CEL 2017 ANPR PCN PAPLOC Now Claimform - Burger King, West Forest Gate, Wokingham, RG40 2AT *** Claim Discontinued***

[BStealth]

Hello all,

 

Today I've received a 'LETTER BEFORE ACTION - CLAIM FOR DEBT' from Civil Enforcement Limited for a supposed breach of parking 32 months ago. They haven't provided me any evidence to my address which I've lived at and been registered to for the past 24 months. 

 

They have sent me a form to reply to which is asking for name, address, contact number, email and to comment whether I owe the debt, i am getting debt advice and another section where i can ask them for further documents or information. 

 

At this stage I cannot confirm that I had parked at this premises. Being a Burger King I have visited with the children in the past when I lived in Wokingham.

 

Seeking advice of next steps please?

 

 

1 Date of the infringement

04/12/2017

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date]

Unknown

 

3 Date received

03/08/2020
 

 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?]

Unknown
 

 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event?

None provided
 

 

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal]

No
 

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up

N/A
 

 

7 Who is the parking company?

Civil Enforcement Limited
 

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town]

Burger King, West Forest Gate, Wokingham, RG40 2AT
 

 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

None

 

[BStealth]

Thank you for your prompt response. Do you have reference to the SAR document template? Thank you!

 

But also, if I ask for a DSAR, I think need to provide them with my contact details or shall I just input my address which they posted to?

[BStealth]

I'm sorry im really not familiar with the use of ericbrother or PAPLOC  

[BStealth]

How's this?


To whom it concerns, I am in receipt of your letter dated the 3^rd August 2020 and have noted its contents.

 

You state that I should consider this to be a letter before action. Unfortunately for you I cannot accept this shoddily thrown together piece of tripe to be a LBA as it fails miserably to come anywhere near an LBA as required under the revised Civil Procedure Regulations and so would expect a court to summarily dismiss any claim later made by you or your client on that basis.

  

So, to make sure that there is no misunderstanding, I deny that any monies are owed to Civil Enforcement Limited by myself. The same applies to the inflated amount of the claim, the POFA and contract law are very clear on this point and again plenty of examples of dismissed claims are in the public domain.

 

Your fondness for misquoting the decision of PE v Beavis makes it look like you have never read the full judgement but like the other ‘rent a threat’ see it as a panacea for justifying any old codswallop you care to trot out.

 

It’s not wise or in the interests of Civil Enforcement Limited to continue with this matter as they have no cause for action, and I shall seek a full cost recovery order for any civil claim made under the unreasonableness criteria.

[BStealth]

Hehehe, i dont like to sit on things!!!

So I've made the changes you suggested.

 

On another forum, they advised emailing all of this to not waste any further of my time.

Do you have any objections to emailing this letter and the DSAR?

[BStealth]

Highly unlikely that I'd have any trace of this i've been with 3 banks since then and no doubt i would have used cash and not kept a simple BK receipt! 

[BStealth]

DSAR Written, Snotty Letter written... 

Awaiting ink... will post tomorrow and update this thread in due course!

[BStealth]

[BStealth]

Ok thank you so much.

Can I ask what im expecting in return from them?

[BStealth]

Hi Community, me again!

So they responded to my DSAR I sent on 18th Aug, They responded on the 9th Sept. They haven't responded to my snotty letter yet.

 

In summary of the DSAR.

Offence date: 4th Dec 2017
From: 04/12/17 16:16:43 to 17:29:40
Offence: Exceeded maximum 60 minutes free parking

Fine: £100 or £60 within 14 days

First letter date: 02/07/2018

First PCN letter date: 02/07/2018

(this is 8 months post offence date)

Second letter date: 05/09/2018 (wrong address)

Letter stating price has gone up to £140 and if not paid, will be passed to collection agents.

 

Third letter date: 31/01/2020 (wrong address)

ZZPS Limited debt collector. Price has now gone to £170.

 

Fourth letter date: 14/02/2020

ZZPS Limited debt collector. Price remains at £170

Fifth and final letter which was sent to my correct address:  03/08/2020
CEL, letter before court action 

 

[BStealth]

Ok, understood not fines but at this stage am I waiting for future correspondence from them and/or response to my snotty letter?

[BStealth]

Ok, upon a postcode search and location search 'burger king' and 'west forest gate' on the councils website there is nothing in relation to CEL or any parking planning applications. I will contact the council. 

