Caught shoplifting in Tesco

[carolwilson65]

Hi, if I explain the details then i'm hoping that someone could offer advice.

 

Me and hubby shop in my local Tesco every Saturday morning.

 

We go in together then he goes for his magazines while I walk around.

 

After 5 or 10 minutes we find each other and he puts the items he's picked up in the trolley,

 

I push the trolley coz it saves me using my walking stick, i'm registered disabled.

Then he goes off for other items and I also shop, we find it's quicker if we separate rather than shop together (iyswim)

 

We then find each other, head to the fruit & veg section and he has the shopping list so he asks if I've got items on the list.

If I have forgot something he fetches it while I find a checkout.

He meets me and asks if I remembered something else off the list,

 

if I say I forgot that, while I load the conveyor belt he gives me his wallet and any vouchers he has,

then fetches the last items we need.

 

At the checkout, because we have lots of the same things, 2 bread, 2 buns, 6 milk etc,

I just put one of each item on the belt and tell the checkout person that I have 2 or 3 or 6 of these items,

then it either goes in a bag or back in the trolley.

 

We get the total, I pay then give him his wallet back and I push the trolley and he carries the 5 or 6 bags we have.

 

Did this today as normal, but stopped by security passed the checkouts but not passed the cigarette kiosk or the alarms.

 

We were taken to the 'little room', the police were called, arrested us both and charged us both with shoplifting.

 

They were a couple of items I had forgotten about,

I realised as soon as he stopped me, but he wouldn't let me pay for them.

 

He said we'd done it the 2 weeks previously but the didn't have enough staff to stop us.

Obviously I denied this, I don't remember 'stealing or forgetting about' anything last week or any other time.

 

there are 2 questions - hubby wasn't with me when everything went through the checkout, only at the end.

Can he still be charged with shoplifting when he didn't see everything I put in the trolley?

 

Also, I take morphine for pain relief, I have arthritis, fibromyalgia, depression and memory problems.

I offered to pay for anything we'd forgot to pay for, but they insisted that the police were called.

If they think I've done it before, shouldn't they have stopped us then instead of 'letting us get away with it'?

 

They insisted that we be charged so we are at court in two weeks, which seems really quick.

 

Don't know where we stand or why it's so quick.

 

Any help/advice gratefully accepted, thanks

[dx100uk]

so you have def got court date from the police?

 

 

 

dx

[carolwilson65]

Yes, pc said to appear at local magistrates court on 7 July. I don't even know where it is or if we have to wear 'normal clothes' or good suit/dress. First time at court/in trouble

[BazzaS]

Hi, if I explain the details then i'm hoping that someone could offer advice.

 

Me and hubby shop in my local Tesco every Saturday morning.

 

We go in together then he goes for his magazines while I walk around.

 

After 5 or 10 minutes we find each other and he puts the items he's picked up in the trolley,

 

I push the trolley coz it saves me using my walking stick, i'm registered disabled.

Then he goes off for other items and I also shop, we find it's quicker if we separate rather than shop together (iyswim)

 

We then find each other, head to the fruit & veg section and he has the shopping list so he asks if I've got items on the list.

If I have forgot something he fetches it while I find a checkout.

He meets me and asks if I remembered something else off the list,

 

if I say I forgot that, while I load the conveyor belt he gives me his wallet and any vouchers he has,

then fetches the last items we need.

 

At the checkout, because we have lots of the same things, 2 bread, 2 buns, 6 milk etc,

I just put one of each item on the belt and tell the checkout person that I have 2 or 3 or 6 of these items,

then it either goes in a bag or back in the trolley.

 

We get the total, I pay then give him his wallet back and I push the trolley and he carries the 5 or 6 bags we have.

 

Did this today as normal, but stopped by security passed the checkouts but not passed the cigarette kiosk or the alarms.

 

We were taken to the 'little room', the police were called, arrested us both and charged us both with shoplifting.

 

They were a couple of items I had forgotten about,

I realised as soon as he stopped me, but he wouldn't let me pay for them.

 

He said we'd done it the 2 weeks previously but the didn't have enough staff to stop us.

Obviously I denied this, I don't remember 'stealing or forgetting about' anything last week or any other time.

 

there are 2 questions - hubby wasn't with me when everything went through the checkout, only at the end.

Can he still be charged with shoplifting when he didn't see everything I put in the trolley?

 

Also, I take morphine for pain relief, I have arthritis, fibromyalgia, depression and memory problems.

I offered to pay for anything we'd forgot to pay for, but they insisted that the police were called.

If they think I've done it before, shouldn't they have stopped us then instead of 'letting us get away with it'?

 

They insisted that we be charged so we are at court in two weeks, which seems really quick.

 

Don't know where we stand or why it's so quick.

