I'd prepared (OFT Guidelines, LoP Act 1925, CCA 1974 and later amendment, which I'd got from OPSI and BAILLI). Judge read affadavit and said, 'I've seen this argument a number of times recently and, although in instances there may indeed be a debt, the (creditor) still need their paperwork in place. The other side have not turned up which is to your benefit. I am granting the set aside.' We asked him to look at the Statement of Costs (he reduced the amount a bit, saying we could either ask for LIP costs for research OR loss of earnings but not both) but granted reduced costs against Arrow Global!!! He then said 'they are not going to be happy about that!' Thanks so much to all who've had input in this, particularly 42man, Docman, the Shadow. Your support and assistance was invaluable. Now we'll wait for the paperwork to be sent and see what happens with regard to the costs.........