[BStealth]

 i attach all 3 files from the council which date back to 1994.

They were unable to find anything else in relation to car parking permits or erection of ANPR cameras etc.

There is nothing else specific to CEL of which they can provide me.

 

35731.pdf 42365.pdf

41585.pdf

 

I have not heard back from CEL in response to my letter i sent.

[BStealth]

To update, still no response from CEL to my snotty letter. Have they vanished.... hmmmm.... doubt it!

[BStealth]

Morning,

 

Received a letter today dated 1/10/20.

DO NOT IGNORE - FINAL REMINDER BEFORE LEGAL ACTION, AMOUNT DUE £182

Dear sir/madam,

 

We previously sent you a letter before action in which you were advised that failure to response would result in legal action being commenced. However, we wish to provide you with a final opportunity to settle this matter before commencing legal action. If the amount due is not paid within 14 days of the date of this letter we will now issue legal proceedings, and the amount due will increase by over £75.

if you ignore this letter and fail to respond, proceedings will be issued against you and may increase your liability for costs.

Yours faithfully, 
Legal Team

CEL

 

Not worried. No letter of claim sent  . They've clearly not paid any attention to my snotty letter.

[BStealth]

no letters over the past week however the 14 day deadline was yesterday.

 

I happened to be away from home last week and so visited the location of the 'ticket'.

The ANPR camera is erected on the building of the burger king - Do they need planning for this?

 

The entry sign warning of parking restrictions is bent (by a vehicle I'd presume as its high level) and is partly covered by branches. No idea if this was the case years ago however it's possible to park without noticing the restrictions.

[BStealth]

To add to this, I still have heard nothing. 

[BStealth]

6 years since date of PCN, event or last correspondence? 

[BStealth]

Good morning,

 

This morning I have received a 'claim form' with a claim no. and claim date of 09/02/21.

 

Particular of claims:

Claim for monies relating to a parking charge for parking in a private car park managed by the claimant in breach of the terms + conditions (T+Cs). Drivers are allowed to park in accordance with T+Cs of use. ANPR camera and/or manual patrols are used to monitor vehicles entering + exiting the site. Debt + damages claimed the sum of £182.
Violation date: XX/XX/2017
Time in: 16:16 

Time out: 17:29
PCN Ref: XXXXX

Total due: £182
The claimant claims the sum of £228.35 for monies relating to a parking charge per above including 46.35 interest pursuant to s.69 of the county courts act 1984 rate of 8% pa from dates above to 08/02/21. Same rate to judgment or sooner payment daily rate to judgement 0.04 total debt and interest due £228.35. 

Amount claimed: £228.35
Court fee: £25
Legal costs: £50
Total amount £303.35


------------------------------

I know its quite an ask but what would the advice be here? I cannot confirm I overstayed but with ANPR its unlikely that they're wrong.

 

[BStealth]

Thanks for your prompt response. I really cannot be dealing with receiving a CCJ or even taking the risk of getting one due to my current situation. Sure, I've been unable to find any planning permission for the erection of the ANPR camera and signage but that doesn't deny the fact I was there, as the ANPR says so. 

I need to pay this but maybe I can reduce the cost in someway?

[BStealth]

Sorry for my ignorance but if I lose the case, I can still pay the final bill and NOT receive a CCJ?

[BStealth]

Nope, no letter of claim just the letter above in this thread of 1/10/20 

DO NOT IGNORE - FINAL REMINDER BEFORE LEGAL ACTION, AMOUNT DUE £182

[BStealth]

Thanks for all your help so far. 

 

I've completed the MCOL acknowledgement and I've prepared the CPR 31.14 Request, which I will post via recorded deliver tomorrow.

 

So my fundamentals for my defense are that I overstayed by 13minutes whilst I was feeding my daughter in the BurgerKing of which this CEL carpark is solely used for. Their is no planning permission to the councils knowledge and the signature is not clear. Also, the costs incurred are ludacris.

 

Is there any links which can help me build this defense?

 

Should I wait to submit defense or get it in early?

[BStealth]

Thanks for all your consistent help so far. You must be busy with people asking for help and as so I am grateful.

 

So to confirm my only two tasks are:
1. Send the CPR13.41 request via post

2. Prepare and upload defence.

 

Do I have to attend the court hearing in person/via zoom or is it decided behind closed doors?

[BStealth]

Defence TODAY? Claim form is dated 9th feb.

Do I not have 28 days to submit my defence being 9th March?