 

Any help/advice gratefully accepted, thanks

 

There is no offence of "shoplifting " - shoplifting (IF guilty of it) is a form of theft.

 

Have you been charged with theft? Contrary to S1 of the Theft Act 1968?

 

(1) A person is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it; and “thief” and “steal” shall be construed accordingly.

 

If you (however it happened) removed articles without paying for them - they'll be able to show you "appropriated articles belonging to another".

The case will then hinge on if your intent was :

a) dishonest (and they will apply a test known as the Ghosh test, named after the case where it was set out), and

b) "to permanently deprive".

 

Were you interviewed at the police station? Under caution?

Were you offered access to legal advice?.

 

This is a criminal matter, and IF found guilty COULD result in a custodial sentence : I'm not saying this to frighten you but to stress why you are entitled to legal advice due to the potentially serious effects : my suggestion is that you should be looking at getting formal legal advice from a solicitor whose area of practice is criminal law - if funding is an issue you should qualify for legal aid.

[rebel11]

Hi carolwilson65

 

Welcome to CAG

 

Have you received any documentation from the police/court?

[renegadeimp]

Shoplifting rarely ever results in a custodial sentence unless the amount is a lor or the offender is habitual.

[BazzaS]

Shoplifting rarely ever results in a custodial sentence unless the amount is a lor or the offender is habitual.

 

True : I was pointing it out more to stress that the _potential_ entitles the OP to a solicitor, more so than e.g. a speeding charge.

 

"This is a criminal matter, and IF found guilty COULD result in a custodial sentence : I'm not saying this to frighten you but to stress why you are entitled to legal advice due to the potentially serious effects : my suggestion is that you should be looking at getting formal legal advice from a solicitor whose area of practice is criminal law - if funding is an issue you should qualify for legal aid."

[carolwilson65]

Can't remember what the lady pc said yesterday, but in the van on the way to the station (we sat in the middle seat coz pc said 'only criminals sit in the back' ) she thought we might get a caution or a fixed penalty notice. She gave us a lift back to our car and said 'I'm surprised it's going to court, don't forget to go to court and look for a solicitor'

[carolwilson65]

Hi carolwilson65

 

Welcome to CAG

 

Have you received any documentation from the police/court?

 

 

Hi rebel11, the desk sergeant gave us both a 'MG04A' form

[Conniff]

I'm not getting what taking Morphine or other medicines or indeed what being disabled has to do with it ??

[Hammy1962]

Worst 'I'm disabled', and poorly, so I should get away with it thread for a long time.

 

H

[renegadeimp]

They were a couple of items I had forgotten about,

I realised as soon as he stopped me, but he wouldn't let me pay for them.

 

----

 

Sadly thats the bog standard excuse e every shoplifter says.

[ScarletPimpernel]

Worst 'I'm disabled', and poorly, so I should get away with it thread for a long time.

 

H

 

On the other hand, cognitive difficulties are a common side effect of morphine. None of us here are in a position to decide whether it was a factor in this case, any more than the shop's security goons.

 

We try, on CAG, to be non-judgmental.

 

That doesn't mean that we think thieves should be allowed to get away with their crimes. On the contrary, but they should be dealt with by the criminal justice system, not RLP, whose only motivation is money.

 

The failure of the ciminal justice system to deal effectively with shoplifting is outside the scope of this forum.

[SabreSheep]

Only person that can say if the OPs medical conditions had an impact is a medical expert.

Therefore I might suggest you ask for (and unfortunately pay for) a report from yoru doctor highlighting how yor conditions and medication impact on the memory problems you have. You might be able to use that as a defense against *intent* or as *Mitigation* if you plead guilty.

 

How successful this would be, No idea. Seek professional legal advice

[old bill]

Fibromyalgia (FMS) is a disorder of the central nervous system which affects the body's ability to deal with pain, as well as the muscles and connective tissue. Cognitive impairment, memory issues and depression accompanying FMS are not uncommon. I have had FMS since September 2010 and can attest to the cognitive impairment and memory issues. Opiates, like morphine, can affect memory and cognitive functions, depending on the dosage.

 

Given the OP's medical history and the fact that Tesco staff freely admit there are issues as to the reliability of scanning tills, e.g. mis-scans, software malfunctions (scans, beeps, but does not register item), there is reasonable doubt. Also, the question of the security goon's competence is likely to arise. A mis-scan or software malfunction is not theft. If the goon says it is, then they need to be prepared to face some pretty stiff cross-examination if the OP and her husband are legally-represented. Bear in mind that the Ghosh Test will be applied and it will be a case of whether any reasonable person would consider what has happened is, in fact, theft or the reckless and ill-judged actions of a Tesco employee.

 

I would strongly advise the OP and her husband to ensure they are legally-represented for the court hearing.